PT "Count Dooku was once a Jedi. He couldn't assassinate anyone."

They never claimed he was incapable of doing anything un-Jedi-like. Leading a movement committed to secession from the Republic is obviously very un-Jedi-like.

What Mace and Ki-Adi claimed is that he was incapable of murder, because of his status as a former Jedi. Of course this is faulty reasoning. Notice that Yoda is conspicuously silent.

 

The point of the comment is that Mace still holds Dooku(who was once his close friend) in very high esteem, and is offended that Padme would implicate him. Mace is being defensive...and(uh-oh)acting a little bit emotionally.

Also, he's saying Dooku wouldn't assassinate anyone "It's not in his character" because he's Dooku, not simply because he's a former Jedi. I will paraphrase the remark:

After shaking off the surprise of such an accusation "Look here, mmm'lady(sardonically), Count Dooku wouldn't assassinate anyone. Did you not know he used to be a Jedi? Oh, we're Jedi too, so we know Count Dooku better than you. It's not in his character."

Ki Adi Mundi unemotionally agrees. And you have to admit, the accusation comes very much out of left field. Dooku has nothing to gain(that we yet know of) by assassinating Padme.

At this point, some of the Jedi see Dooku leaving as a great loss to the order, and still have a lot of respect for him.

 

Saw no hint of offense from Mace, nor him being 'emotionally' defensive. He offers a clarifying and calm tone, nothing more.

 

Also, the fact that Ki Adi Mundi refers to him as a "political idealist, not a murderer" makes even more sense to me-the two are in fact very different. I also like that statement, cos it really exemplifies how the Jedi order views the separatists-as idealists with differing points of view, rather than enemies. That is a very Jedi-like mentality and stance to take.

 

That line is written and acted extremely defensively. Not sure how it could even be argued otherwise. Not sure how to even argue the point without delving into how basic human emotions are communicated.

 

That's how it comes across to me. I don't if I'd say extremely defensive, but certainly a little defensive that someone would implicate his old pal(probably life long friend) in such a grizzly act.

 

'Extremely'?!

He's defending Dooku, yes. But not in any 'emotional' or 'extreme' way.

 

If there's any emotion from Mace, it's a bit of condensation. But being a political idealist is not a sign that Dooku was evil, as it comes across from Ki-Adi that this was nothing new on his part. The Council had just believed that he was talking a good game, but was not going to condone an action that would lead to war.

 

I have condensation on my face right now, too.

 

Yup, and Jedi are keepers of the peace! Not soldiers!

See that amazing peacekeeping that they're doing?

 

Well, I believe that's the point. They're being pushed by circumstances into the role of soldiers, which is something they can do very well and indeed take very naturally to, even as it corrodes their souls. The Jedi are warrior-diplomats. What the Clone War does is strip the diplomat part away, leaving only the warrior. It throws the Jedi out of balance with themselves.

 

If we go by actual definitions of peacekeeping instead of assuming it must mean, I don't know, weaponless pacifism, because it has the word 'peace' in it, it's not wrong though.

For example, the UN: https://peacekeeping.un.org/en/what-is-peacekeeping

"Non-use of force except in self-defence and defence of the mandate."

https://peacekeeping.un.org/en/principles-of-peacekeeping
"In certain volatile situations, the Security Council has given UN peacekeeping operations “robust” mandates authorizing them to “use all necessary means” to deter forceful attempts to disrupt the political process, protect civilians under imminent threat of physical attack, and/or assist the national authorities in maintaining law and order."

Believe it or not, if you come at peacekeeping forces in real life with a deadly weapon and demonstrated intent to kill, there is a nonzero chance you will die.

At a glance, the biggest policy difference between the UN and the Republic in this area seems to be that the Republic apparently does not distinguish between peacekeeping and peace enforcement - or at least, seems to generally operate under the peacekeeping category (the consent of all parties, ex: the Senate and individual planetary governments consenting for Jedi to operate on their soil) and only resorts to peace enforcement (the consent of both parties is not required) when the Separatists are already gearing up for war in blatant disregard of the previous talks and other diplomatic efforts.

 

I'm pretty sure the assault on Geonosis would cross the line from peace enforcement to outright war between belligerents. At that point the Supreme Chancellor has been granted Emergency Powers and authorized the formation of an army to oppose the Confederacy of Independent Systems, and command of that army has presumably officially devolved to the Jedi.

 

Perhaps in this instance, but I remember you also claimed he wasn't emotional in the scene where Anakin turns.

Edit - Just to clarify my stance, I think it is pretty obvious that Mace is letting his pride cloud his opinion of an old friend, Dooku.

 

UN Peacekeepers

 

IIRC, what I claimed is that he didn't try to strike Sidious out of anger or hatred. He didn't let emotions dictate his actions. I can discuss this in the appropriate thread, if you want.

What pride? He's stating his opinion based on his knowledge of (and past familiarity with) Dooku against what is, at the end of the day, a baseless accusation. You could make the argument that he was letting his pride cloud his judgement if he was ignoring facts. Padmé presented no facts or anything to support her claim. Only an assumption (that we only know to be correct later on).

 

I think that the line should focus on the "not in his character" rather than he was "once a Jedi"

so instead, see the sentence as this "count Dooku was once was Jedi (hence I knew him personally) he couldn't assassinate anyone, it's not in his character.

Edit: this is in reference to the OP.