Speculation Could Mortis have something to do with Episode 7

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode VII and Beyond (Archive)' started by the-jedi-prince, Nov 4, 2012.

  1. Prodigy_Knight Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 10, 2013
    star 1
    What I found interesting about the Mortis trilogy is that it overturned the old "The Dark Side is a external corruption of the Force" Lucas held, which frankly I viewed as clunky and un-intuitive i.e. "I call it a dark side and it's dark but it's not really a side as it's not a part of the thing you'd thought it was a side of".
  2. fett 4 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 2, 2000
    star 4
    Yeah I remember now, Anakin is shown a vision of him becoming Darth Vader, so horrified at all the evil things he will do and determined to prevent it, he decides to help the evil brother escape and conquer the galaxy o_O ,
    Does anyone else not notice the contradiction here, or is it one of those Only Sith deal in absolute things and just go with it [face_hypnotized]
  3. The Hellhammer Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 4, 2012
    star 5
    I thought that story was alright, nothing special and not my favorite moment of the series but I do like that they tried something different.
    I seem to be one of the few who actually liked Anakin's vision, I thought it was a cool scene.

    However, I highly doubt that any of the non-movie material/content will have any impact on the ST - the Mortis story included.
  4. anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of CT, SW Saga and Lucasfilm Ltd

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    I saw it, and it's one of the aspects of that trilogy that made me most nuts.

    Anakin has a vision of himself turning to the Dark Side and is so horrified that he turns to the Dark Side to keep it from happening.

    W...T...F...
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  5. DARTHSHAME Jedi Master

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    Dec 19, 2003
    star 4
    I do not mind explorations of the Force. I simply believe that Episode VII would not be the appropriate vehicle. Especially, when it comes to establishing a new trilogy.
  6. bstnsx704 Jedi Knight

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    Mar 11, 2013
    star 3
    Personally speaking, I can't think of a better place to explore the Force more than in the new trilogy. Throughout the majority to the prequel trilogy the Force was regulated to the physical world, with Anakin's dreams and Yoda's visions kind of giving us a hint of what is to come. In Revenge of the Sith we heard the tale of Darth Plagueis, which opened a whole new can of worms, and then learned that Qui-Gon Jinn discovered though the Force how to transcend death. Because of Qui-Gon's teachings to Obi-Wan and Yoda in between the two trilogies, the Force took on a bit more of a spiritual nature in the original trilogy. We were introduced to the Force Ghosts for the first time, and took hen the cave on Dagobah was introduced. It makes sense to me that, with the upcoming films, we will progress further down that path and learn more about these mystical sides of the Force.
  7. DARTHSHAME Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 19, 2003
    star 4
    I suppose for me it depends on how they do it. My concern would be that they become so esoteric that they lose sight of the action and adventure aspect of Star Wars. This thread has prompted me to go back and watch this Mortis arc. However, from what is described, this type of storyline would be unlikely to excite the casual fanbase. Given the division on this thread, it is safe to say that the reception by the fans may be tepid at best.
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  8. fett 4 Jedi Grand Master

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    Jan 2, 2000
    star 4
    I may be wrong, but I really doubt if Mortis is used, that it will be in the 1st film. It would be to much of a risk. I am guessing that Disney will just a want a fun but safe swashbuckler for the first one, so audiences actually come back for the next two. Then if they are used, would be when they do.
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  9. Arawn_Fenn Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    The problem is that Lucas never "held" that concept. Some fans held it and falsely attached Lucas' name to it in an attempt to make it look legitimate. Lucas' view of the Force was always consistent with Mortis in this sense.

    They weren't avatars. According to the arc they came to Mortis in the distant past. As the opening narration stated the Son and Daughter aligned with the dark and light sides.

    On the other hand, the Father wanted Anakin to stay in Mortis to control the children, not knowing that the children would be dead by the end of the arc.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Mar 23, 2013
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  10. DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2002
    star 5
    You know what would have made the Mortis arc better, if they would have talked about it in the next episode, when they reported back to explain what happened to them to the council.
    Prodigy_Knight likes this.
  11. Prodigy_Knight Jedi Youngling

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    Mar 10, 2013
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    It sounds too good to be true :)
  12. Arawn_Fenn Force Ghost

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    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Feel free to provide a quote where Lucas calls the dark side "an external corruption of the Force".
  13. Darthgoodguy Jedi Knight

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    Nov 2, 2012
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    Add me to the "Love it!" column :)
  14. anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of CT, SW Saga and Lucasfilm Ltd

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    "I don't know how to explain it, Master Windu. We had a rough day and we all got a bit more stoned than usual that night."
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  15. TheManFromMortis Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 19, 2012
    star 3
    _ _ _ _

    I'd agree with that. If Mortis does figure in the ST, it wouldn't necessarily be particularly heavily featured in Episode VII. I think it could be something to move toward as the trilogy moves into Episodes VIII and IX. It may be hinted at, mentioned or, perhaps, even glimpsed in Episode VII, however.
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  16. Bobatron Jedi Master

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    Sep 3, 2012
    star 4
    I've felt all along elements of the Mortis arc would have something to do with this. Lucas got this idea and it may have even influenced his decision to do more conceptualizing of the next trilogy. Stuff like this is why it's going to be hard for the so-called fans to embrace the next trilogy. They're going to have to be open to it, just like they seem to be open to anything an author licensed by Lucasfilm puts in a book with the STAR WARS title on it. It fits the universe of STAR WARS better than some Yuzang Vong invasion stuff.
    Last edited by Bobatron, Mar 23, 2013
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  17. darklordoftech Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2012
    star 6
    Perhaps Anakin misinterpreted the vision to mean that Obi-Wan and Padme join Sidious.
  18. DarthMateous Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 1, 2002
    star 4
    I highly doubt it.
    the-jedi-prince likes this.
  19. the-jedi-prince Jedi Knight

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    Jun 2, 2011
    star 2
    i doubted an imaculate conception but it happened.
    ive found you cant rule anything out
  20. Ryus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 25, 2013
    star 4
    Sorry highly doubt it . Igner read the Lucas story treatments for episode 7 which he said had lots of potential before being shown the holocron and the whole EU. Simply put Mortis has a very compliceted backstory and if he is a major story element in VII then it is very likely a casual movie fan of the OT (logical guess based on his age) or even the PT likely would concider Mortis the deciding fact in a Litmus test of the story treatment, so penning such a complicted story on paper that risks becoming very contrived and having it pass such a Litmus test seems next to impossible to me.

    Next off Arnet just seems the wrong writer to hire if this was the premis of episode VII, sorry but the guy is way more into character relations and having amazingly quick and rewarding climaxes... not metaphysicial discussions. Kasdan also seems wrong to write this as well, as evidenced by the Dagobah Cave having a singular purpose and not a philosphical debate about like Mortis' purpose was. Finally I cant recall Kathleen Kennedy ever producing something like this before, even Spielburgs tripest movies never got close to this... and as to JJ Abrams well not even Lost or Fringe got this metaphysical, trippy sure but they where always about mystery first not metaphysicial.

    TCW episode wasnt as bad as FotJ Apocolaypse and I respect it for trying to get away from midcolrians but it was flawed to say the least on quite a few fronts, as evidenced by the plot itself forcing Anakin to have his memory erased just to get it to fit into the timeline. If we are going to get a balanced approach to the force please make it be more like the Dawn of the Jedi comics, instead of trapping a Skywalker on a planet for all time just to meditate two foolish acpects of the force... plus FotJ ended up with the Jedi and Sith armies having to hunt 'Mother' for all time as allies since she was just that overpowered, It literally impied the Jedis future destiny was to hunt tenticles that pop up of mother rather than have her whip out all life in the galaxys just to get the galaxy back on track destiny wise. Sorry but if this happens people will leave the theater and demand refunds, well the general public anyways since there will always be fans of something made into a movie.

    Sorry but as much as I want EU elements in the ST I'd die a happy man if this never gets brought into Disney's Star Wars. Plus the metaphysical stuff is just presented better on TV than on film, its the same reason why minus the 3 Star Trek films that played on Moby Dick (Wrath of Khan, First Contact, Star Trek 2009) Star Trek doesnt often work good in movie format. Its meant to debate something and that is best done on TV not the silverscreen. Once again Star Trek is a good example look at Star Trej the motion picture or Star Trek V, both where way more like the show but both are considered umon the worst Star Trek films ever... Even Serenity was adapted to be more film like vs the show it was based on Firefly for a reason. Tiny hints to the metaphyical in a movie is one thing but focusing on it just never works, look at The Matrix vs its sequals... in the first it was tiny back ground stuff but it the later thats all the movies where about and almost everyone hated the sequals but still likes the original.
    Last edited by Ryus, Mar 24, 2013
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  21. fett 4 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 2, 2000
    star 4
    Star Trek 6 The Undiscovered Country and The Voyage Home were both great films and neither were Moby Dick plots. I would argue that the best Trek films were about character development and issues in relation to Kirk. In 2 it was Kirks issues about age and never really dealing with death. In 4 it was about getting back what you had lost. In 6 It was dealing with the death of his son and his prejudices he had with Klingon's.

    I would also argue whether First Contact or 09 were good films. FC was the best of the TNG films but still really poor. While 09 while a fun action flick, was a lot of huff and puff with people running around but with a plot that was full of holes and ultimately forgettable.
  22. Ryus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 25, 2013
    star 4
    Lets not derail this too much... I agree Star Trek 3 and 6 where better than average Star Treks and yes of the NG First contact was the best of a low quality lot, plus 2009 wasnt much of a normal Star Trek movie. The point stands that the bulk of the better Star Trek movies had revenge/madness like in Moby Dick, even 6 and 3 had this theme but not as much as the others listed and more to the point, none of these where like any average Star Trek episode on TV which focused usually way more on making some sort of philosphicial point about something. Also only 1 of the movies really followed this and it subjectivly is also considered the worst by many.

    Now I respect your opinion of the better Star Trek movies but it derails my point of even Star Trek avoided getting too "deep" in its most successful movies and as such hopefully Star Wars will heed this leason and not make episode VII about the metaphysics of Mortis and family, they should save that for a TV show spinoff or spinoff movie marketed to a crowd that would appricate that more then the mass public whod likely leave the theather very upset if episode 7 wasnt the summer blockbuster they expected and turned out to be a much deeper metaphysical debate on the force, simply put keep it a mystery and magical and focus instead upon the characters and an amazing and rewarding climax to the movie (be ithappy like VI or dark like V)
  23. StoneRiver Jedi Grand Master

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    Oct 6, 2004
    star 4
    Thanks for liking my post Darthgoodguy.... but then I saw this...


    I'm not entirely sure you understood the intent behind my post ;)
  24. A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Riot Deterrent & WNU Welcome Mat

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    Modern "education" system at work... they simply do not teach proper irony, anymore. :(
  25. StoneRiver Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 6, 2004
    star 4
    Is it more ironic that you mention irony regarding a post that wasn't ironic but only clarified I was previously being sarcastic?

    Or is it ironic that I was being sarcastic but was taken seriously?

    I have some trousers that needs pressing... is that iron(ic)? [face_hypnotized]

    Sorry don't mean to derail - I'd rather Mortis not be in a feature film as part of the main saga.
    (Not a hint of sarcasm this time)
    Last edited by StoneRiver, Mar 26, 2013
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