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PT Could Obi-Wan have handled his conversation with Padme better?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by The Supreme Chancellor, Mar 13, 2013.

  1. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    That's not the problem, I think he should clearly tell Anakin he sneaked into her ship rather than just tell Anakin to stop when he showed up before Anakin.
     
  2. Jcuk

    Jcuk Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Mar 16, 2013
    Eh?
     
  3. Valairy Scot

    Valairy Scot Backpacking One Pack a Day Mod of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Re your "eh?": I believe Slowpokeking means Obi-Wan was morally obligated to tell Anakin he snuck onto Padme's ship and Anakin is not to blame her for his presence (he's on record as saying this before). In this case, Anakin would not have been angry at Padme and would not have choked her and perhaps she could have persuaded him to "fly away and be happy with her ever after."

    Did I paraphrase your opinion correctly, Slowpokeking - if not, sorry, and please clarify.
     
  4. Saintheart

    Saintheart Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2000
    On that point, I think emotions are driving everyone in that situation. Obi-Wan makes a few "obligatory" comments trying to convince Anakin to turn back, but when you look at their physical actions, it's clear he and Anakin are both shaping up for a fight right from the beginning of the scene. You could make the argument that Obi-Wan himself is actually spoiling for a fight, going by his actions and not his dialogue. He doesn't do anything to stop Anakin choking Padme; I got the impression with his line "Let. Her. Go." that the subtext is "Let. Her. Go. So. I. Can. Kick. Your. Butt." Obi-Wan does go and see if Padme's still alive while Anakin's ranting, but it's almost an afterthought. I get the impression Obi-Wan is focused completely on Anakin and so focused on controlling his own anger that almost every other consideration is blotted out.

    Let's remember this is a serious emotional moment for Obi-Wan, too: when he comes out onto that ramp, it's the first time he's seen, in person, the man who has murdered every friend Obi-Wan ever had at the Jedi Temple, including defenceless children. I could understand it if he was restraining or feeling immense, choking hatred for Anakin to the exclusion of all else. The entire scene is lit and reflects back hatred to the exclusion of all else; there's boiling lava, red glows, and darkness everywhere; Padme's cries of protest, of love, are (literally) suffocated, almost insignificant; it's not until Anakin is immolated that Obi-Wan seems to have a pang of conscience or pity; it's not until Obi-Wan is back on the ship, cruising away, that you get the sudden sense of his immense remorse, of his feeling that he handled the encounter completely wrong.
     
  5. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    "Let. Her. Go. So. I. Can. Kick. Your. Butt." - Robot Obi-Wan lol

    I disagree about Obi-Wan going to check on Padme though, I felt that in the beginnning of his conversation with Anakin he's killing time to circle around to Padme so that he can check on her. His main concern becomes her survival, until he realizes that there is no way both and he and Anakin are taking her for medical help.
     
  6. Sistros

    Sistros Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2010
    That's not the problem, I think he should clearly tell Anakin he sneaked into her ship rather than just tell Anakin to stop when he showed up before Anakin.
    ---------

    I was thinking this when I first saw it, and one of the reasons this scene falls flat to me.


    "YOU WERE WITH HIM!! YOU BROUGHT HIM HERE TO KILL ME"

    would a "uhhm, no not quite, she had no idea actually" been a bit too much like hard work especially since Anakin was choking her to death?
     
  7. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2012
    I just see it as Vader is so dark-side paranoid crazy at the point, it wouldn't have mattered if Obi-Wan had laid out his travel itinerary. He just wants to control and force everything into his worldview. Even by choking the woman he just turned to the dark side for. Dark side corrupts everything and all that.
     
  8. Kenneth Morgan

    Kenneth Morgan Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    May 27, 1999
    Actually, I think the conversation he could've handled better was the one he had with Anakin back in AOTC just before the second attempt on Padme's life. I mean, telling Ani that Padme, who he clearly loves and has proven herself honorable, that "she is a politician, and not to be trusted"? If he wanted to talk Ani out of a relationship with her, he could've been a bit more considerate, let alone honest. While it doesn't absolve Ani of what he ultimately did, it certainly helped fuel his later paranoia toward Kenobi.

    Sorry, I'm a bit off topic here. Anyway, the later conversation with Padme occurred after the initial damage had been done.
     
  9. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 21, 2012
    But he still loves Padme, Obi Wan should at least let him know Padme didn't know it.
     
  10. Ambervikings91

    Ambervikings91 Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Dec 1, 2012
    A lot of things probably could have been handled better, didn't have much time to figure things out though. He did the best he could
     
  11. Chewbacca89

    Chewbacca89 Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 25, 2012
    Even if Anakin did surrender and "redeem" himself, he would probably spend the rest of his life in prison, right?
     
  12. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    Nope. Redeemed Jedi aren't punished, their kinda just allowed to walk away.
     
  13. HevyDevy

    HevyDevy Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 13, 2011
    I also think Obi-Wan should have made it clear that Padme hadn't intentionally brought him there. I mean Anakin was already crazy for not wanting to run away with Padme and abandon his quest for power, then Obi-Wan makes it appear so much worse. If he wanted to redeem Anakin like stated in ROTJ he sure didn't act like he was in the mood to reason with him. Sigh, one of many mistakes by PT characters that contributed to the good guys' downfall.
     
  14. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    By that point Anakin still thought Padme would die from childbirth and he was SOOO close to mastering the dark-side and power to save her. He had already murdered and betrayed all his former friends "Why turn back now?"

    Also I hate when ppl take Vader's "Obi-Wan once thought as you do" and interpret it to mean that Obi-Wan was supposed to try and redeem Anakin. It may have meant so back then, but taking it from an in-universe perspective after the PT it can be interpreted as Obi-Wan being the only person who genuinely believed in Anakin and thought he would fulfill the prophecy and become the greatest of all the Jedi. Politicians tried using him and the Council distrusted him, but Obi-Wan was the one person who always had faith in him. You can see it in Obi-Wan's reaction from seeing the holovids. He SEES Anakin murder the younglings with his own eyes yet he still mumbles "It can't be. It can't be."

    In ROTJ Vader now see's that same faith Obi-Wan once had in him, in Luke.
     
    minnishe likes this.
  15. HevyDevy

    HevyDevy Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 13, 2011
    You have a point, but I think Anakin as he was before he turned would have jumped at the opportunity. IMO part of the impact of his fall is the fact that he doesn't go with her. By this stage he has fallen too far, and obtaining the power to save Padme has become obtaining the power for power's sake.

    I agree that Obi-Wan's reaction to the holovid, plus his follow up comment "He is like my brother" indicates he believes Anakin is still somewhat redeemable. But Obi-Wan wasn't neccesarilly that much better than the Council in regards to the plotting between the Council and Palpatine. He is, afterall, the person who informs Anakin he shall spy on Palpatine, and when Padme asks "You're going to kill him, aren't you?" he doesn't say no.
    I wholeheartedly agree that there is still a link here between Obi-Wan's hesitation to deal with Anakin, and Luke's belief in Anakin's good nature deep down.
     
  16. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    HevyDevy, I agree Obi-Wan was involved in the plotting on the side of the Jedi, but unlike everyone else he never WANTED to put Anakin in that position. He is such a by-the-book Jedi that he chose his duty to the Council over his duty to his friend. Anakin was the exact opposite.