Do any of you think Obi Wan failed in his quest to train Anakin throughout the prequels?

Didn't Yoda state in the novel version of that scene where they discussed Anakins visions that very few Jedi are still capable of having meaningful visions? Maybe Obi-Wan just didn't think of the possibility that Anakin was one of them...

 

I like to believe that Obi-Wan did his best to train Anakin, and I do not believe that he failed. I believe that Anakin failed him. Obi-Wan was given a difficult task: train a boy who is ten years old and has had absolutely no Jedi Training whatsoever. I believe that he did his absolute best and that he did not fail.

Anakin's turning is a diffucult thing to understand. Was it choice? Or, was it destiny? I believe that Anakin's turning was the will of the Force. I also believe that the eradication of the Old Jedi Order was the will of the Force as well. The Jedi had become to arrogant and believed that they were the Masters of all and that nothing could harm them. When the Force saw that this could not be fixed, it decided "out with the old, in with the new". So, it needed Anakin to help them realize this. When Vader was finally destroyed by Anakin, the Force said that his time was over and it was time for Luke to take his place as the head of the New Jedi Order.

Someone once wrote out their own version of "The Prophecy of the One Who Will Bring Balance to the Force" and it is the one I believe in. It reads:

In a time of great turmoil, the Chosen One shall arise
He shall bring balance to the Force, but not harmony
He shall bring emotion to the Jedi, but not compassion
He shall bring order to the galaxy, but not justice
And for a time, evil shall reign
But do not be dismayed at the balance that the Chosen One shall bring
For in it, goodness shall yet endure
Hope shall yet be born anew
And out of the deepest darkness, the brightest of all lights shall spring
(SOURCE: Star Wars: Episode III - The Republic Falls, a fan script by Stephen R. Burrows)

So, I believe that if Lucas' version of the Prophecy is anything like that then Anakin's turning to the Dark Side was the Will of the Force and it was not Obi-Wan's fault.

 

Did you just quote a fan script???

I think a properly trained Jedi, like Obi-Wan, for example, does not fall to the Dark Side of the force. The Jedi that do clearly don't believe that the Jedi way is really the best. Obi-Wan trains Anakin in the dogma of the Jedi, but Anakin never really believes it. He can repeat the code, but he can't follow it.

 

Yes, I did quote a fan script because that version of the prophecy is the one that makes the most sense to me.

 

Find something else that makes more sense...

 

That's not the point, you might as well be quoting Supershadow to make your point if you are going to quote a fan script.

 

Agreed; unless your source has at least some sort of official basis, it doesn't really get you anywhere.

 

You do realize that I said it is the one that "I most believe in". Does it really matter where it came from? I mean, seriously? The first words of my post are "I like to believe", so if it what I like to believe then who really cares where it comes from? It's MY opinion.

 

Understood, it's your opinion. But we try to back up our opinion with facts from credible sources here.

 

Well, to jedimasterbac's credit, he did conclude that post with "So, I believe that if Lucas' version of the Prophecy is anything like..." Key words, key words. He doesn't say he does believe it.

 

I'm not doubting jedimasterbac honest and valid opinions and posts. I just think quoting fan fiction will lead us down a dark path...

 

Complete was Anakin's training in ROTS so that would suggest that Obi did not fail in his training. Obi-Wan feels guilty because he is a good person, don't let that distract you from the bigger picture.... the prophecy.

 

Yeah I think he did.

He was too young to start training Anakin, in my opinion. He didn't have the experience of other Masters..
and because they were seperated only by a handful of years, I think there was this slight competitiveness between them, which really shouldn't have been there. Like in AOTC,

Obi: Besides your senses aren't that attuned my young apprentice.
Anakin: and yours are?
Obi: (haughty) possibly.

Yknow, maybe with someone like Qui-Gon Anakin could have learned to properly curb hia impatience and anger.

The two closest people to Anakin while he was growing up- Obi-Wan and Palpatine.
Anakin saw Obi-Wan as strict and dogmatic, so he couldnt really tell him his true deepest feelings. So he starts turning more to Palpatine, who is not only sympathetic, but boosts his ego with heaps of compliments. So Ani just gets blinder and blinder.. and in the end, he chooses Palpatines 'wisdom' over his master. I think thats the greatest failure of a parent or Master in this case, when your child has become so distant from you, 'mentally' that they take someone elses judgement over yours.

So Obi-Wan did get Ani through to becoming a Knight, just like many parents get their kids through teenage years/school etc. But that doesnt mean he did it in the best way possible, or that it didn't cause any rifts.

This is just my opinion.

 

i think anakin was ready to become a jedi at the end of the second movie, but his anger at not being trusted enough fueled him to go out to seek anothers master that would lets say " respect and nurture him"

 

I agree.

 

obi wan to anakin/vader in RotS
"i've failed you - i've failed you"

so he knows also. but i believe he did try the best he knew how ~ and an observant council would have listened to obi wan in attack of the clones when he worried about the over-confidence and the arrogance in his padawan. both mace and yoda chose to ignore that.
and obiwan was already doubting his own ability to try to train anakin.

 

Obi-wan feels that he failed Anakin, because the boy fell to the Dark Side. He did make Anakin a Jedi, but Anakin made his own choices when it came to using the Force for good or for ill. Anakin wasn't ready to be a Knight. He wasn't ready at Geonosis. Nor Jabiim, Kamino, Yavin 4 or even Praestylin. He had no control and had never let go of his attachments.

 

well that's true --- but why did he fall to the darkside? part of that failure IMO, of course, is due to Obi Wan's own self-recognized lack of ability to train him...
from A New Hope:
"Lars is not a man to let idealism interfere with business, whereas your father didn't think the question even worth discussion. His decison on such matters came like his piloting--instinctively"
and -
"He was betrayed and murdered", Kenobi declared solemnly, "by a very young Jedi named Darth Vader." he was not looking at Luke. "A boy I was training. One of my brightest desciples...one of my greatest failures." this is from George.


to keep this honest I need to add the contextual completion: "Vader used the training I gave him and the force within him for evil....."

 

Anakin made his own choices. Obi-Wan was no longer training him. How can anyone say Anakin's turning was Obi-Wan's fault?

It's the same with with kids and their parents. Your parents raise you as best they can. Of course they make mistakes and you make mistakes, but their goal is to get you to adulthood, and hope that you become a good person. If you end up being a criminal, you can't blame your parents (most of the time) for your dumb mistakes in life.

Obi-Wan was the only person keeping Anakin on the right path. That's why Sidious wanted them seperated so badly. He knew turning Anakin would be twice as hard with Obi-Wan around.

People are just looking for someone to blame, other than Anakin himself.

 

the blame is there.... it does not belong to one person or one entity -
it's anakin's fault
it's obiwan's fault
it's the council's fault
it's qui gon's fault
it's yoda's fault
it's mace's fault
it's padme's fault

the bottom line for me - it's palpatine's fault and he would embrace and love that. it worked.

what didn't work is:
the deceit of the jedi - to themselves. while acknowledging their growing weakness (even as early as TPM but most definitely by AotC -vocalized by yoda who blunted mace's suggestion to tell the senate that the jedi could no longer see the future - that the dark side was indeed growing and clouding everything) they did not listento anakin..they did not listen to obi wan...they did not listen even to themselves. they were played....and palpatine knew how to load the deck because the jedi reacted predictably. they did not adjust, they did not change, they didn't think they had to.