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Constitutional Amendment: Should we do away with the 'born in the USA' requirement for the Prez?

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by Obi-Wan McCartney, Nov 5, 2003.

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  1. Shadow_of_Evil

    Shadow_of_Evil Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 18, 2001
    They have to be born here. It works best that way

    no need to label. Just ask what you want clarified.
     
  2. Albert_Normandy

    Albert_Normandy Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2003
    Foreigners have no place in politics. It's more than enough that we let them come in. Why should they take over too?
     
  3. Jediflyer

    Jediflyer Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 5, 2001
    Perhaps because people like you are running the country.

     
  4. darth_paul

    darth_paul Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2000
    Americans know what Americans need. Germans know what Germans need. I would support it if every country in the world adopted this same rule.
    Oh, BS. There is no magic "what Americans need." It just doesn't work that way. There is no magic thting that makes the country run right that only someone born in America can understand. That's a lovely little cookie-cutter concept, but it has no bearing on reality. No problem has one simple little magic solution, and certainly all the problems together don't.

    Besides, we live in a representative republic. Therefore, officials are elected to serve the will of the people. They have platforms upon which they run to get elected. If people elect a politician who doesn't know what they need, that's their own dumb fault. And if the politician lies to get into power, then there are procedures that can be undertaken for replacing him.

    But I utterly fail to see what insight someone born in Japan who immigrated at six months old can possibly fail to understand about the country that someone born in the U.S. who spent 30 years living in Geneva comprehends. The notion is nonsensical.

    As I say: We're a representative republic. Don't think someone will serve us well? Don't vote for him! But why on earth should long-term American citizens who happened by pure chance to be born in another country be removed from our pool of candidates? We don't seem to have that many good ones to chose from -- God knows if this year is representative, it's slim pickins. We need all the options we can get.

    On a slightly less satirical note, I do think that arbitrarily discriminating against people to whom the U.S. government granted citizenship and who have spent as long as the minimum age of a U.S.-born president joining our culture can be justified. You're uncomfortable with the idea? The ballot box is a wonderful screen to keep people out of office. But telling some people that even though they may be citizens they will always be second-class isn't my idea of justice for all.

    Foreigners have no place in politics. It's more than enough that we let them come in. Why should they take over too?
    But the people we're talking about are not foreigners, for crying out loud! They're American citizens!! Who have lived here at least 35 years after attaining citizenship, no less! Have I made myself clear yet?

    And I will remind you once more that in American politics, the only way for anyone to "take over" is by being elected by the people of the United States.

    -Paul
     
  5. Albert_Normandy

    Albert_Normandy Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2003
    I would vote against any foreigner regardless of the issues
     
  6. Suzuki_Akira

    Suzuki_Akira Jedi Master star 7

    Registered:
    May 13, 2003
    Way to go, Albert.

    If you're going to be bigoted you might as well be proud of it, too.
     
  7. Albert_Normandy

    Albert_Normandy Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2003
    What good could possibly come from an immigrant being president? Nothing. There are plenty of Americans to choose from. We don't need anyone from another country. If someone is born here with forein parents that's great. They should get to run. It's that simple. I'm not discriminating against any race. It would just open yet another can of worms.
     
  8. Nostril_of_Palpatine

    Nostril_of_Palpatine Jedi Master star 1

    Registered:
    Apr 13, 2004
    ...no. Because then Arnold would rise to the presidency, and we'd have an Austrian in office. And can you remember who ELSE was an Austrian?

    Yes, there've been quite a few million people who called themselves Austrian throughout history. What's your point? Oh, you're just making a connection to Hitler. What wonderful logic. Someone of the same nationality as Hitler must be evil, right? Granted, you didn't go into any detail on that, but it was pretty obvious where you were heading with a statement like that.
     
  9. Ben_Skywalker

    Ben_Skywalker Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    May 20, 2001
    " I'm not discriminating against any race."

    yeah, you're just discriminating against EVERY race that is not your own. Anyways, I'm foreign born. my parents are foreign born. yet i've lived in the U.S pretty much all my life and I've been a U.S citizen for awhile now. I'm patriotic as hell. So does me being born somewhere else make me any less American than someone born in the U.S?

    So yeah, I personally think that the Constitution should be amended. I'm patriotic, I pay its taxes, I'd fight in its Army if there were a draft, why SHOULDN'T I be given a chance to run for president just like everyone else?
     
  10. Special_Fred

    Special_Fred Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 30, 2003
    Albert, you might as well say, "I would vote against any female presidential candidate, regardless of the issues," or, "I would vote against a black candidate, regardless of the issues." Arguing on raw emotion without any facts or statistics to support your claim is not wise.

    EDIT: This November 2nd, you might want to try voting for a candidate you agree with instead of voting against someone you don't...
     
  11. Albert_Normandy

    Albert_Normandy Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2003
    I'd vote for the same person smart guy
     
  12. Special_Fred

    Special_Fred Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 30, 2003
    I'm sure you would. I was only trying to point out how the mentality that it's better to vote "against" someone than it is to vote "for" someone is so prevalent in this country. That type of thinking is what leads to belief in the "lesser of two evils" and "wasted vote" fallacies.
     
  13. darth_paul

    darth_paul Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 24, 2000
    Special_Fred, were things slightly different, this November, I'd be voting against a candidate. Actually, it doesn't have to be -- I'm registered in Massachusetts, and can vote Badnarik with no problems, because the state's not especially closely divided. But if I were registered in my home state of West Virginia, I most certainly wouldn't be voting for Bush (hate the man) -- I'd be voting against Kerry, which means checking Bush on the ballot because in WV the margin is tight enough that Bush has a chance to defeat Kerry. I think in some circumstances, it's understandable -- a natural byproduct of our two-party system. However, I do agree that besides being a deplorable sentiment, "voting against any foreigner" is a screwed-up way of looking at it.
     
  14. WhiteKnight

    WhiteKnight Jedi Grand Master star 1

    Registered:
    Dec 31, 2002
    This country wouldn't even be America if it hadn't been for the Founding Fathers. Haw dare we even question any of their laws, as this is their country to the fullest, and what they said about it goes. Allowing non-citizens to run for Prez is anti-Americanism to the fullest.
     
  15. DarthBreezy

    DarthBreezy Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 4, 2002
    Allowing non-citizens to run for Prez is anti-Americanism to the fullest.

    I thought this was a joke, then I actually clicked on your 'website'.

    After disinfecting my eyes I decided that I had to come back and just say [face_laugh] [face_laugh] [face_laugh]

    If the constitutional amendment passed, I think Arnie would probably stand a good chance at becoming a serious contender for the White House. From what little I've heard about his administraion, he seems to be moderate enough to pull it in from both sides.

    Oh just an FYI, you'd have to be a US citizen to be eligable... It's not a case of allowing non-citizens to run and citizenship is not limited to your place of birth..

     
  16. TheHorrorNerd

    TheHorrorNerd Jedi Grand Master star 1

    Registered:
    Jan 18, 2002
    I agree that the "Born in the U.S" requirement should be ammended.
     
  17. Obi-Wan McCartney

    Obi-Wan McCartney Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 17, 1999
    Ben Skywalker, this Obi-wan feels your pain.
     
  18. Emperor_Joe

    Emperor_Joe Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 7, 2002
    Perhaps because people like you are running the country.

    And that needs to be changed?
     
  19. Depa Billaba

    Depa Billaba Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Jul 21, 1998
    And that needs to be changed?

    I don't follow?!

    Edit: I Just read this

    SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - Washington legislators may be debating amending the Constitution to allow foreign-born presidents, but Californians are not quite ready to make Arnold Schwarzenegger commander-in-chief, a poll on Friday found.
    A Field Poll of 600 Californians registered to vote found that just 26 percent would be inclined to vote for their Austrian-born governor should he one day run for president.

    The U.S. Constitution bars foreign-born Americans, who include figures such as Schwarzenegger and former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger, from becoming president.

    On Tuesday, the U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee held a hearing on the issue, with the committee chairman Orrin Hatch, a Republican, backing a change to the Constitution.

    Schwarzenegger, the former bodybuilding champion and Hollywood star, was elected governor just a year ago. Yet his star power and charisma has led some to muse that the Republican might have what it takes to be president.

    The Field Poll found that 65 percent of Californians approve of Schwarzenegger's job as governor, the same number as in August and May surveys. Those numbers are especially impressive because the Republican serves a state where Democrats are the majority party.

    Still, the Field Poll, which had a plus or minus 4.1 percent margin of error, found only 36 percent of those surveyed backed a change in the Constitution to allow foreign-born presidents.

    Schwarzenegger has expressed support for a Constitutional change, and some of his friends believe he will one day become president.


    [face_plain]

    Depa Billaba
     
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