Amph Cue The "Super Friends" Theme! - DC "CW-verse" Discussion

Count me on team 'this episode was awesome'!

I think I might have woken my housemates with my very loud laughter at the "I am your father" crack.

 

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I really enjoyed tonight's episode overall. "Is there ever going to be a time where everything I say isn't a double entendre? That's the Felicity I know and love.

On the one hand, I get where Lance is coming from. He's betrayed primarily. By Laurel and by the Arrow because they concealed Sarah's death from him. And Oliver lied to him many times. So he feels like a fool. And he's not necessarily wrong that he started it all. Buuuuuut, he's forgetting about a lot of good: Without him, the Glades would have been destroyed in Malcolm's Undertaking. Laurel likely would have been dead by now too. He might be right to blame Oliver for Slade, but Blood was still probably going to pop up somewhere and with the glades destroyed, someone would still rise up, whether it was Malcolm or another one like "The Mayor", someone would have taken out the rest of the Starling PD. And even if Sarah had still found Ra's and come back to Starling, she would still likely be dead or Quentin would never know she was alive because it was Oliver who convinced her to even reveal herself to him. And more recently, Lance should be thinking of Brick. Without team Arrow, Brick would be running whatever was left of the glades or another part of Starling. So sure, it is easy to blame Ollie, but if he did look at it objectively, Starling was screwed thanks to Malcolm no matter what. Which really means Thea is probably right and he should die.

I do hope there is some way for Quentin to get past all this. I know he's hurting now, but it would be really upsetting if all that character development he underwent pretty much reverted right back to where we began in Season 1.

 

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Sara coming back seems the only way he can get past this. I can only imagine her coming back and being ashamed at what he's done in her name knocking him back into reality. It'll be hard to fight Oliver over Sara when Sara is on Oliver's side.

 

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she totally just jumped off with no rescue plan

 

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Yeah, but she also jumps off at almost the same spot as Oliver, and she pauses long enough for him to slow down when he hits the brake point on the throw line while still being below her. So she might have been intending for Oliver to catch her all along.

 

Unless... Barry's eventual time travel saves not his mother, but Wells? I can't think of another reason why they showed us that flashback...

 

All I'm going to say is that is one high-up parking complex.

I liked this episode but it didn't really floor me.

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Shado had an identical twin sister? Who was only there to reaffirm the tacked-on theme of "The Truth is Powerful"? Ehhhh. That was really unnecessary. I mean unless May (Mai?) is there because of Argus/League of Shadows. That might make more sense. Or she's a resurrected Shado because of Lazarus Pits? If it's something like that I'm totally game, but if she's really just a twin sister, then we need that to become even more comic book-y because hot damn you can do so much crazy stuff with that beyond "emotional and thematic resonance for two minutes."

Lance's actions make sense but for a cop who's been pretty rational for most of the show he's kind of going off the deep end. I mean during Brick's activities in the Glades he was pretty happy Ollie was back. And his face when Ra's told him Ollie was the Arrow was a bit odd. No surprise, just, "Oh, okay." They're clearly speeding towards an endgame, and I suspect that endgame will be Ollie becoming Ra's' true heir. I don't know how that's going to work, and the Batman fan in me keeps thinking this is Bruce Wayne: Fugitive/Murderer except with Green Arrow. As good as this show can be it keeps reminding me we could have an amazing Batman show

 

It all depends on what sort of time travel rules they're going with.

I liked this episode a lot - villain of the week was fun (Hamill knows how to put the Ham in Arkham AND, uh, Central City...ham), villain of the week included a bunch of fun nods to the old series (Shipp looked like he was really enjoying the whole "The Flash will stop you" bit, and it was a really fun passing of the torch), not to mention we had some quality development in the season's arc.

 

yeah, i peed myself iwth the "I am your father" scene! It was great!

Really confused with Wells and the Thawne twist now...which is good.

 

This last episode has also had me wondering about the possibility that he might succeed in saving his mother, but lose his father instead.

 

well, remember that whenever teh past is altered it gets WORSE, not better, despite your intentions...so he might lose them both...OR Wells adn then lose his powers????

 

I am having a hard time getting through season 1 or 2...can't remember which....does it get better?

 

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As we know from last night, it didn't matter. Oliver inspired her to become the Black Canary because he was the Arrow. Remember, she realized that the Arrow was Oliver and started her own vigilante justice, which lead her to Syn. He blames Ra's for training her, but he blames Oliver more for decision to become a vigilante just like all the others. Like I said, he's a man in pain and this is his only recourse is to shut it all down. Even if it meant throwing Laurel under the bus. Note that when she pointed out the real reason he's upset, he got very agitated and backed himself into a corner. He knows that he's wrong, but he's so blinded by rage that he cannot see the forest through the trees.

I, personally, thought it was Ra's who was going to break Oliver out and kill Quentin, thus forcing him to accept.

 

To answer the question of

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what is Harrison's Welles connection to Eobard Thawne. No, he's going to try and save his mother and screw up everything in the process.

 

Ultimately he's going to be put in the situation we saw in the opening. He can either save his mother or save himself. I don't see how he can do both. And we know from Thawne's pre-time travel confession that Nora wasn't the target. It was always Barry. Which means unless Barry saves himself, he's dead.

 

As a huge fan of both Star Wars & the original Flash TV series (1990-1991), it was excellent to see Mark Hamill back as the Trickster; great episode. Especially liked the "I am your Father" line that the Hamill Trickster told the younger Trickster. I was also amused by the Hamill Trickster hitting on the much younger Iris - Luke Skywalker would never have done anything like that

Hamill looked shorter than I remember him - in fact, I can't remember the last time I've seen him in a TV show/movie....

And, did not see it coming that Harrison Wells is not really Harrison Wells - surprising revelation there.

 

So, a potential theory I was thinking of last night...

The lesson that they've been hammering home to us for the better part of half a season now is "changing the past is dangerous and unpredictable." We see Thawne-as-Wells continue to do it and keep checking the timeline to make sure it's where it's supposed to be, but Barry's not got the history lesson that Thawne does to go back and change things.

However... why can't Barry go change the future? Stop Thawne in whatever 200-300 years in the future timestream? Or go forwards to 2024 when the Crisis headline is and get that Barry to go back and create another alt-universe like he just did to prevent Cisco's death?

We can surmise that Barry will lose his powers in this timeline (the reactor won't be built until 2020, rather than 2014) but if the lightning had always chosen him as expected (and he got his powers some other way with the reactor working in 2020 and still becoming The Flash) it may be temporary...

 

My theory is that in the season finale RF will succeed in going back to 2024/2040 wherever he came from last.

 

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Unless the two Barry's are present, one who saves Nora and one who saves himself and thus screwing up the timeline.

The problem is that if you mess with time too much, it will cause problems of a great magnitude. That's why

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the Time Masters and the Linear Men existed. That's why Rip Hunter served as the guardian of time, because he didn't want someone to go around monkeying with time whenever they felt like it. And since he's going to be part of this universe, that subject will wind up coming up.

 

That is a possibility. Which then would lead to the question of

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should Oliver use the Lazarus Pit or not to save him? Which would mean taking Ra's up on his offer.

 

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Going by the trailer, Ras goes after Thea. Either kidnaps or kills her, and that'll probably force Oliver to join him to keep her safe or bring her back with the Lazarus pit. All of Oliver's decisions have mostly been for Thea's benefit so him joining the League because of her makes the most sense.

 

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He may not even take up Ras' mantle necessarily. All we know is that he uses their uniform. Since Roy has taken the fall for being the Arrow, in order to make it convincing, Oliver can't use the Green Hood uniform, and Roy's red uniform is probably too small for him. He may very well just use a League uniform instead.