Dark Confessions of Jedi Master Windu

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith' started by Master_Shaitan, Apr 14, 2005.

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  1. Invictus_Sol Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2003
    star 4
    When I couldn't understand why someone was acting in a particular way at a particular time, it turned out that I just hadn't been looking deeply enough. In the end, it all turned out so clear -- and for me, anyway, so true -- that the character arcs have the same tragic inevitability as the mechanics of the plot. In a very real sense, they are the mechanics of the plot.

    The question of "Why?" is really what the story is about. In a lot of ways, it's really what the saga is about, and I think that's something that even the hardest of the hardcore fans have been missing all these years. There's really a lot more going on under the surface than they ever suspected. That's something I think this film is going to bring home to them finally.


    He could be talking about anything, here. Doesn't lend or detract from your theory because it's so vague.
  2. Get_in_Gear Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Nov 29, 2004
    star 5
    Just button it and wait til the movie mate!

    [face_shame_on_you] General, you are not really helping your cause with comments like that.

    However, do feel free to try and answer this little passgae from MR Stover

    I see no question... but go on, humour me...

    When I couldn't understand why someone was acting in a particular way at a particular time, it turned out that I just hadn't been looking deeply enough.

    And?
    Oh that must be Mace exclusively he is talking about, not him struggling to pin down motivations for characters in general.

    In the end, it all turned out so clear -- and for me, anyway, so true -- that the character arcs have the same tragic inevitability as the mechanics of the plot. In a very real sense, they are the mechanics of the plot.

    Did we ever think it would not be this way?

    The question of "Why?" is really what the story is about. In a lot of ways, it's really what the saga is about, and I think that's something that even the hardest of the hardcore fans have been missing all these years. There's really a lot more going on under the surface than they ever suspected. That's something I think this film is going to bring home to them finally.

    But he could be talking about anything.
    He makes no reference to Mace.

    And, with all due respect, he has no idea what "hardcore fans" know and don't know.
    He could be talking about the fact that Qui-Gon's philosophies - the things that were seen as disobedience in TPM will now be revealled to be important to the survival of the Jedi order.
    That he is the one who showed Obi and Yoda the way prior to the OT.
    That compassion is the key to the Jedi identity retention.
    That Artoo knows the score right throughout the saga.
    The list is endless.

    You are forgetting the poor guy does not know that his novel was systematically leaked months and months ago.
    He is not talking about some special secret that even his novel does not reveal - he is talking about the things that are in the novel pertaining to the plot, that he thought we didn't know about yet.
  3. darthRebel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 25, 2004
    star 2
    I think mace hiding the kamino files would be perfect to the story :why?

    When anakin first learns that palpatine is a sith lord he becomes angry and immidiatly goes to the council to inform them of this evil sith lord.So at this point he doesn't consider them traitors for wanting to go and kill the emperor cause he wants to be in it and he didn't say to sidious that it was alright cause his visions of an empire were more equal to his own visions.Now later in the movie he will claim the jedi to be traitors because they wanted to kill the chancellor.This doesn't make sense and isn't logical.

    mace is going to be the crucial part in his turn.He represents a part of the jedi who feared ,not only to lose their powers and high positions,but the republic they loved.Thats why palpatine could set up and trick master syfo into ordering the army for the republic.I think some jedi knew of this,but they did it not without authorisation of the council and master yoda.They had become arrogant.This is essential cause anakin will see that the jedi are no different or better then the sith,they crave power,they fear,they are a rigid order that would create an army and thus risque the consequence of war,namely many dead people and casualties of war.He wants to make a better republic ressembling his own thoughts.

    I have a lot of problems with the transition but this would make it work very well.I am 80 procent sure it will be like this,its perfect.I have read shatterpoint and you can see clearly in that book that vapad is dangerously close to the darkside.I think it was intentional to make mace windu the main character and make his apprentice fall to the darkside because of the war.

    And this doesn't make mace a traitor cause he did it because he wanted to protect the republic.The only one he betrayed in a way ,was himself and a part of his good side ,cause his fear of losing it,made him lose himself a little bit,ordering an army to kill isn't a jedi's way.Lucas said ,not all good is completely good and not all bad complete bad.Mace just went a little bit to far ,and going over the edge is never good.he should have relied on the force and not on his fear and anger.
  4. Get_in_Gear Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Nov 29, 2004
    star 5
    Now later in the movie he will claim the jedi to be traitors because they wanted to kill the chancellor. This doesn't make sense and isn't logical.

    What, that Palpatine would lie about the Jedi and maipulate Ani and the Republic?
    If the Jedi turn out to be anything that Palpatine claims they are, then why on Earth are we supposed to even ever want the Jedi to Return.
    They were a buch of t*****s all along...
  5. Darth_Howell_III Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 12, 2002
    star 4

    You've authored a new thread, Shaitan.

    I'm betting that's one (1) thread more than even your most vehement critic has written.
  6. yoshifett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2004
    star 5
    I wish I could just wish away these insane Mace theories that have been floating around for FIVE YEARS!
  7. Invictus_Sol Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2003
    star 4
    I'm betting that's one (1) thread more than even your most vehement critic has written.

    Yes, because authoring more crazy theory threads gives one *cred*.
  8. yoshifett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2004
    star 5
  9. JustinPeeler Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 2003
    star 4
    Invictus_Sol posted on 4/15/05 11:11am
    I'm betting that's one (1) thread more than even your most vehement critic has written.

    Yes, because authoring more crazy theory threads gives one *cred*.

    />

    Yeah, Howell is now on a kick that by authoring stupid threads makes one a genuis or something. I really don't get it myself./>/>
  10. TheChosen1 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 13, 2001
    star 4
    Crazy speculation is fun but we've known the story for a long time now. Its a waste of time at this point. Your arguments have no legs.

    Arguing wether Mace is a bad guy is as pointless as arguing wether or not Palps is a clone or if Vader is really Luke's dad. If you can't see why then no one here can really explain it to you. Just watch the movie. This thread really shouldn't even be open anymore as some people are openly flaming.
  11. JustinPeeler Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 2003
    star 4
    In my opinion at this point any threads that are wild unsupported speculation should be locked because the whole story is out. And any posts supporting such speculation in other threads should be treated as trolling and their authors handeled accordingly.

    In my opinion, of course.
  12. IMTHEGENERAL Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 17, 2004
    star 4
  13. Darth_Arrakis Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2005
    star 3
    So, let me get this straight..........if i don't like a thread or am not of the same opinion as said thread (which happens to be getting a lot of responses from both sides of the argument) instead of reading elsewhere, i simply start flamming and name calling to the point of having a mod close it down?

    Wow, that's great........
  14. JustinPeeler Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 2003
    star 4
    Darth_Arrakis posted on 4/15/05 12:32pm

    Wow, that's great........

    />

    I'm not flaming anyone, and you miss the point.

    The novel, visual dictionary, screenplay and graphic novel are all out. So wild speculation at this point is nothing but trolling.

    If you think that opinion is harsh, I think anyone who starts yet another thread about Sifo Dyas/who ordered the clones should be tied to a chair and Force to watch the Star Wars Holiday Special over and over again.

    But that is just my opinion./>/>
  15. IMTHEGENERAL Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 17, 2004
    star 4
  16. D_Lowe Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2002
    star 6
    Mace Windu a traitor? OMG, 1999 flashback. [face_plain]
  17. Darth_Arrakis Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2005
    star 3
    I'm not flaming anyone, and you miss the point.

    The novel, visual dictionary, screenplay and graphic novel are all out. So wild speculation at this point is nothing but trolling.

    If you think that opinion is harsh, I think anyone who starts yet another about Sifo Dyas/who ordered the clones should be tied to a chair and Force to watch the Star Wars Holiday Special over and over again.

    But that is just my opinion.
    -------------------------------------------------------

    I think you are missing the point also.

    The fact is that many people still believe a twist is comming and want to discuss it. You don't believe it? Fine no problems there but then why are you here, you are not discussing anything, simply saying that this thread should be shut down. IYO, that's fine, we got it, we understand your opinion. Why is it so hard to let others (who may or may not be of your opinion) discuss this? At least they are discussing....that is the point, IMHO.


    P.S. : just to make it clear, my original post was not pointing at you in particular, it was a general comment towards the tone of this thread, throughout the last pages, but you responded to it.
  18. D_Lowe Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2002
    star 6
    The fact is that many people still believe a twist is comming and want to discuss it.

    And people can't get over the fact that there isn't going to be a ESB moment. Major disappointment coming your way.
  19. IH2 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 16, 2005
    star 2
    The novel, visual dictionary, screenplay and graphic novel are all out. So wild speculation at this point is nothing but trolling.


    Which the dialog various widely between all of these items....whats wrong with discussing a plot point that was brought up in AOTC. and only explained in an EU piece of garbage?....wait until the movie comes out.
  20. JustinPeeler Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 2003
    star 4
    Darth_Arrakis posted on 4/15/05 12:40pm

    I think you are missing the point also.

    The fact is that many people still believe a twist is comming and want to discuss it. You don't believe it? Fine no problems there but then why are you here, you are not discussing anything, simply saying that this thread should be shut down. IYO, that's fine, we got it, we understand your opinion. Why is it so hard to let others (who may or may not be of your opinion) discuss this? At least they are discussing....that is the point, IMHO.

    />

    I've disgusted this topic and explained why it is pointless, going so far as to explain the relationship between Sidious, Order 66 and the clones.

    This thread isn't about a hidden twist, it's yet another "who ordered the clones" thread, an idea that has been discussed plenty of times before and has been explained by LFL.

    I have shown that this thread's idea doesn't fit within the context of the novel, yet those who support the thread won't let their "kewl" idea die.

    Why?

    Because, in my opinion, they are simply trolling. Until my posts are actually read and understood nothing is going to change my opinion that this is a troll topic.

    Finally, as a wise man said, if you wanted big surprises, why the heck did you ever come into a spoilers forum? />/>
  21. Darth_Arrakis Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2005
    star 3
    The fact is that many people still believe a twist is comming and want to discuss it.

    And people can't get over the fact that there isn't going to be a ESB moment. Major disappointment coming your way.
    -------------------------------------------------------

    Not neccessarily. Having fun discussing something that some people think may happen does not equate to needing it to come true.

    In no way (just myself here) am i going to cling on to anything so badly as to be disappointed when the movie comes out certain things are or are not included.




    Finally, as a wise man said, if you wanted big surprises, why the heck did you ever come into a spoilers forum?
    -------------------------------------------------------

    Well, in a way you did get big surprises, as the spoilers came out, you just chose not to get them all at the same time with the movie.

    I do understand your point, i'm not trying to convince you to believe this thread or any others by the way.

    I'm just not clear on what worth you get from not letting others who aren't yet convinced we know everything discuss it. So what if as you say there is nothing to it? So what if as another poster said they are in for a big let down? Doesn't that regard them? And only them?
  22. IMTHEGENERAL Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 17, 2004
    star 4
    Darth_Arrakis- Thanks!

    Funny how these bashers still hang around this thread and continue to add to it...

    Im sure 'Shaitan' will agree with me that all flaming is welcome in our direction though and that we havent posted this thread to debate over and over about it. It is here to just be on record.

    Comments are taken with a pinch of salt.

    We can all discuss the outcome together on May 19th.

    I'm wishing away the days.




  23. JustinPeeler Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 2003
    star 4
    Anakin killing Padme isn't a big enough twist for you poeople?

    As another wise man said, this is like watching the end of the Sixth Sense, then watching the rest of the movie expecting another twist.
  24. djearl81 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Apr 14, 2005
    I can see George Lucas sitting in his huge office reading this stuff...and laughing.
  25. JustinPeeler Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 3, 2003
    star 4
    ^^^ As can I. Then he locks all the doors. :D
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