Lit Clone Wars Continuity Discussion (Spoilers Allowed)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by sabarte, May 12, 2008.

  1. JoinTheSchwarz Comms Admin & Community Manager

    Administrator
    Member Since:
    Nov 21, 2002
    star 8
    I will not let this continuity, which has stood for twenty-something years, be split in two.
  2. MercenaryAce Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 10, 2005
    star 5
    Is this forum defer its rage until a delegation can be sent to ascertain the truth?
  3. Mia Mesharad Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    I will not defer. I have come before you to resolve this attack on our continuity now. I did not come here to watch my canon suffer and die while you discuss this invasion in a committee. If these creators are not capable of wise action, I suggest new leadership is needed. I move for a Vote of No Confidence.
  4. HEDGESMFG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2010
    star 4
    Frankly, I'd still rather be here than the chaos that is the TV forum when all 13 of these eps hit. I used to hang around there more, but that place has at times turned into a hive of (mindless EU bashing) scum and villainy.

    Then there's the ep VII forum. We don't talk about that place.

    Edit: ****... I broke the combo. Uhh...

    Lookie Lookie Senator. Deesa Jedi arriving. Mesa your humble servant...

    Wait...

    Dammit.
    Last edited by HEDGESMFG, Mar 6, 2014
  5. Gamiel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2012
    star 5
    Darth Marvel: At last we will reveal ourselves to Dark Horse comic. At last we will have revenge.
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  6. AdmiralWesJanson Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 5
    Order! Order! I will have order in this forum!
  7. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    The time is nigh!

    Edit: Netflix has betrayed us!
    Last edited by DigitalMessiah, Mar 7, 2014
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  8. Contessa Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2013
    star 2
    lol First time seeing this so just wanted to say thanks for posting that, it was awesome. It's crazy how good Joker-Palps actually works.

    Yeah it's been said before but...

    If it's not canon, it's not *actually* part of the universe. I mean, that's the fanfiction argument. It's not about quality or anything like that. It's whether or not it counts, and means something, and has an impact (big or small) that can be followed up on. If it's not going to be canon and do that and be a "real" part of Star Wars, then it's just some other story that's using some familiar names and places and something called the Force. If it's good, then yeah sure, read it. That's what we do with fanfiction, right? But fanfic doesn't get referenced, it doesn't get follow up outside of the same writer, and you can't *know* anything about the universe based off fanfic, because no matter how good it might be, it didn't happen and it doesn't mean anything to the 'verse.

    That's the ****** thing about canon getting screwed.
    Mia Mesharad likes this.
  9. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    It is part of the universe because it's being published. It's not fan fiction, it's being sold as a product.

    It's not suddenly fan fiction because Lucas contradicted it. You might as well ask why people wrote SW Infinities. It doesn't matter it's infinities! Or other intellectual properties where the "EU" there doesn't matter at all.

    It's still an opportunity to play with the characters and tell stories in the universe.

    Edit: The question of whether it "matters" just gets too Wittgensteinian for me I guess. It's all fiction. Fiction doesn't inherently have more value because it's arbitrarily labeled 'canon.' I think most people here have decided that they value the EU more than whatever the ST ends up being. Why does an arbitrary, empty, and ultimately meaningless label matter?

    Edit 2: http://movies.netflix.com/WiMovie/70155581

    Anyway, I respect your opinions @Contessa and @instantdeath

    I guess I've just come to not value canon all that much since what happened to Jacen.
    Last edited by DigitalMessiah, Mar 7, 2014
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  10. HEDGESMFG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2010
    star 4
  11. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    I'm watching the Yoda arc. The Jedi council is concerned about Yoda having a senior moment.
    Last edited by DigitalMessiah, Mar 7, 2014
  12. JackG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2011
    star 4
    I'll wait for the torrent because someone thought it would be good idea to make this exclusive to a online network available only in certain regions of the planet.
    Gorefiend and Mia Mesharad like this.
  13. Contessa Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2013
    star 2
    Yeah, being published means it isn't *actually* fanfiction. But without the canon connection to the universe, it's equivalent. And I wouldn't say just being published with a "Star Wars" logo on the front makes it part of the *universe*. Part of the franchise, sure, and will someone pick it up because of the Star Wars logo? Definitely. But if it's not canon, it's the half assed cousin of a multiverse release (minus the actual multiverse) that'll never mean anything to the "real" story.

    I'm basically just talking about me and fans like me. Infinities and contribute-nothing franchise tie-ins can be cool, and I guess some people dig that, but not me. It doesn't mean anything. At the end of the story, nothing happened in Star Wars. It can be the best story ever, but nothing happened in the actual Star Wars universe. I'm not going to buy it, and maybe I'll check it out if it shows up online, just like fanfic, but I just can't bring myself to care about a think that didn't "happen".

    Love of the universe? I mean, Star Wars are a couple pretty great movies, right? Practically everybody at least likes three, and we've watched them a bunch. But when the credits roll, that's it. Movie over, nothing else. But the Star Wars *universe*? That thing is ******* huge, and goes on practically forever, with its couple thousand planets and half a million characters and all this amazing stuff that makes it whole and vast and awesome, and it's been like a fictional fantasy home away from home, with all this cool familiar stuff and people and places you get to visit over and over. It would kinda suck to throw all that out just for three more movies or a couple TV episodes because they can't work with what came before. "A thousand years of history? **** it, I need to tell *this* story *right* now, and it'll be better than all that!" Nope.


    Whatever though. Not trying to have a pissy argument over it or anything, I'm just frustrated. Respect to your and your opinion too, DM.
  14. Sinrebirth SWC and EUC Forum Moderator

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Nov 15, 2004
    star 7
    As a Britzen I am reliant on you guys to keep me in the loop! I expect it will require all of our continuity superpowers to survive today.

    Calling Captain Continuity, the Optimist-class Hat wielding hero, clad in Vader leggings and equipped with the Katarn Beard!




    Okay a little bit of hysteria may have just settled in here. But only a little.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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  15. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    "He is to teach one that will save the universe from great imbalance."

    The five sages are confusion, anger, sadness, joy, and serenity.

    Hamill is Darth Bane.
    Last edited by DigitalMessiah, Mar 7, 2014
  16. AdmiralWesJanson Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 5
    [IMG]
  17. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    [IMG]

    Here's Dooku telling Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan about the time he faced a terentatek with Yoda on Kashyyyk.

    [IMG]
    Darth Bane

    Also you get to see Ahsoka die, but it is as real as the first image, but I guess that's better than nothing.

    Yoda faces Sidious in some sort of astral battle which is able to occur due to Yoda being on Moraband and the master-apprentice bond between Yoda and Dooku through a Sith ritual.

    The second episode has a very Jungian sequence in which Yoda faces his shadow, and he has to accept it rather than deny it.

    There's a symbiotic relationship between the Cosmic Force and the Living Force. The Cosmic Force is the "wellspring" but at the same time it's fed by the Living Force. It's the same basic concept that Lucas described back in the 80s, that there's a central Force energy that when you die, your Force energy joins. The sages also say that life beyond death (retaining your identity) isn't meant for all Jedi, but only a special few, and Qui-Gon can't manifest visibly due to his training being incomplete. But he's supposed to train Yoda.

    It's basically stated as much as can be that Dooku was Yoda's apprentice in the same way that Qui-Gon was Dooku's, etc., but at the same time as mentioned Obi-Wan says "we were all Yoda's apprentices" and you can basically equivocate the point if you like Thame Cerulian.
    Last edited by DigitalMessiah, Mar 7, 2014
  18. melkor834 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2009
    star 3
    Yeah, I really enjoyed the Yoda arc despite a few small continuity problems.
  19. karilyan Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 8, 2014
    What is Darth Bane wearing? standard sith armor?

    What were they talking about?
  20. melkor834 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2009
    star 3
    Wearing armor of some sort, it's certainly not the Orbalisks. And they talk only briefly. Bane mentions how he founded the Rule of Two and sorta goes over the basics.Yoda then dismisses Bane by claiming Bane is no more than an illusion. The whole sequence is over in just over a minute.
    Last edited by melkor834, Mar 7, 2014
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  21. ararha Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2013
    its just an illusion
  22. HEDGESMFG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2010
    star 4
    HOW does he meet Bane? Is Bane a spirit? Given that they once created a character model of his Sith armor, I'm sure they know what he actually looks like... so is this some potential otherworldly appearance.

    Also, watched the Order 66 arc. It is made fairly clear that the Kaminoans implanted the chip so that "Protocol 66" could be secretly executed on command, but they do NOT know it's a Sith plot. Dooku tells them that the protocol exists PURELY as a precautionary measure against ROGUE Jedi but it must be kept secret (else the Kaminoans risk being implicated and the order becomes ineffective). At best, they know whatever Tyrannus tells him. The chips were his idea, but he claims Sifo-Dyas was the only Jedi who knew about them. This could easily be a lie, but the Kaminoans are just following the wishes of their clinets as far as they're concerned (Sifo-Dyas and Tyranus, that is).

    What's interesting about the wording is that it suggests Order 66 as a contingency order could work as well, since if it was meant to stop Rogue Jedi, then the order was used against all Jedi because the ENTIRE order was considered rogue. The clones were indeed compelled to do it, but the general concept of the contingency order (called protocol here) remains the same.

    Overall, I think this works very well.

    Currently watching the clovis arc. This stuff is far better paced and written than the show's past events, really good episodes honestly, despite some (mostly minor) inconsistencies. Also nice to hear Ian Abercrombie one last time.
    Last edited by HEDGESMFG, Mar 7, 2014
  23. Starkeiller Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 5, 2004
    star 4
    The Yoda arc sounds far more respectful to continuity than people seemed to expect. It also sounds awesome in the true sense of the word.
  24. Mia Mesharad Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    From everything I've gathered, but without having seen the episodes personally yet, I'm thinking the key break down for the contingency/control issue the arc raises is the fact that this chip and its function are repeatedly referred to exclusively as "Protocol 66." Protocol, not Order 66, which is what the clones and everyone aware of the GAR contingency orders know it as. Protocol 66―the chip, its function, the plan behind it―is what is secret, and what the Sith must keep secret from the Jedi and the clones. The contingency's own contingency, the Protocol ensures the Order is followed.

    Is that about right, or...am I way off base?
  25. Starkeiller Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 5, 2004
    star 4
    And :eek: -- oh wait, this is too good!


    SITHISIS RITUAL?

    =P~=P~=P~=P~
    Last edited by Starkeiller, Mar 7, 2014