Could Sidious have been involved in Padme's death?

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith' started by Darth_Infernous, Jan 3, 2006.

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  1. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

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  2. RebelScum77 Manager Emeritus

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    Aug 3, 2003
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    Why would Palpatine kill Padme when she was doing such a good job putting a wedge between Anakin and the Jedi? I mean Palpy even helped throw them together at the beginning of AotC. She's serving her purpose in his grand scheme. By the time RotS rolls arounds, Sidious exploits her pregnancy to turn Anakin. After he's turned she becomes a non-issue. Even her desperate pleading wasn't enough to turn Anakin back, and Sidious knew she'd never allow herself to be delusioned by the dark side. She is no real threat to him.
  3. Kirk_Kanos Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2006
    Yes but Killing Padme was is his interest when it is Anakin who thinks he has done it, As for not why didn't he just do this to the jedi, maybe the force within them prevented him from doing so, now I know Padme was a strong women and obviously all things contain the force, but she did not have the ability as the jedi do to manipulate it to use it to do there biding, And maybe it was his plan all along and thats why she was not killed in previous attempts, being it that the Jedi and the Sith seem to have an ability to see the future maybe unclearly, but perhaps he seen she was to play a part, which also brings the point that was she ever in danger to begin with through child birth, was the dream simple a image telepathicly sent from Sidious to Anakin, in order to turn him and then with Anakin thinking she would die and Sidious wishing it and these been two of the most powerful with mind control, would it not be possible to say that they both did kill her in the end.
  4. mjerome3 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2000
    star 6
    Anakin broke her heart. She died because of it. Depression can kill you and imagine the shock on her face when Skywalker starts talking about ruling the galaxy and then her reaction afterwards. Too much depression can have negative influences on the mind and body. So, it's realistic for her to die the way she did.
  5. Kirk_Kanos Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2006
    Yes I agree that shock and depression, can kill, it happens every day how often do we see two elderly people and one of them takes ill and dies, then the other passes away shortly after even though they seemed in fine health, is this because they feel they have nothing to live for. But hadn't she everything to live for, twins in fact.

    I do not disagree with you, I was mearly saying in my last post, "is this not also possible" or "could it have been like this" for your veiws on it.
  6. chibiangi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2002
    star 4
    Not to side-track, but I believe that, as a non-obsessed fan and others have agreed with me, it is implied in the movie during the scene at the bubble dance or whatever it is that Sidious manipulated the midichlorians to "create life" ie Anakin. I think that stands as evidence in the films. There isn't any evidence implied or otherwise that Sidious had anything to do with Padme's death. Her death just happened to work in his favor.
  7. JarJarPlagueis Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 24, 2005
    star 1
    While in no way conclusive, there is some evidence in the film: Padme dies while Vader is on the operating table. Word of her death could not possibly hae spread. So how would he have known unless he was involved somehow?

    He didn't even know that Padme was on Mustafar, so it seems difficult to suggest that, based upon his knowing that she was there, that Anakin killed her. Of course, one could also ask how he knew that Anakin attacked her? Maybe he felt it in The Force? Maybe he felt the attack on her through The Force because he's so attuned to Anakin and it was such an emotional event for him. Then he felt Padme die and just assumed Anakin's attack is what killed her?

    Some would suggest that Padme and Anakin aren't both on the operating table at the same time and this was just dramatic effect? Even if so, it's still quite some time before Padme is revealed to have died, so we're still left with the problem of Palpatine's knowledge.

    Or maybe he did kill her and that's how he knew? Again, it's not conclusive, but since he knw she died from the moment it happened, it does suggest he has some special knowledge beyond "word of her death spreading," and this leaves the door open for involvement.

  8. PMT99 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2000
    star 4
    And Sidious is the reason why Padme humiliated Nute Gunray because he allowed her to go back to Naboo.

    When Sidious said to wipe out "all of them", he wasn't just referring to only the Jedi and the Gungan Army because also note that he didn't tell Gunray to make Padme sign the treaty since he didn't have anymore use for her now that he's elected Supreme Chancellor so its obivious that Sidious wants Padme dead as well.

    That wouldn't be a very smart thing for Sidious to do since he'll risk exposing himself to the Jedi that came with him to Naboo before he has managed to gain control of the Republic.

    And risk having Anakin interrogate the assassins on who sent them? Again, that's not very smart for Sidious to do something like that.

    Killing Padme IS on Sidious's priority list because he knows that aside from himself, Padme could be a powerful influence not only to all the Senators in the Republic but also to Anakin because as long as she's alive, Anakin will never fully convert to the Dark Side so Sidious would want to get rid of her but he has to do it in ways that doesn't implicate himself.
  9. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    that's it, in a nutshell. doesn't mean that he actually killed her before he had anakin converted. just means it was something that he had on his priority list.
  10. yoshifett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2004
    star 5
    Maybe Palpatine is just a huge liar.

    "I love democracy"
  11. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9

    Palpatine was told that Padme Amidala was dead. Word of her death got out quickly, by request of the Jedi and Bail Organa. The birth of Vader actually took place after Padme dies. It's same time and same place for symbolic reasoning. Anakin and Padme are dying, only one is physically and one is metaphoric.

    And how can he stop her from going? She went on her own, which shocked him. He had no clue that was going to happen. He thought her easily controled.

    No, it's not. Otherwise we wouldn't be having this discussion. Nute still wants that treaty signed. And Sidious neither tells him to get it or not. Just to prepare for her return.

    One swipe of a Lightsaber while visiting her apartment on Courscant, wouldn't bring down their attention on him.

    Have Dooku hire them. That's what the Apprentice does. Or you know, hire them as Darth Sidious.

    And yet, according to logic and reason, Anakin still joins Sidious knowing this. Your arguement is flawed, since he joins him either way. But if Sidious doesn't want her dead, then Anakin cannot sense his thoughts and thus will swallow his poodoo.
  12. JASTERSLEGACEYV2 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2005
    star 1
    Darth_Zom posted: As far as I recall, he only directly committed one murder himself--that of Mace Windu.[/quote]


    acually he killed the other 2 or 3 jedi mace had with him (read my psot if you want a consperacey thoery about her death)
  13. lightthunder1 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 11, 2005
    star 1



    acually he killed the other 2 or 3 jedi mace had with him (read my psot if you want a consperacey thoery about her death)[/quote]

    he could have been so Padme could not get in the way and turn anakin back to the light side. But no one knows about that one yet
  14. Kirk_Kanos Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2006
    he could have been so Padme could not get in the way and turn anakin back to the light side. But no one knows about that one yet[/quote]

    I have said that before and agree, was it not his love for Luke in the end that turned him back when he realised, therefore Padme had to be gotten rid of, but not until she too played her part in his turn to the dark side
  15. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    the argument ain't flawed. padme would be a threat to palps' plans with or without anakin. the girl's got principles. and he will not want anakin to be committed outside the sith thing he's gotten himself into.
    what's the flaw? that he hasn't dispatched her while anakin is still busy with the jedicide? what do you mean?
    i think you mean anakin is already fully committed, right? well, no he isn't. he is never fully committed to the sith thing, at least not until he has killed her.
  16. Kirk_Kanos Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2006
    ANother great point Dart_farred, His love to Padme would be of concern to Sid, because it could stop his complete turn to the darkside.

    It has to also be said that it was his love for Padme that started his turn, for that was going against all the jedi principles, he knew he was doing wrong and it was not aloud, So Sid used her as his tool basicly to do his bidding.
  17. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    thanks. :) not sure he used her as a tool.

    i'm more or less thinking the jedi didn't allow their members relationships outside the order, and the sith neither.

    so, while he had to get rid of her for political reasons, he would have to keep her from anakin all the same. i mean, imagine: anakin coming home from some sith mission to his kids? nah, sid could never have him stay with his marriage.

    he doesn't ahve a hand in her death as it happens, i guess. it was sheer convenience that anakin had the proverbial hand in it.
  18. Darth_Infernous Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 3, 2005
    star 1

    I completely agree with this, and Padme dying also benefits Palpatine in the respect that the guilt and grief her death caused Anakin further spiralled his decline into the dark side, just like if Anakin's mother hadn't died he may not have turned to evil, after all its raw emotion that fuels the Sith and Anakin had great difficulty suppressing his emotion.

    So you have to ask if Padme had not died during childbirth for whatever reason, then surely Palpatine would have got her out the picture anyway?[face_thinking]
  19. yoshifett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2004
    star 5
    he could have been so Padme could not get in the way and turn anakin back to the light side. But no one knows about that one yet[/quote]

    Oh, it wasn't murder, it was self-defense!
  20. THEFORCEROCKS Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2004
    star 4
    By the time RotS rolls arounds, Sidious exploits her pregnancy to turn Anakin. After he's turned she becomes a non-issue. Even her desperate pleading wasn't enough to turn Anakin back, and Sidious knew she'd never allow herself to be delusioned by the dark side. She is no real threat to him.



    Rebel Scum Padme is always a threat a reminder of Anakin Skywalker Palps wants none of that that is why her children especially Luke are a threat. "The Son of Skywalker must not become a JEDI, it will be our undoing."


    He just needed her out of the way, so that he could get someone who he could manipulate to give him Emergency Powers. That's what he really wanted.

    Yeah and he really wants her out of the way when she starts exerting her authority in ROTS as the seeds of the Rebellion are being started.
  21. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    Padme's death would be necessary, but it would be set up on his own accord and done in such a way to cement Anakin's loyalities to him. By that I mean manipulating him directly into killing her. Not killing her himself and then making it look like Anakin did it.


    There is nothing to prove that he had a part in her death. He just got lucky that Obi-wan stowed away and thus sent Anakin into a fit of rage, which would kill her.
  22. TheCRZA Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 29, 2005
    star 4
    After he's turned she becomes a non-issue. Even her desperate pleading wasn't enough to turn Anakin back, and Sidious knew she'd never allow herself to be delusioned by the dark side. She is no real threat to him.

    Have to wonder if perhaps, Padme as the mother of twins, is that
    inconsequential to Palpatine?
    Anakin was ruled by emotions from the middle of the film, on.
    If Padme has survived, and Anakin given time to settle down and think,
    I think her sway over him is not so easy to dismiss as you portray it to be.

    Don't you think that Anakin's world would be rocked as a new father
    after what he'd just done to those jedi kids?

    Remember, Anakin's real asset to Palpatine is to be
    on his team... to not be opposed to him.
    Had Padme survived, she would have been a risk to Anakin's soul,
    and thus a risk to Palpatine's plan.

    Else, why do you think Luke is able to help Anakin find
    balance at the end of ROTJ?

    The problem is that, as portrayed, Padme can't survive.
    It's pretty well academic and hypothetical.

  23. PMT99 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2000
    star 4
    And yet, PalpSidious turned it into an advantage for him because not only did the public knowledge on the Battle of Naboo help him win his election but he also made Nute Gunray his vicious attack-dog to keep Padme at bay.

    But why didn't he tell Gunray to keep Padme alive? If PalpSidious isn't interested in killing her as you suggest, he would've told Gunray "Wipe them out but leave Queen Amidala alive. I still want her to sign the treaty."

    But he would bring Anakin's attention to Palps since Ani likes to spend some quality time with Padme and killing her would force Anakin to slice of Palps' head.

    Agreed about Dooku hiring them but having Sidious hiring the assassins as "Darth Sidious takes us back to the "risking exposure" part. The Jedi will become aware of Sidious much earlier instead of at the end of AOTC.

    Darth_Fared already covered this but despite that Anakin helps Sidious commit genocide upon the Jedi, he's still not fully committed to the Sith because if Padme was still around she could still drive a wedge between Anakin and PalpSidious by convincing Ani that his "friend and mentor" was the one trying to kill her.

    As it is, with Anakin/Vader being tricked into thinking that he killed Padme, his fate was sealed as he now becomes PalpSidious' slave.
  24. Darth_Infernous Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 3, 2005
    star 1
    Padme's last words were actually "There is good in him, I know there is," which suggests to me she didn't die of a broken heart and despair because these words show she still had faith in Anakin, after all he was her soulmate, and she was right, because there was good in him. So I don't think she simply lost the will to live.
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