Lit Clone Wars Continuity Discussion (Spoilers Allowed)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by sabarte, May 12, 2008.

  1. Ulicus Lit'ari

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    See: compatibilism.

    Man can do what he wills, but cannot will what he wills -- Arthur Schopenhauer

    EDIT: Actually, you've side-tracked me. :p I'm not talking about everything being governed by the will of the Force but referring to the fact that the Jedi way, specifically, is about surrendering to the will of the Force. It's pretty much their guiding principle, so the idea that the height of Jedi enlightenment would involve denying the Force's will is anathema to me.

    Of course. There is no death, there is the Force. It's part of the Jedi Code, and everything. :p

    Opinions can be true.

    [face_dunno]

    George said Luke never got married and the Emperor never got cloned. This is Lit.

    Imagine what you'll know tomorrow. :cool:;)
  2. GrandAdmiralJello Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque

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    QFT.
  3. Robimus Force Ghost

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    Now, more than ever before, we can look towards George Lucas's veiw of Star Wars and thumb our noses at it. To me he just gave away his rights to G-Canon :p

    That silliness out of the way I truly don't understand how people can look towards the fictional universe and proclaim "this can't be" or "it doesn't work that way in the real world!" In a fictional universe its absolutly possible for a robot to have a soul, for a robot to be sentient, and for people to move things with the power of their minds. Imagination has no limits.
  4. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

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    What I don't think is well explained is why some droids should be considered sentient while others are not. How does this happen? Better software, or what?
  5. Zorrixor Chosen One

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    Yes and no, I suppose. They obviously need a certain sophistication or they're not more sentient than an amoeba, but I-5YQ seems to suggest that in addition to the raw robotic "grey matter", they also need a "mutation" in the sense of a glitch that causes them to violate their programming and become a liberated intelligence, not ruled entirely by logic.

    This discussion actually reminds me of an article I read last year from some scientists who were talking about whether or not "robot rights" will become a real issue after computers advance to a certain level. To paraphrase, I think they were basically pointing out we're not monkeys anymore, and were speculating what "counts" as a consciousness that's worth protecting, so pretty much confronting the same sort of issues we're talking about here, i.e. are we special because we're able to think for ourselves, or just because we're part of the human species? Which sort of parallels the question of whether all things, organic or not, are part of the Force, or if organic beings can forever point at machines and consider themselves privileged, while I-5YQ and C-3PO are just doomed for the scrapheap as tools.
    Last edited by Zorrixor, Nov 13, 2012
  6. beccatoria Force Ghost

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    Dec 8, 2006
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    I just tried to "like" Uli's post. Usually it just works. This time I got taken to an entirely separate page asking if I was sure I wanted to like it. Be careful, Uli, Lit is out to get you... [face_hypnotized]

    Also, in response to @StarWarsFan91 -

    Other people have addressed whether or not what George says really does matter (Wookiee Jedi! Wheeee!), but let's pretend you're right and Lucas' statement that droids don't have souls is taken as canon for the EU? The fact that Lucas said droids don't have souls doesn't make it any less an opinion that not having a soul means one is "not truly alive" and therefore "not people". I mean, quite aside from the fact my instinct is that you're arguing from a broadly populist, western, Christian perspective in a fictional universe that George acknowledges owes a lot what he's taken from populist, eastern Buddhism, a cucumber's alive - and we know plant life exists in the Force too - but I'm pretty sure it's not people.

    Unless.

    No. It can't be.

    Last edited by beccatoria, Nov 13, 2012
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  7. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

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    "It looks like you're trying to like a post by Ulicus. Is everything alright? What day is today? Do you require a sedative?"
    Last edited by CooperTFN, Nov 13, 2012
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  8. Zorrixor Chosen One

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    I wasn't asked to confirm, but then I was liking the post where he admitted to being a moron.
  9. The-Eternal-Hero Force Ghost

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    Nov 3, 2012
    star 4
    So are Adegan Crystals out...?

    This is by far my favorite take on Ilum.
  10. Rogue_Follower Manager Emeritus

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    Nov 12, 2003
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    Nah, I think Adegan crystals are safe. It's quite possible for more than one type of crystal to be common on the same planet.
  11. TalonCard •Author: Slave Pits of Lorrd •TFN EU Staff

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    I didn't see if this was mentioned amongst lightsaber crystal and droid soul speculation, but Ahsoka did allude to her previous encounter with Hondo in Strength. This indicates that it takes place after the Onderon arc, and since we know this arc takes place before Revival, Adi Gallia's presence in the first episode of the Onderon arc is now at least consistent within the series...

    TC
  12. Darth_Kiryan Force Ghost

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    Mar 13, 2009
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    Thinking at it from that perspective.....i don't know if that's a good thing.
  13. instantdeath Force Ghost

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    I thought they weren't doing prequel episodes anymore?
  14. MercenaryAce Force Ghost

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    There was a last minute decision to move Revival to the first episode, since they didn't want to keep people waiting on Maul. Hondo references the destruction of his base in Revival, and that is going to happen in an upcoming episode.
  15. instantdeath Force Ghost

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    Jul 22, 2010
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    Ah, I imagine the move happened before they said they weren't going to jump around the timeline? So far, Revival is the only episode of season five I've watched.

    You have to wonder if stuff like Adi Gallia appearing in an episode after she died is confusing for the kids, the primary audience. But as I've noticed elsewhere, kids tend to be much more willing than us crotchety adults to just roll with it and not worry about the details, so...
  16. TalonCard •Author: Slave Pits of Lorrd •TFN EU Staff

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    It's such a brief appearance that I don't think kids would have caught it--I certainly wouldn't have if the episode guide hadn't pointed it out. :p But kids cartoons have always had a tendency to air out of sequence--I remember this became pretty obvious with Kim Possible and Buzz Lightyear of Star Command, and even then we'd try and figure out the correct sequence of events. TV shows in general have this problem--every incarnation of Star Trek aired episodes out of chronological order, for example.

    Lucasfilm shows are particularly baffling because they do it intentionally. The Young Indiana Jones Chronicles was all also all over the timeline, and was cancelled before some of the story could be filled in, leaving us without the tales of how Indy met Houdini and what happened at basic training in WWI.

    TC
  17. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

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    The real difference now is that they're producing the episodes in order - deciding to reshuffle the airings is always going to be possible.
  18. TychoCorde Jedi Master

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    I wouldn't mind the episode order so much if they would put them in chronological order on the DVDs that way if you want to marathon them they play in order, after reading the TCW Chronology on main page I realized how out of order things were...
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  19. Zorrixor Chosen One

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    I thought the same thing when I bought the season one DVD and found it hadn't been reordered into sequence.
  20. TychoCorde Jedi Master

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    I can't wait until they get into season three when Ahsoka's look changes and she goes from "current look" back to "tube top shorter head tails" in the episode order. Though I am not sure if they out of order that way.
  21. Rogue_Follower Manager Emeritus

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    I'm not sure that's the case with this episode. Hondo has his old character model in Tipping Points, but his new one in Test of Strength.

    Edit: Whoops, nevermind. I got them backwards in my head. The character model change sequence agrees with the idea that Tipping Points was produced before Test of Strength.
    Last edited by Rogue_Follower, Nov 14, 2012
  22. Valin__Kenobi Author: Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Praji

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    I assume that when they eventually come out with the phone-book-sized complete series boxset it will be in proper chronological order.

    Maybe with a Leland-penned foldout chart showing where each digest and issue of Republic fits between the episodes, but I'm not holding my breath. :p
    Last edited by Valin__Kenobi, Nov 14, 2012
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  23. instantdeath Force Ghost

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    Jul 22, 2010
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    I don't think so, honestly. I mean, the episodes are set up to where they can be easily understood in the current viewing order, so I imagine they'll be left that way.

    To be perfectly honest, I think putting it all in chronological order might hurt the flow, as odd as that sounds. For example, the Yoda episode works great as the series opener, but the movie prequel would have to precede it chronologically. And then you have to order all the prequels and sequels to Senate Spy...
  24. Valin__Kenobi Author: Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Praji

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    Well, I envisioned putting the movie back in after the two Christophsis-prequel episodes, so they would lead right into the opening. I guess the Trench episode would actually be the series opener then. It seems to me that certain arcs, like Christophsis, might work better when grouped in chronological runs, rather than spread so disjointedly, but YMMV.

    I have to wonder if casual viewers are annoyed that it jumps around, or if they even notice. I mean, I am by no means an EU noob, but even I was thrown for a loop when "Supply Lines" jumped back to before the Yoda episode, and I was like, "Didn't we already make friends with this Katuunko guy three seasons ago?" Probably a result of me paying just enough attention to get myself into trouble….
    Last edited by Valin__Kenobi, Nov 14, 2012
  25. Zeta1127 Force Ghost

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    Sep 2, 2012
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    I get very irritated whenever I hear about the episode "Supply Lines," since it is the reason the Tantive IV is no longer officially in RotS.