CT Changes to the Original Trilogy

sharkymcshark They didn't agree on "I'll let you pay me in another week", they agreed on "I'll let you pay me a bit later, but you'll have to pay 15% more"
We know Jabba loves money, so he's gonna take an opportunity. Though, like a real crime lord or mafia boss, he would probably have Han wasted anyway, and gladly accepted Boba's offering later.

And I certainly didn't see any fondess from Han to Jabba, just a false "nice" face, probably to get himself out of more trouble, and not to mention a sense of sarcasm ("Jabba, you're a wonderful human being")

Overall, I just think this is a better way to connect it to ROTJ. A lot of fans complain about his appearance then ruining the surprise of what he actually is after all the buildup in ANH and TESB, but really, it's no surprise. Jabba appears in TPM, which, according to Lucas at least, you're meant to have already seen. Though I acknowledge there are some people who prefer viewing the second trilogy before the first, so I'll accept that as a valid complaint.

 

If Jabba made a deal to let Solo go for an additional 15%, and then Solo came back and paid what he owed fair and square, it would be a very bad idea for Jabba to turn around and waste him. No smugglers would work for a crime lord that killed them after they fulfilled their obligations.

 

Exactly. Having Han and Jabba meet in ANH gives Han a chance to make right what he owed Jabba and was given a last chance, which he then blows because he chooses not to come back and pay him off. Which would have taken a day or two at most.

 

Panda Babba shoots first.

 

Sorry, I didn't actually write what I meant to, I was a little scatterbrained at first. What I meant to say, is that he would have had him wasted if he didn't pay after all. Like the "extra 15%" deal was Jabba's last shred of patience.

 

OK ya that I agree with. I think Jabba was wise to let Solo go because he doesn't make money if he kills him, so he could still get his money back by letting Han earn it. What Jabba could not have anticipated was this career smuggler joining up with the Rebellion. However, I think he was unwise in ROTJ when he refuses to bargain.

 

We need new dialogue in ROTJ where it confirms that Jabba keeps Han in carbonite as punishment for stepping on his tail.

 

Not really. At that point its less about money and more about the principle of the matter. Han pissed Jabba off, repeatedly. He was generous and that generosity was abused. If he just took whatever offer Luke was willing to give him, that would be bad for business as it makes Jabba less of a threat. When dealing with that type of criminal, you need to show that your patience is limited with poodoo and that there is a price to pay for crossing him.

 

The only thing I can imaginably think of are additional scenes with Biggs. Basically, stuff that got cut in 1977 because this was a limited budget release and so cuts had to be made to keep the runtime down.

Otherwise...every CGI enhancement has been obscene, calling attention to itself instead of subtly blending into the scenery like it should...

 

It only calls attention to itself because you're seeing it now, where it wasn't there before. For someone seeing the SE's for the first time, without seeing the THX editions, it isn't an issue.

 

Yeah, I think the majority of the "tech" scenes and background character elements are flawless. To me, it's really only the Jabba scene that stands out as looking a bit different. Granted, I just got the Blu-rays and am anxious to see it again (it did get redone again slightly, right?)

Watching some of the special features and deleted scenes, I really wish that we would have seen some of those integrated into the films. The Hoth Wampa attack is such a cool angle. If the first 30 minutes of ESB are some of the greatest movie moments ever committed to film, then a secret wampa attack in the base could only make things better. I'm very pro-wampa. Rather than continuing to edit and tweak existing scenes, I'd like to see some of these scenes implemented in the film. Heck, I'd be over the moon if the sandstorm scene were added into the film and at the end we see the sarlacc pit again briefly. We hear a bit of blaster fire, a rocket fire, and Boba's jet pack ignite and see him exploding out of the Saraac's mouth.

 

Have you seen that footage on the Blu-Ray set? It's terrible - ludicrous, lumbering snow monsters that Ed Wood himself would have cringed at. All that's missing is a Santa hat on one of the Wampas.

Interesting to watch as a what-if, but you can see why they turfed it in the first place.

 

Oh yeah, I've definitely seen it, but it seems like something that could be worked out just like the Wampa scene with Luke. Add a few new effects, a new extra or two, some editing and clean-up and kaboom! I think C-3PO pulling the warning sign off the door and the Snowtrooper going through and getting attacked might be one of my favorite Star Wars scenes ever. It's both awesome and comedy gold.

 

Part of the cutting of that scene had to do with how bad the costumes were, but also that it slowed the film down. While Lucas could have inserted it, I think he agreed with Kershner's decision to cut it. As to Jabba, the Blu-Ray version is the same as the 2004 DVD version. Lucas didn't have additional alterations done to Jabba.

 

ANH:
-The 2004 Krayt Dragon scream. (NOT the Blu-Ray edition)
-Luke's encounter with Biggs on Yavin IV. I still wish they put in the first scene on Tatooine.

ESB:
-The improved Wampa scene.
-Ian McDiarmid as Palpatine.
-Boba's new voice. The old one seemed like a cheesy ripoff of Clint Eastwood.
-The extended shots of Cloud City.

RotJ:
-The new Sarlacc.
-The dug in the Palace was a nice way to keep some continuity with the PT.
-The celebration at the end is much better in the SEs.

 

Fondness? I got the impression that Jabba's "fondness" for Han was purely phony.

And didn't Han and Jabba have their conversation after Greedo's failed attempt to collect on the bounty?

 

In the novelization of A New Hope, Han actually calls Jabba's sentiment out as phoney- but Jabba replies that Greedo wasn't supposed to try and kill Han:

"Han, my boy, there are times when you disappoint me. I merely wish to know why you haven't paid me ... as you should have long ago. And why did you have to fry poor Greedo like that? After all you and I have been through together?"
Solo grinned tightly. "Shove it, Jabba. There isn't enough sentiment in your body to warm an orphaned bacterium. As for Greedo, you sent him to kill me."
"Why, Han," Jabba protested in surprise. "Why would I do that? You're the best smuggler in the business. You're too valuable to fry. Greedo was only relaying my natural concern at your delays. He wasn't going to kill you."
"I think he thought he was. Next time don't send one of those hired twerps. If you've got something to say, come and say it yourself."

However, in the Han Solo Trilogy by A. C. Crispin, Jabba does seem to rate Han as his most valuable smuggler, and there's a certain amount of friendly banter between them. He even invites Han to sit down on his tail, when there's no chairs in the room and Han looks like he's been on his feet for a while (possibly as a nod to Jabba not losing his temper in the Special Edition when Han steps on it)

Of course, for Jabba, no amount of sentiment outweighs profit loss.

 

I actually like the idea of Greedo shooting first. I also like the new victory theme and the victory celebrations on Naboo and Coruscant. I even liked the new Anakin ghost, though it was disrespectful to the original actor.

 

I do not think the changes or additions were necessary. But....I do like....

A New Hope

A busier Mos Eisley (with the exception of the speeder bike Jawa thing...stupid)
The Jabba scene
Some of the new Death Star scenes

Empire

The Wampa
Windows and effects in Cloud City (although the elevator noise right before the Vader reveal annoys me)
The New Emperor scene

**** HATE the new Boba Voice....not necessary and a downgrade

Jedi

Nothing new was needed.
****HATE the new song in Jabba's palace, the Vader "nooooooo" and the younger Anakin ghost
The "upgrades" to the Sarlaac and the new dancer scenes were unnecessary
The victory celebrations unnecessary

 

I can see the point of replacing the old emperor with Ian. I don't see the point of altering the dialogue.
As it is now, either Vader comes of as real stupid for not once considering that a Skywalker, that he is obsessed with finding, that he knows is strong with the Force, that he knows Obi-Wan was involved with, that this is his son.
Or Vader is just pulling a very weak and transparent lie to Palpatine by playing dumb.
Vader was looking for Luke and he knew his name. I think he knew or at least considered the possibility.
Given the PT, Vader would be more likely to ask, "Hey you said I killed Padme, but if she gave birth to Luke, I can't have."

Bye for now.
Old Stoneface

 

I'm OK with "considered the possibility" - especially if he then rejected it- not thinking about it again until Palpatine explained that it was in fact, true.

 

But here is the thing, Vader is looking for Luke, he is obsessed with finding him. Why would he at some earlier stage have considered the possibility and then rejected it? What reason would he have for this?
It makes much more sense that one of the reasons he is this focused is that he wants to find out for sure. That he wants to get Luke, if he is just some other Skywalker that just happens to be strong in the Force then so be it. But if there is even a chance that it is his son. He must know.
So I can buy that he isn't 100% sure but has a strong feeling that it might be. That he never considered it or did but rejected it makes less sense.

Bye for now.
Blackboard Monitor

 

Even if he's pushed "my son" to the back of his mind as a unlikely possibility- he knows there's some connection, and wants to know what it is. He also recalled from ANH that "The Force is Strong with This One" - and thus, Luke is potentially the greatest threat to them within the Rebellion, whether he's a relative or not.

The relevant quotes, first, Vader's thoughts after finding Luke's name and background, and second, looking at the ESB scene from Vader's point of view:

The Rise & Fall of Darth Vader
Could there have been other Skywalkers from Tatooine? Vader allowed the possibility. After all, it wasn't an entirely uncommon name in the galaxy.
But Anakin and Padme Amidala had been expecting a baby nineteen years ago.
Nineteen standard years.
It's not possible,Vader thought.I killed Padme. The baby died with her.
Not for the first time, he wondered if the Emperor had told him the whole truth about Padme's death.But I remember choking her ... seeing her collapse on Mustafar. I was so angry with her. And yet ...
Luke Skywalker exists.
Vader refused to believe the notorious Rebel's surname was merely a bizarre coincidence. If he had possessed any other name, Vader would not have hesitated to report what he had learned to the Emperor. But for purely selfish reasons, Vader kept the young Rebel's name to himself. To him, Luke Skywalker was more than a mystery to be solved.
He is ... an opportunity. As strong with the Force as he may be, he is an opportunity ... an opportunity for even greater power.
But who is he? Who were his parents? Could he have been Obi-Wan's son? But then why was he named Skywalker and raised by the Lars family? Or was he merely trained by Obi-Wan?
Because Obi-Wan Kenobi, Shmi Skywalker, Owen and Beru Lars, and Padme Amidala were dead, there was only one way Vader could discover the truth. He would have to ask Luke Skywalker himself. All he had to do was find him.

The Rise & Fall of Darth Vader
"What is thy bidding, my Master?"
From light years away, on Coruscant, the Emperor replied, "There is a great disturbance in the Force."
"I have felt it," Vader said.
"We have a new enemy. The young Rebel who destroyed the Death Star. I have no doubt that this boy is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker."
Offspring?! The surviving tissue in Vader's throat suddenly went dry. Through his shock, he managed to say, "How is that possible?"
Without offering any explanation to support his stated conviction, the Emperor answered, "Search your feelings, Lord Vader. You will know it to be true. He could destroy us."
Having fought Luke Skywalker on Mimban, Vader was even more aware of the young man's powers than was the Emperor. But he also knew something else; Luke was as ignorant of their familial connection as Vader had been. If he had known the truth on Mimban, Vader thought, I would have sensed it. Still grappling with the Emperor's declaration, he struggled to find words that might discourage his Master's interest in Skywalker. "He is just a boy," Vader said. "Obi-Wan can no longer help him."
The Emperor believed otherwise. "The Force is strong with him," he said. "The son of Skywalker must not become a Jedi."
The Emperor had not said in so many words that he wanted Luke Skywalker dead, so Vader — needing Skywalker alive to accomplish his goals — took a different tack. "If he could be turned," Vader suggested, "he would become a powerful ally."
"Yes," the Emperor mused, as if he had not thought of that possibility. Vader could only imagine what the Emperor was thinking. The Sith had long maintained their rule of two: one Master, one apprentice. Even Vader knew that there wasn't room enough in the galaxy for three Sith Lords, and yet the Emperor's hooded eyes seemed to sparkle as he said more emphatically, "Yes. He would be a great asset. Can it be done?"
"He will join us or die, Master," Vader said. He bowed, and the Emperor's hologram faded out.
Now that the Emperor was interested in Luke Skywalker's fate, Vader knew he had to do everything in his power to find Luke before the Emperor found him.

 

I just watched 1983 ROTJ. It made me love the updated version even more than I already did.

 

lol wow. down the rabbit hole....