Dark Jedi and Sith

I was wondering about the difference between the Sith and Dark Jedi. Dark Jedi left the Order and decided to follow theire instinct and emotions only. The Sith seem to be able to see and use the whole Force, they can use things, that normally belong to the Light Side ( patience), they can use theire emotion but they can also control them when they need to. It seems to me that the Sith is not only a Dark Side user, but he can also understand, control and accept the whole Force, because he knows the true nature of the Force, which can give life and also kill. So, a Jedi would be using only the Light Side, Dark Jedi - only Dark Side, and a Sith uses the whole Force.
If that topic was discusses before, close it and re-direct me there.

 

I would consider Anakin to be a Dark Jedi ... before he turned Sith. Anakin, during AotC, keeps giving us the impression of his hatred for the confines and strict rules the Jedi Order puts on him. I wouldn't say a Dark Jedi in necessarily bad (without getting into EU), but instead just some Jedi who decided to be defiant and rebellious against the Order.

 

yeah, but that makes me wonder if Qui-Gon would be a Dark Jedi ( only when we take the movies, not the EU)?

 

I'm sure every Jedi has a little bit of rebellious nature in them in regards to the strict followings of the Jedi. I wouldn't consider a Jedi a Dark Jedi until their rebellious attitude was actually greater then their commitment to the Jedi Order. Obviously if that happened they would leave and choose not to be trained any further.

That, to me, is a Dark Jedi. When the rebellious nature of a Jedi outweighs his/her commitment to the Force and to the Jedi.

 

And where is the moment when the Dark Jedi turns to Sith?

 

When his/her's only commitment becomes focused on themselves and their power. Greed.

 

Aren`t the Dark Jedi focused on themselves? I think they are. Both Sith and Dark Jedi are focused on themselves, just because using your emotion makes you automaticly concentrated on them. Greed? Well, I guess it`s something that exist for both of them...

 

IMO, being a Dark Jedi doesn't mean your evil ... it's just that you chose not to be a part of the Jedi Order anymore. Take Qui-Gon for example, who knows how long he would've stayed given the fact that he didn't agree with much of what the Council had to say. But would you call Qui-Gon a Sith? Far from it actually. A Sith has a priority to cause evil, inflict pain, become greedy and selfless. A Dark Jedi is a rebel so to speak, but not nessessarily evil.

 

Does the Sith want to cause evil only? I think they more likely want power, and probably every Dark Jedi would like to have the power to change Counsels decidions...

 

Wanting power and wanting independence are two different things.

- Dark Jedi means independence from the strict order of the Jedi

- Sith means greed, power, evil, pain, suffering ... death.

 

But Dark Jedi can be as dangerous as the Sith! And they can`t control theire emotion the way the Sith do!

 

The Sith can control their emotions?

Did you watch RotS? Did Anakin look in control to you?

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Bottom line; I gave you my opinion on the matter. I believe the Sith are in it for themselves, while the Dark Jedi aren't necessarily [i]"Dark"[/i], just rebellious and unwilling in a way.

 

Woah, a two people topic

The DJ are not evil to cause pain, they're just rebellious against the strict code of the Jedi.

They ARE prompt to become Sith, if you put a Palpatine in their way.

 

Of course they control their emotions. Did you ever see Maul, Dooku, or Sidious out of control when it mattered? Anakin in ROTS hadn't even started Sith training, he was a psychotic killer, but not a Sith.

Anyway, on Dark Jedi vs. Sith: Dark Jedi become Sith when they are apprenticed to a Sith master and learn the teachings of the Sith.

 

Just because you don't see Dooku or Maul running around crazy doesn't mean they couldn't control their emotions ... they were just more subtle about it.

We know that the Sith want power, and are greedy enough to do anything to get it. Greed is an emotion, one which they cannot control because they only care about themselves. They are driven by that greed.

 

Compassion is also an emotion. By the same token one could argue that the Jedi "are driven" by compassion because they can't control it.

To me, it is not a question of "not being able to control their emotions". Fact is that besides ROTS Anakin we haven't seen any Sith out of control throughout the Saga, including OT Vader. Especially Sidious is in perfect emotional control at any time it matters, even under extreme pressure and stress, and I find it illogical that he should be able to control any emotion other than greed. I think it is a question of philosophical outlook - I'd say the Sith don't want to control their greed for power because their philosophical outlook is putting the self into the center instead of the the community.

I think it's a great pity that the whole Sith matter is so often dismissed as being "simply" about greedy people without looking at the philosophical background which is quite interesting. BTW., in the "Sith, Satanism and the occult" thread below there is some discussion on the Sith philosophy.

 

I'm not dismissing the Sith to be something that is simply understood. In this thread we have been talking about the differences between Dark Jedi & Sith, obviously a subject that is based largely on opinion. I didn't dive into the whole Sith Philosophy because it doesn't really belong here. I mentioned greed because that is a difference between Jedi and Sith, that's all.

Perhaps that is another different between Dark Jedi and Sith; Dark Jedi have a basis of compassion that controls them while the Sith have a basis of greed that controls them.

 

Yes, this is indeed a major difference. The question for me was if greed for power is a consciously accepted motivation or if they are just unable to control their emotions. And on the latter part I'd have to disagree.

This is an interesting thought. Do you think the Dark Jedi still have compassion as a basic motivation, and hope to use their emotions to better achieve their end which still is "the common good"? That would indeed be a major difference compared to the Sith.

 

Well, in my mind, I've always thought that the name Dark Jedi doesn't necessarily mean evil ... but instead they're just labeled that way since they left the Order. I do think one of their primary motivation is their compassion for themselves and others. Take Qui-Gon for example, he is a great Jedi ... but feels he can better serve the Galaxy by doing things his own way and not following the Jedi Council all the time.

 

But take Xanatos. He wasn`t a Sith and the only emotions he was using were greed and anger of Qui-Gon. And he wasn`t abke to control those feelings.
I guess the Sith are mindful of theire emotions and they can use them when necesery, and the Dark Jedi are almost consumed by theire own feelings.

 

Well, from what is said here so far, I think that the Dark Jedi are just Jedi that don't follow the Order, but still hold the same opinions as the Order. As the Sith are after everyone's destruction that won't follow them.

And this brings me to my theory on the Force (which you can see in the DARK/LIGHT thread.) Even the Jedi do the same thing, they destroy or want to control those who don't share the same opinions as themselves.

 

I always thought Dark Jedi were just as evil as the Sith. Grey Jedi are the ones that have left the Jedi Order because of the strict code.

 

Yeah, you gotta watch out for those Grey Jedi.

Well like I've said, I never viewed Dark Jedi as necessarily evil. Instead I viewed them more like Qui-Gon. They have good intentions, but don't do well in the confines of a strict order.

 

I don't remember where but it was stated that to be a Sith you must have special training in the Sith Lore. Without this training you can only be a Dark Jedi not a Sith. I believe that it was in one of the movie novelizations. The emtions and how you use them are not a dividing line between Dark Jedi and Sith.

 

Hmm... Gray Jedi? I don`t thay are really gary, I guess they are really, really dark but not knowing what they are able to do- and that`s why they are dangerous., because they use only theire emotion, not brain, like Jedi do. The Sith use both