Carrie Fisher on Leia

the official story is that the script guinness agreed to and signed up for had him surviving until the end. it was lucas who ultimately realised that kenobi's character would have little left to do after escaping the death star (where it was originally scripted he would escape, wounded) and he rewrote it so the character would die but live on spiritually to guide luke, through the force, like we see in the movie. the story goes that when lucas broke this news to guinness, he was angered by it. eventually though it was said he agreed to the subsequent change.

absolutely. and many more. i was just pointing out the ones i sought out myself.

 

I don't think we've ever gotten an official confirmation on the events surrounding the decision to kill Ben. Those two different versions always tend to persist, but I don't recall seeing anything that said for sure which one is true.

 

I don't think that Leia was a one-dimensional character. But I do wonder if she ever was a fully-dimensional character. The only one weakness we ever saw in Leia's personality was her anger. It helped her in ANH, but her anger, along with Chewie's, prevented Lando from saving Han in ESB.

But other than her anger, we never saw any other weaknesses in Leia's character. She came off too much as the empowered female cliche, which I believe prevented her from being completely rounded character.



Mark Hamill is right...based on the films, Han Solo IS cooler/more interesting than Luke Skywalker. He is the roguish character, the bad boy who deep down is good, that women fall for.


Han Solo tend to come off as too childish at times, for me to consider him as a "cool" character. In fact, I have a higher opinion of Luke.

 

Maybe unrelated, but did Hamill play in anything good after SW (well, apart from Village of the Damned, of course)?

 

He's the voice of the Joker in the animated Batman shows, and some of the animated movies. He was also in Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back.

 

he had a major part in The Big Red One which was well received. ive never seen it myself but its supposedly great.

just had a flick through of guinness' authorised biography and the only mention of it quotes his diary of the time, saying "irritated by George Lucas saying he hadn't made up his mind whether to kill off my part or not... a bit late for such decisions." doesn't make it any clearer but i see no reason, if it was alec's idea, for this to be spun the other way. its never been made secret that harrison ford insisted his character be killed off in ROTJ. if there were any truth that guinness had suggested it from the off i would imagine it would likely have been noted in the diary. but you're right, we dont know.

interestingly enough, guinness' reaction to seeing the movie (as noted in his own diary) was as follows:

"It's a pretty staggering film as spectacle and technically brilliant. Exciting, very noisy and warm-hearted. The battle scenes at the end go on for five minutes too long, I feel; and some of the dialogue is excruciating and much of it is lost in noise, but it remains a vivid experience. The only really disappointing performance was Tony Daniels as the robot - fidgety and over-elaborately spoken. Not that any of the cast can stand up to the mechanical things around them."

So he clearly liked the film, despite the fact he felt it was "very noisy", with "excruciating" dialogue infact, substitute Anthony Daniels as C3-P0 for Ahmed Best as Jar Jar Binks and you'd have an average prequel review.

 

It's very good that you're setting the record straight on Guinness! Because frankly there's been spun some strange tales over the years, probably by people wanting to belittle Lucas, which is not unheard of. A prime example is the story that Guinness insisted on killing off Obi-Wan, implying both that he wanted out of the franchise and that we have Guinness to thank for a brilliant plot twist in ANH.

First of all, this twist is very common in monomythic storytelling, the mentor that dies but comes back from the dead to guide the hero. Just see Gandalf in The Lord of the Rings, or Dumbledore in the Harry Potter books. Obi-Wan is one of those characters, for sure. As Guinness' diary states, Lucas clearly had this possible outcome in mind but didn't decide until the last minute.

Another brilliant source for information on this incident is J. W. Rinzler's The Making of Star Wars (2007). This book is largely built around Charles Lippincott's aborted attempt at doing a Star Wars documentary of sorts back in 1975-78, where he amassed an incredible amount of first-hand interviews with the cast and crew, in a time before Star Wars became a phenomenon.

From page 154 you can read about the Kenobi problem, which was born out of the fact that this character didn't really have anything to do after the escape from the Death Star. Plus, the Death Star seemed a little too easy to escape from, as Lucas said: "The villains were like tenpins. They just got knocked over." The solution to both problems was obvious: Kill Kenobi. This revision was made while on the Tatooine location in Tunisia, which was the production's first stop for filming.

Guinness was not thrilled with the change, which took him from being a hero in the movie's finale, to being killed off midway through. He said: "You mean I get killed, but I don't have a death scene?" Because, obviously, the other important element this introduced was the concept of death and the Force, where Kenobi would simply disappear and become one with the Force.

Sorry for the long post, but it's important to kill the myth that Guinness wanted Kenobi to die.

 

So he clearly liked the film, despite the fact he felt it was "very noisy", with "excruciating" dialogue infact, substitute Anthony Daniels as C3-P0 for Ahmed Best as Jar Jar Binks and you'd have an average prequel review.


I didn't care for either 3P0 or R2 when ANH first came out. And I found their adventures on Tatooine something of a bore. I still do. But my feelings for the two characters have changed.

 

I think you gotta keep in mind that Carie Fisher is spectacularly sarcastic lady. She has incredible wit and insight. And really, Leia is one-dimensional in the movies. Most notably in ANH and ROTJ. It's Fisher who adds that un-Padme'esque flair to her character. She saw Leia as the mouthy 1930's Capra like female heroine. She's mouthy and ballsy. That's all. It's Fisher who fleshes her out most especially in ESB. I think Leia took a step or two backwards in ROTJ but really, there is little to Leia that Fisher didn't put there herself.

 

im sorry? maybe i've misunderstood. it was fisher's decision to have her stand up to vader and tarkin the way she did? it was fisher's decision to have her grab the gun, take the initiative and help han and luke find a way out of the detention area? it was fisher's decision to make her character refuse to bow to the empire and accept death as punishment for her silence? That was ALL on the page. Her and Padme were both written as strong-willed, brave, decisive leaders who rarely wilted under extreme circumstances. neither Portman nor Fisher created their characters - they only portrayed them and added flair. Leia is actually a far more ballsy character in ANH and ROTJ than in ESB when you think about it. The only moment I can recall in ESB where she shows any muscle is insisting on going back to find Luke - yes she shoots some stormtroopers out of neccessity but she does that in ALL of the movies. ESB is the film where she even reacts like a baby on seeing Mynocks. In ROTJ she risks her life rescuing Han and taking part in the mission to destroy the DS when she could easily have stood behind a desk like she did at the end of ANH.

You are correct that Fisher is mostly tongue-in-cheek toward the media about her part in the film(s) and i think we would be silly to take too much of the things she says to heart. I dont think Leia is a particularly rounded character compared to the very best in screen history - but she's certainly one of the more interesting in the SW world. To credit her with these most interesting aspects of the character though is silly in my opinion.

 

That stuff may have been written on the page, but Fisher could've acted it out a completely different way that could've changed the character. Actions don't dictate what makes a character sometimes.

 

I think we've all seen what happens when a character who on the page is more-or-less written like Leia is given to a less-than-personable actress...

[image=http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/ee/Amidala.png]

 

Natalie Portman is a fine actress who's been in a lot of great films and given a lot of great award winning performances. It's a testament not to her acting ability but to the writing of her character in AOTC and ROTS (I like TPM, TBH) that the character didn't come across all that well.

 

People keep saying that, but to be honest I haven't seen a good performance from her in ANYTHING.

 

Just because the action called for Leia to do stuff like stand up to Tarkin, that doesn't make her a deep character. When we're exposed to personal stuff or see deep reactions the actors, writers and director show us who these people are. ANH was really Luke's movie anyway.

And Fisher was more mouthy and ballsy in the ANH and ROTJ (well she was half warrior half hippy in that one) and that's where her character is thinnest. ESB took everyone a step or two farther. Both the writing and the actors went deeper and I think really make their characters memorable. Leia wasn't just mouthy and Han wasn't just sarcastic and cool. From the get go in ESB we're let in more. But this isn't Sophie's Choice and that's okay. It's a sci-fi action series. How much dimention should Leia have? It all balanced out quite well.

 

To each there own, I suppose.

 

So who would be a well rounded, non-one-dimensional female character (or male) for that matter? (heck, you can look at other franchises aside from SW to find and list plenty of them)

 

Everyone in ESB.

 

Leon (aka The Professional) and Closer i would suggest are her best. She's excellent in those. She's decent in V For Vendetta too, even if her accent isn't exactly on the money. I don't know if she's ever really picked the most demanding roles, but she's still young and I'm sure she'll go on to do some really great things. She has the talent.

 

Eh.. I think there were a lot of lines that she could have delivered in a more meaningful way, mediocre writing or not. I do generally like her in other films, and I suspect her problem with the prequels was that she's not very comfortable acting in front of greenscreen. That's the big difference between the Star Wars prequels and most other films she's been in.

As far as Alec Guinness goes, I can understand his frustration with having such a long and distinguised career and only being known by the younger generation for his role in Star Wars. Maybe I'd feel the same way if I were in his position. However, I think it's important for actors (or anyone working in entertainment) to remember that the fans who are paying to see their work are the reason they can make a living. They should be a little appreciative of that, y'know?

 

Good point. And I'm happy as long as people don't go on believing that Guinness talked Lucas into killing off Obi-Wan.

 

I want to know where people get the idea he didn't like the prequels. Just because he laughed at ATC title? Because I once read an interview where he said he was glad to be part of those films.

 

I've performed in plenty of plays that I was glad to do, but which I certainly wouldn't want to have been in the audience for...

 

well dont make me reupload to youtube the rarely seen interview with Ewan from scottish television in 2002, where he had only just seen Attack Of The Clones for the first time. his demeanour is like that of an overzealous schoolkid, continually telling the interviewer how much he "loves" the finished product. if you actually trawl through much of what he has said about the prequels, its mostly that he both enjoyed doing them (admittedly with the exception of Episode 1, where he was moaning that he didnt get much to do) and on the whole enjoyed the finished products.

the biggest factor for him is that he is proud of having done something so universally popular with all age groups. he says he still gets a big kick out of kids coming up to him, believing he his Obi-Wan Kenobi (the very opposite of Alec Guinness ironically enough). I hardly think, with all this considered, he would have any ill-feelings towards the prequels at all. if he did, i see no reason for him not to say so. he's very off-the-cuff when talking about all other things. the amount of times he slips into his Obi-Wan character in both the reality-tv series' he did with Charley Boorman would also suggest a great fondness for the role.

 

Gods, she's beautiful.

I'd kill a few monks to preserve that. Younglings...maybe not. But definitely monks.