ST Diversity in the Sequel Trilogy (see warning on page 11)

She isn't perfect, though. She gets freaked out by the vision, runs from the saber, gets paralysed, knocked out, abducted, thrown against a tree and knocked out again and finally, gets her arse kicked and backed up against a cliff.

 

If Episode VIII is executed properly, I think a lot of these arguments will fade. Like I said in a previous post, I truly believe JJ and Lawrence pushed back a lot of the struggle and particular emotional weight of the film to Episode VIII in order to tell a more light hearted tale of adventure. Long as we get that in Episode VIII (which again I think will get) I think a lot of these arguments will subside.

 

Yeah, that's what i'm hoping for.
At least we had Kylo and a lot of other great things.

 

Of course i would have the same complaints.

 

The best part is, notice how neither Luke nor Rey couldn't have done those things if Han or Finn didn't come back to help them. Han saved Luke from getting shot down, and Finn not only helped Rey escape from SKB (avoiding the possibility of her being re-captured again since she had no idea where she was even going, there were stormtroopers on high alert, and all of the exits had been sealed), and he fought Kylo Ren to protect her when she'd been knocked out (otherwise she would've been re-captured or killed again).

Star Wars movies are all about team work.

 

One thing that I think should be noted is Rey's background or lack of. Yes by having it be a mystery it makes for a lot more interesting trilogy but it does lend itself to having arguments about whether she became too powerful too fast being more valid. Or think of this way. If she was indeed Luke's daughter, would be having these same arguments? No I don't believe so. The fact her background is still a mystery gives more credence to this argument of her becoming too powerful to fast. Had she been Rey Skywalker and simply did not remember (which was one of the rumor endings), I don't think this argument would really taking place. Again I think this all become moot after Episode VIII where Rey's struggles become much more relevant both physically and more importantly, emotionally plus we will learn her background finally..or hoping we do!!

 

It's really simple imo. If she were perfect, then:

-She wouldn't have needed Finn to save her like four different times.
-She would have nearly gotten them all killed on Han's freighter.
-She wouldn't have been captured and tortured in the first place.
-Han wouldn't have died.
-Finn wouldn't be in a coma.
-Etc.

So now, she ain't perfect. Also I could start listing off how quickly Luke picks up on stuff in ANH, or even Anakin in TPM, and all of their accomplishments there. But I'm tired of that debate and it just leads to arguments.

Really the ONLY question mark, is her Force abilities (her other skills are perfectly explainable within the narrative already, and were explained). And in the former's case, I suspect that it'll be tied into, whatever her origins end up being.

In regards to KK's comments, she's got a point. I heard more than a few people complain about some of changes being made, including having a female lead. And the argument tended to be something along the lines of "well SW has always been primarily geared towards men. It's a male-centric franchise and there's nothing wrong with that and why do we need to change it for PC, etc." Actually, it was depressing how often I heard that.

For some people it would seem, trying anything new, or trying to bring in any new fans, is a bad thing for some reason.

 

Such a non-story.

More relevant is the writer's rather bizarre statement:

Regardless, women are gaining representation in the Star Wars franchise at a faster rate, something all involved admitted was a problem in the early films (there are literally two female characters in the entirety of the original film, Star Wars: Episode IV - A New Hope, and one is killed in the first act).

TFA only had one new female character of significance in Rey and then the alien Maz and the useless Phasma despite KK saying:


Speaking with the LA Times Kathleen Kennedy confirmed earlier this month that the cool-looking Captain Phasma, played by Gwendoline Christie, will be back for more. "She’s an important character, a baddie in the best sense of the word," the Lucasfilm honcho said.



For Rogue One it's the same pretty much with Jinn's mother in some small role.

Now they are both the leads which is great but how about some more co-leads and support? Why couldn't her mother be the genius? Why for that matter couldn't Krennic be a woman?

So far I'd say that KK has done nowhere near enough overall outside of the two leads.

Also having two beautiful women in leads is hardly going against what is expected.

 

Allow me to quote my now 13 year old daughter who was raised watching real vampires on Buffy. At about age 7 (or however old she was whenever Twilight was in its zenith) she declared: "Vampires that sparkle in the sunlight are lame."

And yes, Star Wars has appealed to females since the get go. I'm about the same age as anakinfansince1983, there were grade school girls like us out in the backyard playing Star Wars with the boys in the neighborhood pretending that we were a certain princess that kicked ass and took names. We've been there since the beginning.

 

I'm 42, and male, and I agree with this too. There were girls in my neighborhood and at school who liked SW too (especially because of Leia). Some people may have assumed all along that SW is "just for boys", but those people have always been wrong.

 

I would say they're too forced and perfect even if it was a male. For me, I just feel like Hollywood is afraid to write female characters with any type of vulnerability right now because they're a little too concerned with making them into "heroes that girls can look up to". I don't think Rey has to almost immediately fix any mistake she makes or be instantly liked and gravitated to by other characters, or be almost entirely independent of anyone needing to rescue her or help her for little girls or anyone for that matter to like her. Those are some of the key characteristics of a Mary Sue character, and that's why I've called her a Mary Sue.

 

It depends. I know plenty of girls who have no interest in Star Wars. It's like anything else in the world. Different strokes for different folks. Having female leads is not going to increase female presence. It just serves those females who were present from the beginning. I will admit I have no interest in Rogue One. The conversations after TFA has been too much of a battle, and I'm just worn out. Too many people have personal interest, and I just don't give a Sugar Honey Iced Tea.

 

I hope to see Rey in real danger that she can't just escape by herself. I want some balance between the characters in this especially between Finn and Rey. He needs real W's and she needs real L's.

 

The rest of your post contradicts your first line.

For example you talk of a lack of vulnerability, and yet I clearly remember seeing a terrified Rey being frozen to the spot, and then rendered unconscious before being carried in that 'monster carry" pose. Later on she literally had her mind invaded, and her deepest fears read. Did Luke have comparable vulnerability in his first appearance? In fact, has any Star Wars character been put in such a classically vulnerable position? I guarantee you that any male rendered unconscious and carried by a character of either gender would be ridiculed and/or seen as being utterly humiliated or overpowered.

The fact that the vulnerability was eventually overcome is beside the point; a lot of people are straight up saying she didn't have any set backs and was invincible, which simply isn't the case.

Also, I think it's kind of not OK to moan about the idea of 'creating characters girls can look up to" as if that's sneer worthy. I'm sick, and I'm sure plenty of women are sick, of female characters who exist just to be saved, or to be a vessel for a man's libido, or to bear children. If there's one thing that the concept of the force does, it is to level the physical abilities of men and women so that women can be the kick ass heroes. Having a problem with that is sexist, and shouldn't be tiptoed around. If you sneer at Lucasfilm thinking about who female children might want to look up to, then your attitude is a problem.

 

And who would you like to see her get rescued by?

 

My vote goes to Space Horse.

 

The horse better be believably strong though. If it's not descended from Red Rum and if we don't see it trained to rescue helpless women, I'm not buying it. And if the horse used to be First Order but rescues a Resistance memberwhile trampling over former friends, then I'm OUT. Unless we get some real character explanation about how the horse was able to defect.

 

Yeah, I'm also out if we don't see Space Horse get any wins against regular stormtroopers.

 

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And in Scooby Doo style she swings in and pulls of the veiled mask. Thank the heavens we have KK in charge.

I actually agree with What Girl

 

I'd like to see someone try to properly answer this, because this is at the heart of all of it; that Rey should be "rescued" implies that it's OK for someone to exist who is more perfect than Rey. Which implies that some characters can be perfect or powerful, but not others.

 

I don't need to see Rey rescued per the damsel in distress trope. I'd like to see her challenged much like Luke was in ESB. Sure, hand her butt to her on a platter, sever a limb, make her a prisoner of Snoke like the one spoiler said. Even challenge and seduce her with the Dark Side. Sure, the other characters--Finn, Poe, Luke, Leia, and even that stinker Kylo may play a role in bringing her back from the brink. But that is not rescuing. If this is the hero's journey, allow her to find it in herself to rescue herself from the evil of the movie, even if that evil may be found within. I have no problems with the other characters assisting in this process. But she needs to be the one, just like Luke did. to find the strength within to overcome.

So I have no problems with the Falcon flying in as she falls off something after a valliant battle (Luke on the weather vane at the tip of Cloud City), or a friend extending a hand on a bridge (yes, a parallel to Kylo and Han, get over it) where a Dark Rey takes the hand instead of plunging a lightsaber. I want the action to free herself to come from her.

What I don't need is some maiden trapped in a tower waiting for the Tin Man, Scarecrow and Cowardly Lion (take the costumes off Poe, Finn and you too Kylo) storming the castle to rescue the helpless girl crying for her Auntie Em because she can't figure out how to open the door.