CT Did you really believe that Luke was in danger of turning to the dark side?

A lot of people never really bought into Luke turning to the dark side, they just didn't even buy it as a possibility, they weren't sold. For many, including myself, he was just too goodie-goodie throughout the OT to really believe it. What evil did he do in the OT to really make one think it was possible? Luke doesn't have his sand people slaughter, his beheading the enemy. Yeah, he has his dark side cave, his reckless rescue attempt, his black robes, his aggression toward Jabba, etc. I am very aware that Luke is supposed to be skirting real close to the dark side in ESB and early in ROTJ, and I can appreciate it mentally, but I never really felt it. I was never scared, I was never on the edge of my seat wondering if he would really turn. Once he starts reaching out to his father so earnestly, it slammed the door on the dark side for me.

To contrast, to this day I still get scared that Luke is going to die during the Battle of Yavin. To this day, Lucas gets me worried for Red 5.

Did you buy Luke's potential for the dark side? Were you worried about our hero's soul?

There's much more I could say, but mostly I just want straight answers, and I don't want to sway anyone or defeat my own poll by making it irrelevant, if you know what I'm getting at.

However, please do discuss, I'm interested in what people really thought/think.

 

No, but I think it was chiefly in a Doylist sense - I didn't think the hero becoming evil was that likely a twist in an adventure series like SW.

 

Force-choke Gamorreans blocking his way who have not actually attacked him?

 

He's the typical noble hero of the story, no he wasn't going to turn. Get killed for dumb mistakes, sure, there were moments, but I never thought he'd go bad.

 

Sadly, I don't remember the first time I experienced this story, so I couldn't tell you.
I always believed in the possibility of Luke turning, though. The most frightening parts of ROTJ were the rancor and the Emperor's lightning attack, but the threat of him turning was very real to me, in the sense that it wouldn't be something that came out of the blue. I would've bought it, totally.

I also think that today's kids, who watch the Saga I-VI (and beyond) will be more afraid for Luke because of what happened to Anakin. When you've seen what the dark side can do to someone like Anakin, the threat of his son falling into the same trap should be very apparent when he's put in similar situations, especially when he finally unleashes his fury on Vader.

At the same time, there is this underlying feeling that Luke does better than Anakin. He's tempted by the dark side, but there's always some level of goodness bubbling beneath the surface, even in the scene I just mentioned. He's furious with Vader and overpowers him, but he still doesn't quite seem to want to kill him. He just keeps batting away at his lightsaber until he finally chops his hand clean off. If he'd wanted to, he could've gone for far more destructive blows, but there's something holding him back: his newfound belief in the good inside Vader.
Still, IF he had turned, it would've been believable to me.

 

Luke is fighting against himself in the cave. That was the point. He says that he is not afraid, but he is. He is afraid of failing his friends which is why he leaves for Cloud City. He is angry against Vader for killing his father and Obi-wan. He's slowly developing a hatred for him because of it. So when he goes into the cave, he is bringing his negative feelings into the situation.

"Part of the going into the tree is learning about the Force. Learning about the fact that the Force is within you, and at the same time, you create your own bad vibes. So, if you think badly about things or you act badly, or you bring fear into a situation, you're going to have to defend yourself or you're going to have to suffer the consequences for that. In this particular case, he takes his sword in with him which means he's going to have combat. If he didn't, he wouldn't. He's creating this situation in his mind because, on a larger level, what caused Darth Vader to become Darth Vader is the same thing that makes Luke bring that sword in with him. And so, just as later on we find out Darth Vader is actually his father - so he is part of himself - but he has the capacity to become Darth Vader simply by using hate and fear and using weapons as oppose to using compassion and caring and kindness. But that's the big danger of the series, is that he will become Darth Vader."

--George Lucas, TESB DVD Commentary.

So Luke is wanting revenge on Vader when he sees him in the cave and the end result is that by having fear and using his anger and letting his hate consume him, he will become Vader when he kills him.

VADER: "Obi-Wan has taught you well. You have controlled your fear...now release your anger. Only your hatred can destroy me."

It isn't about whether he still had his Lightsaber up his sleeve. It's about killing an unarmed man out of anger and hatred, motivated in part by fear. This is why Anakin killing Dooku was a big deal in ROTS.

ANAKIN: "I shouldn't have done that, Chancellor. It's not the Jedi way."

PALPATINE: "It is only natural. He cut off your arm, and you wanted revenge. It wasn't the first time, Anakin. Remember what you told me about your mother and the Sand People."

Remember, we just had this conversation about doing what one feels is right, when it is obvious that it is wrong. The whole point in Palpatine goading Luke is to make him understand the Sith philosophy of what is right feels right and should be done as such.

Except for when Luke chokes the Gammorean guards, which was an aggressive move and unnecessary. But it was more about Luke's state of mind which is that he harbors impatience, like his father. He has fears for his loved ones, which his father also had. He was reckless like his father. And he had much anger in him, like his father.

No, but Obi-wan and Qui-gon would have just used the mind trick on them, or bribed them in some way. Luke did what his father was known for, which was use the Force aggressively to get his way. In the scene that was cut where Vader wants to inform Sidious in person that Luke has arrived with a Rebel strike team and chokes the guards blocking his path.

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Using fear, anger and hatred started it. He could have still stopped, but Palpatine used the war to keep encouraging that behavior. Hence fighting Ventress on Yavin 4 and Dooku at Naboo. ​

 

I didn't buy it; even if it was Lucas' intent. As a child I never thought Luke was going to cast away everything he was taught by Obi-Wan and Yoda and join the Sith. But if you look at ROTS, there's also that sense that Anakin won't do it either. Sure, he had engaged in dark deeds that set him on that path, and it seemed more likely that he'd join the dark side, but up until he makes that choice, I felt like he could have denied Sidious if he had chosen to. It wasn't forced on him; it's what he decided. So in that light, Luke turning to the dark side could have been plausible, but it's not something I imagined would truly happen in ROTJ.

 

i was too young to think about it. Watching it now, i don't really see that it was every Lucas' intention to make us think he might. He's pretty calm, collected and determined in ROTJ.

 

No, I never thought or feared that Luke would turn to the dark side from ESB till ROTJ.

First, Like you said, Luke remains good to the earnest during the OT, with no real step towards the dark side, unlike Anakin in AOTC or ROTS. Although there's that lingering menace throughout due to Vader/Anakin's past and Yoda/Ben's warnings ("Once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny" etc...), I could never picture him turning and joining the Emperor. Plus, but that's more like an afterthought, unlike his father in the actual PT with that search for the ultimate power, Luke has basically no motive to join Palpatine and become his right hand. So all what's left would be an abrupt and quite unbelievable change of personality, once he gives in to anger and hate to use the dark side at the emperor's taunting in ROTJ...

Second, I recall some review I read at the time of ROTJ's release clearly stating that the trio and the rebels were going to defeat their enemies, so...From then on there clearly was very little chance that the hero would turn bad in the end .

 

No clue. I can't even remember the first time I'd seen Star Wars.

 

Sure it doesn't feel like he could turn, the way he has matured and behaves.

Nevertheless there are a few lines to make the audience worry a bit such as these: Yoda "Don't underestimate the powers of the Emperor, or suffer your father's fate you will", Obi-Wan "Bury your feelings deep down you. They do you credit, but they could be made to serve the Emperor".

 

Yes, I did believe that Luke was in danger of turning. He wasn't infallible. In his own way, Luke had a tendency to cling to attachments just as strongly as others.

I think too many fans tend to put Luke on a pedestal. They have an odd way of ignoring his flaws, which have been obvious since A NEW HOPE.

 

Be careful when you fight the monsters, lest you become one.

As far as the predictability of the story. I assumed the good guys would succeed. That's easy of course. Most stories do that. It's how you get there that's fun.

 

The first time I saw Jedi in 83, I went in confident of the goodness and purity of heart of the last of the Jedi. But in the throne room, as his universe collapsed around him, the emperor taunting and Vader looming darkly in the background, I could see his temptation. The moment he called his saber and took a swing at the emperor, I thought, "Uh oh, he's in trouble." And when he went berserk against Vader, screaming and chopping off his hand, I believed he had lost it, probably not permanently, but the dark side was clearly in control.

 

Like Father Like Son

Darth Sidious: "I'm looking forward to completing your training. In time you will call me: Master."
Luke Skywalker: "You're gravely mistaken. You won't convert me as you did my father."
Darth Sidious: "Speaking of converting, we have some great Power Converters over here on the Dark Side of the Force"
Luke Skywalker: "What is thy bidding, my Master?"

 

Power conversion ... Sith style!

 

I always thought there was a chance. Think about it. The Jedi basically lied to him, completely betraying his trust and using him as a tool against their enemies. He chokes Gamorreans. He is tortured by the Emperor. Also, his father offers him a chance at unreasonable power. In all honesty, that sounds like a set-up that would make many once-heroes falter.

In my opinion, his turn to the dark side would have been more believable than Anakin's.

 

I believe it because the evidence is just all there. Upon my first time viewing, I genuinely had no idea what Luke was going to do after nearly killing his father

Coincidentally, one of the original drafts indeed did have Luke temporarily turn to the dark side. He did kill Vader, then took off the helmet and wore it himself (lolwut)

 

I've made this complaint about three characters in particular - Luke, Obi-Wan and Yoda. I've come across too many posts and too many articles that tend to put these three characters on a pedestal. And I'm not defensive about Anakin. I have posted comments agreeing with those who believe he was mainly responsible for his own downfall. Please get your facts right.

Also, I disagree with your opinion that Luke was infallible. I believe the movies made it clear that he was just as flawed as Han . . . in his less showy way.

 

None of the characters are infallible. They all get it wrong from time to time throughout the trilogy. But fallible doesn't mean likely to turn to the dark side IMO. Even watching as a ten year old, although I could see Luke's flaws, I never believed that he would turn.