main
side
curve
  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Lit Chronological Journey Through the EU: Disc. Tales of the Jedi: The Golden Age of the Sith 2

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Rogue1-and-a-half, May 30, 2005.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Rogue1-and-a-half

    Rogue1-and-a-half Manager Emeritus who is writing his masterpiece star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 2, 2000
    So here's the deal. I've read here and there in the EU for a long time, skipping around, etc. Read a lot of it.

    But I've recently become enamored of the Interlibrary Loan System, so I've come up with a plan: Read the entire thing. In order.

    Now, granted, that's impossible. Some short stories haven't been reprinted yet in any form that I can get through ILL and with new entries coming out all the time, it'll be sunk before it even starts.

    However, I'm going to do it. By virtue of being the Official Timeline of TF.N, I'm going to use, well, The Ultimate Timeline of TF.N. It's flawed, yes, and constantly undergoing revisions and such, but it's as good a framework as any. The entire timeline as it stands now has been captured and whatever changes come, I'll ignore them and soldier on with the version I have now.

    I have only one ground rule: it's got to come to me through the library, free of charge. I'm not buying anything, nor am I paying lending fees. I'll pay a late fee or two if I have too, but more on that as it crops up.

    I'm a bit ahead of the game, having already read a few in order from the start and a bunch from all over the timeline.

    I'm not flinching. It's all getting filtered through me: comics, novels, young adults, kids books, short stories, etc. Even the videos of the Ewok movies and such if I can get them (please, God, don't make me be able to get them).

    Anyway, I'll be commenting on a variety of factors: first of all, how I'm holding up on the trip. It's a big undertaking and pretty freaky, if I do say so myself, so this will take the form of a journal of the road, or, perhaps a better analogy, diary of a war correspondant.

    I'll be talking about how each work stands on its own, fits in the continuity, prefigures what is to come, contradicts what has come before, etc. It'll be idiosyncratic and probably offensive at times, given my penchant for plain talking and my inability to stomach wasteful art.

    I should mention I'm a lit fan in general so I'll be musing on connections to the world of literature in general as they pop up. This is the Star Wars EU looked through the eyes of someone who's personal top ten list includes Shakespeare, Hugo, Harper Lee, Frankl, James Jones, C.S. Lewis, Stephen King, T.S. Eliot and more. If that doesn't clue you in, I'll state it explicitly. I'm eclectic and I love a good book of any style. We'll see how the EU stands up to me.

    Basically, anything, to quote the song, goes, though I won't be baring my arms. (HA!) Perhaps the best way to illustrate the kinds of things I'll be doing is to just do one and let you see it.

    So, without further ado, the first review and a step into a huge world and a long, long endeavour.

    5,000 YEARS BEFORE ANH:

    The Golden Age of the Sith - Kevin J. Anderson

    *Okay, in order to give some context here and really get the passage of time, I?m going to sort of create analogies to the timeline of the planet earth. If we say that the year 2005 is analogous to the end of the NJO, then, this story would have taken place in . . . 3050 BC. That?s around the time that Adam died, if you?re up on the recent Biblical scholarship. In other words, this is a long, long time ago.

    *Okay, five thousand years?!? Is this trip really necessary?

    *And right out of the box, a work by Kevin J. Anderson. This is not going to be easy.

    *Seriously, the time period is this work's biggest strength. It realistically takes the movies and says, "Now. Let's go back in time a LONG ways. How do things look?" This book definitely gives us a GFFA that looks very different from the films, yet remains recognizeable.

    **Okay, so our main characters are flighty siblings who map hyperspace routes after their parents die. Needing money fast, they do a quickie that results in the loss of a supply ship. This could just as easily been a passenger freighter or something . . . We're supposed to like these people?

    *It is nice to see a Hutt that isn't greedy and even extends credits. He's the most likeable character in this book.
     
  2. RK_Striker_JK_5

    RK_Striker_JK_5 Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 2, 2003
    I don't disagree with this... but didn't you try this in the EUC?

     
  3. Darth_Kevin

    Darth_Kevin Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 30, 2001
    You shoudl create a blog for this project and update it when appropriate.
     
  4. Rogue_Ten

    Rogue_Ten Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2002
    Whenever someone says they're gonna do something like this, they always disappear within a month or two.

    I'm just saying... ;)
     
  5. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    The vast array of EU material will drive even the sanest into worshipping Waru (see: Jello).
     
  6. Rogue_Ten

    Rogue_Ten Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2002
    Didn't you get the memo, Guy? Waru is no longer the villian to make fun of. Pors Tonith has surpassed everyone's favorite quivering lump of gold flesh as the worst Star Wars villian. Yes, Dan Cragg, he has purple teeth. We get it.
     
  7. Charlemagne19

    Charlemagne19 Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Jul 30, 2000
    Was this actually by KJA?

    My problem with the Sith was hardly they're Satanic (the Sith are Satanic in the movies. They wear black cloaks, work black magic, and sacrifice stuff)

    The Sith are a bunch of arrogant Egyptians who are also MORONS in that book.

     
  8. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    *Naga Sadow: played by Ralph Fiennes.

    [face_laugh]

    This was good- it was done differently than past attempts at this have, a good change of pace.

    You touched on the apsects I recall from the series as well- the highlights being the depictio of the age (such as with the saber tech), Odan-Urr, the nice Hutt, Naga Sadow, etc.

    I wish you luck in your effort- hopefully you'll finish where otehrs have failed ;)

    And if you want a simplified timeline that shaves off some of the more obscure RPG material and such, check out the timeline link in the forum header ::)

    And Excellence will arrive here to bash GAOTS in 5, 4, 3, 2... ;)
     
  9. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    I like this idea very much, and look forward to future installments.

    With regards to the Sith: my bigget problem with them is that both Sadow and Kressh decide on their respective courses with only the very limited intelligence provided by two 'trailblazers'. That's rather inconceiveable.




    [b]Guy[/b]: [face_laugh]
     
  10. Rogue1-and-a-half

    Rogue1-and-a-half Manager Emeritus who is writing his masterpiece star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 2, 2000
    I did post this in EUC but no one responded, so I thought I'd try it again. I also did some editing. This isn't quite the same thing I posted in EUC. :p

    I'm quite a ways ahead . . . I've written reviews up to the first few books of the JA series, so I probably won't disappear tomorrow . . .

    Thanks for all the comments. Try to post another one tonight.

     
  11. Valin__Kenobi

    Valin__Kenobi Author: Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Praji star 4 VIP

    Registered:
    Mar 30, 2004
    My problem with the Sith was hardly they're Satanic (the Sith are Satanic in the movies. They wear black cloaks, work black magic, and sacrifice stuff)

    I don't mean to put words in Rogue's mouth (or keyboard, I guess) so correct me if I'm way off, but I suspect he was referring to the racial characteristics -- red skin, tusks, etc.

    If so, I agree; I would have preferred something a little more subtle.
     
  12. Charlemagne19

    Charlemagne19 Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Jul 30, 2000
    I thought they were too EGYPTIAN.

    I thought KJA was making them a race of Scarabs.
     
  13. Valin__Kenobi

    Valin__Kenobi Author: Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Praji star 4 VIP

    Registered:
    Mar 30, 2004
    I thought the resemblance to ancient Earth civilizations (in both the Sith and Republic factions) was a good choice -- it gave an archaic, "old-timey" feel, instead of being basically identical to the movie era (*coughKOTORcough*)
     
  14. Mastadge

    Mastadge Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 4, 1999
    Interesting project. I've been considering doing a similar thing, though I haven't been able to decide whether it would be more interesting to go chronologically, or in order of publication.

    I thought that Golden Age and Fall Of are some of the worst EU out there, and they didn't even have the even longer ago interest value for me, because they were written after most of the other TotJ stuff, so we'd already seen 4000 years ago, so already had the ancient universe, and this frankly just didn't seem all that different. The characters, the writing, this duology was just very, very weak.
     
  15. Mavrick889

    Mavrick889 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 27, 1999
    I was inspired to read through TotJ as well, and made it up to Dark Lords of the Sith since yesterday. GaotS and FotSE are both pretty bad, but the artists did a pretty good job of making the technology look even more ancient than the 4000 BBY era.
     
  16. rogue_wookiee

    rogue_wookiee Jedi Youngling star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2004
    I just got done reading everything I had access to in order a few months ago. It took me 8 (or was it 9?) months. Good luck.
     
  17. Charlemagne19

    Charlemagne19 Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Jul 30, 2000
    Lightsabers with power chords=the stupid
     
  18. rogue_wookiee

    rogue_wookiee Jedi Youngling star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2004
    I agree. Lightsabers should not be musical instruments. :p
     
  19. Rogue1-and-a-half

    Rogue1-and-a-half Manager Emeritus who is writing his masterpiece star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 2, 2000
    For what it's worth, I was referring to the Sith's physical design when I called them Satanic . . . red skin, goatees, horns (of a sort), etc. I can certainly see the Egyptian motif as well.

    A lot of great comments, guys . . . this is exactly how I was hoping you'd respond.

    4,999 Years before ANH:

    The Fall of the Sith Empire ? Kevin J. Anderson

    *So, Jori gets back the Republic, but no one believes her story, thinking that she made it up to avoid going to prison for stealing her ship. Okay . . .

    *Okay, at the conclusion of The Golden Age of the Sith, Naga Sadow killed his main rival within the Sith, Ludo Kressh by blowing up his ship. At the beginning of this story, Ludo returns, having faked his death, and attacks Sadow again. Sadow kills him . . . by blowing up his ship.

    *Okay, Gav?s upset because Sadow manipulated him into pushing the button that blew up Ludo. But seriously, let?s look at this. In complete innocence, Gav pushes a button that Sadow has previously wired to blow up Ludo?s ship. Who is really responsible? I think any reasonable person would have to say that Sadow committed the ?action? that resulted in Ludo?s death.

    *And can you really open yourself to the Dark Side by killing someone accidentally? I sure hope not. I think the intent is what makes an action partake of the Dark Side, not the action itself. So, Gav?s fall is flawed, seriously flawed.

    *Jori manages to convince Empress Teta of the truth of her story, thanks to Odan Urr and his vision. At this point, the story starts to cohere and the whole thing swings up in quality.

    *Okay, the action sequences here are pretty good. The attack on Coruscant especially is beautifully drawn.

    *Equally intelligent is the idea of Empress Teta offering pardons to those rebels who fought against her previously if they will now will fight on her side against the Sith. It?s a nice touch and has actually been used in real life.

    *Okay, the brain like creature that lives in a container gets a heroic death by puncturing his container and letting out the noxious gases that he lives on to kill many of the approaching Sith army. This, of course, also leads to his own death.

    *It gives us the only truly emotional moment thus far when Odan-Urr, having defeated the Sith army by striking at its illusory elements with the power of his mind, kneels by his master and muses, ?Much more than an illusion . . .?

    *I should also mention that the Hutt gets a great death scene (they usually do) and he dies heroically (they usually don?t).

    *So Jori shows up just as Gav is bending over the dead Hutt covered in his blood. She assumes he?s killed Aarba and attacks him. Gav flees, rather than simply gaining a little distance and telling her he?s innocent. And I mean there is a war going on . . . couldn?t you give your brother the shadow of a doubt?

    *Naga Sadow proceeds to lead Gav, Jori and Empress Teta?s fleet into a trap. He makes a star go nova (thank you, Kevin J. Anderson . . . I wonder if you?ll ever do that again . . .), killing Gav and it?s fittingly emotional.

    *Okay, now this is just ludicrous. Ludo Kressh was presumed dead at the end of The Golden Age of the Sith when Sadow blew up his ship. He returned at the start of this story and Sadow blew up his ship again. Here, at the climax of this story, Kressh returns AGAIN and Sadow blows up his ship AGAIN! This time, judging from the next few books, he actually dies, but still, get a grip, man, that?s just stupid.

    *And this one ends with the Sith beaten back, Naga Sadow presumed dead and setting up shop on Yavin 4 (ooh, neato, a tie in!), starting to build some temples that we?ll see later on and Jori running Aarba the Hutt?s shop, Empress Teta back in command and Odan-Urr returning to his master?s homeworld to set up a library. How charming.

    *All in all, this one was a vast improvement over the first volume. It was more emotional and the battle scenes were done better. However, it still fails to really engage. ** out of **** stars.
     
  20. Charlemagne19

    Charlemagne19 Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Jul 30, 2000
    I think Sadow was just playing on Gav's weak mindedness. He blames himself for killing someone and its the first step in corrupting the poor boy.

    You know its amusing, Naga Sadow is the only one of the Sith to show remotely 'Sith'-like qualities through this entire arc and damn near single handidly destroys the empire
     
  21. Valin__Kenobi

    Valin__Kenobi Author: Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Praji star 4 VIP

    Registered:
    Mar 30, 2004
    Lightsabers with power chords=the stupid

    I agree. Lightsabers should not be musical instruments.


    [face_laugh]

    Personally, I liked the idea of power cords--after all, you have to show some technological progression over 5 millennia.
     
  22. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    *And can you really open yourself to the Dark Side by killing someone accidentally? I sure hope not. I think the intent is what makes an action partake of the Dark Side, not the action itself.

    I think the guilt a person can burden upon themselves from such a scenario can lead to the darkside.
     
  23. Charlemagne19

    Charlemagne19 Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Jul 30, 2000
    In a SWORD though?
     
  24. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    Energy sword ;)
     
  25. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    What if you hand got caught in the cord? That'd be bad.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.