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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Lit Cult Encounters and Supernatural Encounters (even more new Legends material!)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Sinrebirth , Dec 26, 2017.

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  1. Darth Invictus

    Darth Invictus Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Aug 8, 2016
    So that does mean that Yun-Yuuzhan literally strode down the path of the gods and cut away parts of himself to form every star, world and Galaxy eventually ending with the yuuzhan Vong?
     
  2. Hamburger_Time

    Hamburger_Time Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Dec 13, 2010
    Well there are actually nine Old Ones - the two trinities, and three not assigned to either.
     
  3. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    That’s convoluted, because the Father of the Shadows is Typhojem... and Abeloth is a successor of the Old Ones and a One.


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  4. Hamburger_Time

    Hamburger_Time Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Dec 13, 2010
    Also, anyone notice a sort of Norse mythology motif to these dark beings? Muspili, Gunninga Gap, the Soulworm condemned to eternally gnaw on itself...
     
  5. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

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    Jan 3, 2013
    Definitely, although really the ourobouros imagery is not limited to any one particular mythological tradition.
     
  6. DarthJaceus

    DarthJaceus Jedi Knight star 2

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    Dec 6, 2016
    Is the Supernatural Encounters still coming out in October? I thought I read that somewhere on this forum. Am I making that up?
     
  7. Hamburger_Time

    Hamburger_Time Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Dec 13, 2010
    It really does feel like late Legends was... building to something with all of this. Not just these articles but FOTJ, Mindor, Book of Sith, Shadows of Endor, The Unknown Regions, the TOR "Machine Gods"...

    I really wonder what we'd have gotten out of this stuff, if the reboot hadn't happened.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2018
  8. Ghost

    Ghost Chosen One star 8

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    Oct 13, 2003
    Though they are cool concepts... when you begin to think about it, I'm also afraid it was twisting Legends-EU into something that no longer felt true to the spirit of the movies.

    One author saying "these are the cool progenitors, even more advanced than the present!"
    Another author saying the same thing.
    Someone else reconciling how these two, both who supposedly ruled the galaxy in the past, were in an arms race.
    And then someone else says there are even OLDER progenitors, even more advanced... etc.

    Until basically, the farther into the past you go, the more powerful and knowledgeable the galaxy was... nothing in the galaxy has ever improved, only gotten worse... and whether the newest Oldest-Progenitors are good or evil depends on that particular author's personal philosophy and how nihilistic or not they are. And the entire history of the galaxy, instead of some advancement with some dark ages, or even just steadiness with some dark ages, just becomes the story of a steep decline and a pessimistic outlook, how everything generally gets worse over time when looking at the big picture, and a lack of hope. Especially lack of hope when it comes to ordinary people of the galaxy when contending with "Gods", and how even people we previously thought of as "regular" turn out to only be part of a divine bloodline or prophecy, controlled by the Gods with no choice and no hope for individuality.

    Just not Star Wars beyond appearance.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2018
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  9. darklordoftech

    darklordoftech Force Ghost star 6

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    Sep 30, 2012
    I feel like it would have made sense for the Legends canon to end with Luke destroying the Old Ones.

    Here's the timeline I would have liked to see:

    ~ 25,000 BBY: Hundred-Year Darkness splits the Je'daii into the Jedi and Sith

    ~ 25,000 BBY - 4 ABY: Endless Jedi vs. Sith conflict followed by the movies

    Immediately after ROTJ: the Dark Empire Saga

    Sometime after the Dark Empire Saga: The Thrawn Trilogy

    NJO Era: Rakata or True Sith invade instead of the Vong

    Post-NJO: Luke battles the Old Ones. Ultimately, Luke destroys the Old Ones and everyone lives happily ever after.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2018
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  10. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

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    Sep 2, 2012
    Hmm. The Dark Siders at the time of the Legacy comic era could fight Typhojem.
    Gorog could try to force the Kiliks and Ewoks under it's sway to stop them from helping out in the war.
    Not sure what the others could do.
    Though some battle near the heart of the Galaxy could free the Soulworm.
     
  11. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

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    Jan 3, 2013
    Honestly, though? There's a reason why I barely if ever post in this thread even though more generally I'm kind of a sucker for this subgenre. FOTJ's esoteric elements were never going anywhere; 90 percent of this stuff was really just the product of after-the-fact connective retcons, or at the most people drawing upon the same references for background. It's cool, but it's also the perfect example of how I used to like to say the EU was less than the sum of its parts. It wasn't ultimately "building" to anything any more than some of Zahn's stuff up to VotF was.

    (I don't object to fans trying to piece it all together, mind you - I personally am just juggling way too many creative projects already.)
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2018
  12. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    Three months until Supernatural Encounters...

    ... which is confirmed to include Wutzek and Typhojem.


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  13. Hamburger_Time

    Hamburger_Time Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Dec 13, 2010
    And the Bedlam Spirits too - I'm excited to learn how Tilotny and Horliss fit in, as they weren't mentioned at all in the first one.
     
  14. Darth Invictus

    Darth Invictus Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Aug 8, 2016
    Thinking of palpatine especially DE palpatine how does he fit into this cosmic arena?
     
  15. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    I take it that he is the reason the Father began to die; the source of an imbalance.

    The beginning of a new Pantheon, perhaps.

    The Skywalker Family subsequently interfering... the Chosen One trying to balance out the Imbalance, and then falling to it... the Son and Daughter rising to oppose them, but the Chosen One ultimately killing Palpatine at the cusp of victory and undoing his control of the galaxy sufficiently that the Son and Daughter could destroy him.

    Of course that Pantheon had their own issues... the Mother, who never developed her powers to the level of Ones, and three Children... the Father, with the Son... with Abeloth as the potential imbalance, and the Tribe and One Sith birthing refining their own darksiders that were considered part of the new order...


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  16. Hamburger_Time

    Hamburger_Time Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Dec 13, 2010
    I'm also intrigued by the article's mentioning good gods who opposed the Old Ones, like the Ewok sun god. What are they, I wonder? Celestials?
     
  17. Darth Invictus

    Darth Invictus Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Aug 8, 2016
    One thing I have observed about the celestials is that they seemed to observe and perhaps even watch over humans and duros.

    The Sharu seemed to enter their area of influence and were apparently so terrified that they retreated into primitivism.

    The celestials also created the Corellian system and appear to have transplanted the humans there.

    What interest did the celestials have in humans? And perhaps Duros as well? Why did they seem to have a sort of protective shield around them(at least until the Rakata appeared)-it may the celestials that were the reason human ancestors made it to Nagai and Csilla.

    Could they have had some subtle influence on human civilization in ancient times, perhaps even some sort of paternal ownership of less advanced species in which humans were at one time?
     
  18. Hamburger_Time

    Hamburger_Time Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Dec 13, 2010
    Are there any other beings suspected of being Celestials? The Mortis Trinity are dead, but could there be others still around?
     
  19. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    Wutzek?


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  20. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    The full name, historically, for Gorog was Tharagorrogaraht. Tharagorrogaraht was a violet-blue insect, known as the Night Herald and Night Queen. If you look at it, is a separation of Tharaaraht and Gorrog.

    Gorrog became Gorog, a giant monster and a Dark Nest of the Killiks. There are connections with other Nests left on Alderaan that were led by a Night Herald, curiously.

    However, what of Tharaaraht? There is one Nest which corresponds to that name - Thuruht. This Nest is the one which the Celestials then to when they need to seal away Abeloth.

    Thus, with some thought, we have even more suggestions for the events of 30,000 BBY. The Old Ones seized control of Tharagorrogaraht, engineering a civil war within the Nest, which split them in two. Some where thrown into the Unknown Regions, and much of the Nests emptied from Alderaan, but we now have more certainty as to the chain of events - as the Rakata and Kwa warred, Abeloth escaped and the Old Ones made their move - thus the Killiks attack Korriban, thus the Night Herald being exiled to Sarafur, near the Night Realm, thus the darkness of the Old Ones being incorporated into the Colony Killik hive mind, a hive mind that is not reconstituted until 28 ABY.

    But here’s the more terrifying concept.

    Gorog comes from the centre of the name of the original Nest. Of blue aliens.

    Chiss naming conventions, anyone?


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  21. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

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    Sep 2, 2012
    How on Earth did you think that one up @Sinrebirth? It works but how?
     
  22. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    It’s been tickling in my mind for weeks. Just been working on the rest of it, tinkering, and then after reading Thrawn: Alliances...

    It came together.

    ... It makes me suspicious of the humans on Zakuul and Csilla... the latter of which evolved differently after 30,000 BBY... the former of which erected an empire at about the same time the Gree and Rakata Empires were at their height...

    ... humans who worshipped the Old Ones, cast off? Sealed in the Unknown Regions?


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  23. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

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    Sep 2, 2012
    This makes me tempted to read the Dark Nest Trilogy again and see how your theory makes me view the story.
     
  24. darklordoftech

    darklordoftech Force Ghost star 6

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    Sep 30, 2012
    Are you suggesting that the Greater Dieties created the Font of Power and Pool of Knowledge or are you suggesting that Abeloth was corrupted before that?
     
  25. Hamburger_Time

    Hamburger_Time Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Dec 13, 2010
    Since we know of at least one evil Celestial (the Son of Mortis), I wonder if there are any good Old Ones, too.
     
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