Lit A/V The Force Awakens and the EU [TAGGED spoilers.]

Sigh... Do I have to break out the smilies on every post !?

 

The person receiving the lightsaber doesn't perform any action that says they know how to fight with that kind of weapon. My mind sees this and immediately makes up a scenario in which someone finds the hilt and gives it to Leia who says "oh yeah, that's my brother's".

You know what I'd really find funny beyond any measure? If they messed up with the hilts and "Luke's saber" was made to the specifications of the first Luke saber from ANH because ANH and they forgot that there was another hilt later on (and to top things off gave him a green blade in post anyway). And no, I don't want to see the movie fail. I'm just telling what I see.

This. As much as Palpatine prepared the Republic citizens to applaud at the idea of him openly acknowledging and legitimizing his dictatorship approach to stuff, he also prepared the Imperial citizens to buy fireworks for the event of his death.

 

If, for the sake of argument, it's assume the EA write-up is right. There is a New Republic. Or there was one. In 30 years they lost the peace. Or, it's possible the First Order is really just an (incredibly well armed) sect lording over their own worlds and Kylo Ren is leading the charge to take back what was Imperial territory. They've been hiding for 30 years and now it's their awakening. Interesting that it's a First Order so maybe the ideology, much like Ren's lightsaber, predates Palpatine. they just stole the Imp's gear and outfits.

 

It feels right to assume the following: If Ep7 needed some "Rebel-sanctioned goverment" that was overthrown again, or that exists as a shadow of its former self while handsome people in X-Wings go off saving the galaxy from oppression, JJA and the movie team could have shown no interest in what that non-plot-important goverment would have been called. LFL people stepping in to fill in the gaps and give story to stuff like the Battlefront game might then either have plundered old holocron entries because that was simpler; plundered old holocron entries to bait old fans ("see, it's not really gone, now give me your money"); or, and this would be the coolest possibility, have paid homage to the old stuff because they themselves loved it.

I mean, we're talking a Vong alien abduction story in TCW, how crazy is that. For every Moriband there was lots of stuff that they kept in to tie everything into this fictional beast that used to be the EU. They loved it.

 

My first assumption was simply that they consider the "First Order" is Palpatine's, and that they see the [New Republic] as the "Second Order" and illegitimate...

Although, logic would of course make it more sensible to treat the Old Republic as the "first" due to it having, er, come first, but... in universe an Imperial would have treated the Empire as Year 0, so... I can see them maybe having called the Republic the "Old Order", and the Emperor's New Order as the First (it was the First Galactic Empire, after all), but... yeah, I'm just waffling here.

BigAl6ft6 your idea of it maybe predating the Empire though is interesting... as we have that Sith ruin under the Jedi Temple now, and we had Palpatine saying the Sith once ruled the galaxy long ago, so... maybe this First Order sees itself as the heirs to the Sith, not as a Force cult, but as the first galactic rulers who ruled the galaxy long, long ago?

 

So, like some of you mentioned here, it would be acceptable if new, independent "states" sprung out from the ashes of the Empire like new buds. And this First Order definitely doesn't give an impression of name given to a capable Galactic government. Maybe a militaristic sect? And there's a proxy war going on with the New Republic, Imperial Remnant and other independent galactic governments across the galaxy favouring a certain side each. What's this resistance? Are they pushing marxist nostalgia in SW?

 

They're more likely referring to the history of Ryloth France.

 

I had an awesome thought and now I'm sad it'll never happen:

Finn Rostu. Think about it.

 

Heck, name change aside Moraband was a way more faithful depiction of Korriban than I would have expected.

This is half of what I was referring to in another thread when I said the fandom is way more likely to drive me away from Star Wars than the movie could possibly be.

 

I'm making my Rilo Ken fan page.

 

Now that's just silly. Like cutting your Lekku to spite your head.

 

This makes me want to laugh for all the wrong reasons. Because it's probably closer to the truth than... not.....

 

You will always be canon in my home, Holiday Special.

 

Well, I mean, here's the thing. I'm in a pretty excited and enthusiastic state about Star Wars right now. The new canon hasn't been 100% a success (looking at you, Heir to the Jedi), and I'm still not entirely happy about the end of the EU, but in general I'm eagerly looking forward to a lot of the new material that's going to be coming out, whether it's TFA, Aftermath, the comics, or Rebels Season 2. I'm probably more excited about Star Wars then I've been in some time.

Now, it's possible that the movie could do things to kill that enthusiasm for me. I can certainly think of a number of possible screwups it could make, some of which Grey1 has touched on. But the odds are much higher that if something kills my enthusiasm, it'll be the fan reaction to the movie, either in the form of lots of complaining for dumb reasons, or lots of liking it for dumb reasons that just provoke more fighting among Star Wars fans in general. If that happens, it won't mean I'll start boycotting all Star Wars products, but it will drive me away from organized fandom for at least a time.

I'm not convinced it'll happen. But it's worrying, a lot more worrying than TFA being bad (not saying I think it'll be great, but it being bad wouldn't necessarily alienate me from Star Wars as a whole).

 

I'm still waiting for the revelation that First Order has less to do with polit-labels and more to do with Palpatine's First Order in event of his death.

Oh, I'm well aware of the EU concept that the Empire was a house of cards that only Sheev could balance. But with the EU being selectively mined/remade, I'm forced to go off of what (very little at this point) NU evidence suggests.

Although it appears that the prequels will have little, if any, effect on Ep. 7 and beyond, there is the possibility - admittedly slim - that since Palps had a carefully-organized set of 150 General Order. Why couldn't he have something similar in the NU-Empire?

This doesn't even have to clash with what we know of Aftermath. OK, so there's warlords-in-all-but-name in the post-Endor landscape. Fair enough.

But it's 30-some years until Ep. 7, and slim to none intel (yet) on what went down in that time. The "First Order" could likely be the "winners" of the Imperial power struggle. Fanatics make for the worst enemies, and the NR (or its equivalent) gets smashed (and maybe a nascent attempt at an NU-NJO, if the rumors are to be believed).

I, personally, don't buy for a moment the concept that Kylo Ren is the sole BBEG. He's too Vader-esque - which, to me, is fine. We need the armored fist.

But there remains a corrupt velvet glove to wield said fist. The real villain(s) remain(s) to be revealed, IMHO ...

 

So that shot of Luke and Artoo is a flashback to ROTJ, with Artoo being there for Anakin's funeral... I'm almost certain. The spoilers about a flashback to then, and showing how Vader's mask was recovered and why Luke hasn't recreated the Jedi.

 

Regards Lucas treatments I am sad too. The PT actually has/had great story potential and I always feel that issues were in the execution than anything else. Though it was not just Lucas treatments, there was also JJ coming in and ditching Ardnts (which focused on the new cast) in favour of a nostalgia run. As Khaaan should have demonstrated JJ is not know for originalty.

 

Hey, f'real though, enjoy it in a vacuum. Prepare the isolation chamber. That's the place I've been getting myself to lately. I mean, maybe this is anathema, but are we really getting much from fandom at times like this? It feels to me like it's nice when I can handle it, but serves more as a form of amusement during the lulls than a way of bolstering my own enthusiasm around the bigger events. I get the feeling that fandom can only really make me less excited, especially when there are so many wild cards coming up. I'd love to keep the populist dream of Star Wars alive, but to be frank and arrogant (but nonetheless honest) about it, most peoples' perspectives are far too muddled by preconceived notions for their reactions to be genuine/sensitive/intelligent. The big hype-reactor we all feed on is still doing its thing with newer franchises here and there, but for my money, mainstream Star Wars is just too big for that. I made the mistake of opening myself up to the public with the Hobbit; me and my closer homies loved the first film, but the experience in the years to follow was spoiled by all the external online chatter. This time, I just don't think I can open it up to people so prone to overthink it and bring their own baggage into an already baggage-heavy situation. This time, it's gonna be all about FAMILY. /vindiesel

FTFY.

 

But, I mean, the fandom is part of the enthusiasm. Seeing people on here getting excited and discussing speculation helps reinforce those parts of me. Like, I'll probably go dark for a few days when it comes out because I'm not an opening night person, but cutting myself off entirely is just another way of limiting that excitement.

 

Hmm, interesting.

I'm personally victim to the "negative statements have 10x the weight of positive statements" syndrome. I see the thing, and no matter how much I fundamentally disagree with the complaints, when I reach the complained-about moment, instead of simply enjoying it, my attention becomes fixed on the annoying people with the invalid complaint. They win, and everybody loses. It sucks.

 

Orci/Kurtzman deserve all the bad press they get and then some, but in regards to STID, I'd be surprised if stuff like "starship battle close to the moon, derelict ship gets pulled down to Earth" has a lot to do with director's interpretation and just might have been more vague (and therefore open to better interpretation) in the script.

Another thing would be that the producer/director could possible tell his "we're doing this for the money" writers to go certain directions. JJA wasn't simply the director who got attached and had no power and was kicked out of the cutting room; he oversaw the project, and seeing how much of this is his brainchild, I'd be surprised if he didn't know what he was getting into when the team decided to go with "we're redoing elements of the old movies", going as far as restaging a classic scene. Don't get me wrong, though, the originality angle never was a problem for me with STID and Khan. The Lost-approved plughole warp drive (which might have been Lindelof's idea and JJA then ran with it) is far worse than obvious wink-wink-nudge-nudge appreciation of being part of a decades-old franchise. If anything, the Khan moment fizzled because it's not powerful anymore today, it's a meme. Compare it to fan-service like the NX-01 model at Starfleet HQ or the inclusion of controversial DS9 subplot Section 31, and you see that fan service is okay in this kind of environment. Beats unmotivated lingerie shows and the kind of fan service that gives you a tribble but at the price of someone injecting blood into it for no reason and accidentally discovering magic (just like penicillin, you know).

Will you have a banner shipping him with Toy Story 3 Barbie? I can totally see them happening now that both are at Disney.