ST Do the films portray the New Republic negatively?

No. The reason why Leia isn't leading the New Republic is complicated. She was going to (reluctantly) represent the Populist party and run for First Senator (and most likely win), and then news broke out that she was Darth Vader's daughter. After that, almost no one in the Senate trusted her except for some of her closest Populist friends/co-workers and a Centrist who she previously hated with a passion.

 

It's kind of amazing that the films never address this.

 

It has nothing to do with our story in the films. And it took place 6 years before the films.

Edit: There really seems to be a disconnect as to what Star Wars has turned into compared to what it was, even, during the prequels. There is a comprehensive canon now that extends beyond films into other mediums so that stories like these can be explored without killing the stories that want to be told in the films. Some folks are clearly not on board with that.

 

As discussed before, I do think TFA (and the ST as a whole) really could have benefited from a small scene or two laying out some background information regarding the New Republic and it's Chancellor. I think that's one of TFA's major flaws in setting up the new trilogy.

I don't think, however, that most of the other information discussed in this thread needs to be explored in the films. It's just not necessary to focus on the story being told in the film. It's additional exposition that can easily be explored in ancillary material. If folks don't want to engage in that material - fine!

 

That's ridiculous. It's the entire reason why Leia is practically cut off from the New Republic and forced to lead a splinter faction into battle instead of an actual army. How does this detract from the story in any way? If anything, it shows how divided and leaderless the New Republic has become while also fleshing out Leia's own conflict. It's worldbuilding AND character building.

 

It's 6 years before the film. That's why it's not ridiculous. I'd rather them tell the story organically rather than trying to explain 6 years of exposition for a character who is not the primary protagonist in the trilogy.

The ancillary material is there to fill in background exposition like this. If you don't want to engage in it, that's your prerogative.

 

It also gave me backstory on why the galaxy at large basically ignored Leia's request for assistance at the end of TLJ. Thanks to the novel I understood that they had already not believed her earlier warnings because their distrust of her after the parentage reveal affected their perception of her.

 

Is grossly exaggerating the difficulty of putting in useful exposition that can be used to flesh out a relevant scene your usual tactic now?

 

But why should I have to read a book to understand a movie's stakes better? Shouldn't the movie actually do this. Books are great to add more content and additional details and stories. But that basic setup and stakes seem missing. I think we're all agreeing that we're not really given much to go on in the movies regarding this NR. There's a line or two, but not a whole lot. People can infer what they want, fill in the gaps as they please, but having the films not show what this government is like, how it relates to our main characters, or how, or why it did some of things it did during the 30 years between movies makes it hard to know the stakes really. It would be great if even just a single scene at the very beginning showed Leia frustrated with the incompetent NR. Show her struggle. Show that world, that government. That way when it's gone, we sort of understand why. Instead, its not even really told even. The NR is essentially a phantom, who is quickly, and easily eradicated. It has just as much importance as Snoke does, and oddly, both of the elements that cause the ST to play out as it does, are not really explained to us.

While it might make sense that there was a lot of conflicting actors in the galaxy stage, some of whom made it impossible to get much done, I would think that there would still be a majority of people who could do something. How could the NR think the FO was just bunk, when Leia had proof of it's existence. I mean, they're fighting 'something' for 6 years right? They're not making it up...right? How can the NR say, we support you secretively, go fight this secretively, and yet somehow also not know the FO is coming someday, or feign ignorance on the treat. I mean, Leia and Luke are force sensitive beings, in an organization that seemed to value the Force. Why would suddenly, no one takes her/them seriously? Her own son defected to them. Clearly they are a threat in some capacity. By the time of TFA, even before the FO destroys the NR capital, the FO runs around the galaxy like it owns the place. Just like the Empire did. Wouldn't Star Destroyers flying around cause any alarms to go off? Why isn't the NR patrolling the border to make sure nothing is steered up? Why would the NR allow a fragment of the old Empire to exist in the first place. Why let them flee to a new territory? Or do so with their destructive toys? Why let former Imperials have a voice in the senate? Why do nothing about children being kidnapped (I still find it very hard to believe that no one knew this was happening, or cared) Why not do anything about arms dealers were getting crazy rich?

Since none of this happens in the movies, and just going on what little the films do hint at, I would say the films to portray NR negatively. It's a massively incompetent government, that cannot defend itself, has allowed evils in various forms to run amok for decades, is possibly corrupted at its core, doesn't believe the one person who can help them fight to make this all better, and doesn't really support those who do want to fight and defend the reestablished democracy.

 

Yes! This is why I say that reading Bloodline enhances my enjoyment of the sequels. It doesn't make or break my enjoyment, but it absolutely enhances it. I believe that's the purpose of the ancillary material. I wouldn't even say that I'm an avid consumer of all of the extra material. I've read several of the books and watch the TV shows. It's not like I'm spending a lot of my time reading these books. I thought I'd enjoy a book centered around Leia, and I did!

Dear lord, if you're going to be so confrontational in every post of yours towards someone who is enjoying the current canon, then folks are just going to stop responding to you. It's pretty unbearable. Like, have a normal conversation with people instead of constantly spitting venom towards them. I've already mentioned, twice now in this thread, that the ST could have benefited from a scene that gives some background information on the New Republic and it's Chancellor. Going into detail about an event surrounding Leia that also happens to be a massive plot point of an ancillary Novel is completely unnecessary, especially when Leia isn't our main character.

 

The reason why it "enhances" your enjoyment is because without that novel, Leia would be completely one-note and the ST's conflict would be virtually indistinguishable from the OT's.

 

I never read the old EU and the only reason I picked up Bloodline was because it teased at the Leia/Vader lineage. It did help me in some aspects with TLJ but didn't particularly cause me to view TLJ favorably.

 

Perfect! Like I said, It won't make or break your enjoyment of the film. Just enhance it if you already enjoy it, and if not, at least fill you in on some background exposition that isn't really pertinent to the story at hand.

 

I have enjoyed a lot of the new EU, including Bloodline. I was disappointed by how disconnected that book was from TLJ. I thought that Leia’s history with the NR in the Vader reveal would inform plot regarding the galaxy’s reaction to the latest evil Skywalker, Leia’s son. That seemed like the obvious reason to make that a highlight of a book that was supposed to lead into TLJ and that had input from TLJ’s director. I wasn’t expecting literally zero context on the history of Kylo Ren and the Skywalkers and the state of the galaxy. I thought the middle movie existed to provide more context.

At the end of the day, though, I really don’t see how these two separate pieces of fiction even relate. Why would the Vader thing have anything to do with the Outer Rim allies losing faith in Leia? They were allies after the Vader reveal, and they lost faith, according to the movie from what I could tell, just because of the might of the FO. I thought they (rightfully) questioned the Resistance’s ability to oppose the FO (rightfully based on the events of TLJ, but it makes no sense to me when TFA is factored in and the destruction of SKB).

I actually really wish that the coordination was better because there was a lot of potential to portray the rich world of the expanded materials on film.

 

I'm actually not so sure that they do. I think someone only implied it in an above post.

For the record, Claudia Gray and Rian Johnson collaborated during the production of Bloodline specifically because there were aspects of the book that RJ thought would work hand in hand with the films.

 

I agree. I figured that it would just add more weight to the allies rejection of Leia if they had known about Vader AND Kylo being her son but it was never touched on. They essentially mistrusted everything she said from that point out even after all her years of service. It would have alot more sense if the mistrust from the Vader reveal was compounded by the fact that they learned/knew Kylo was her kid

 

I guess he changed his mind.

 

Based on the films alone, I don't care about Hosnian Prime being destroyed at all.

 

So, just to be clear, are you just here to troll at this point?

Was posting in here to help some fans understand aspects regarding the NR and FO. Not try and argue about the way the new canon is set up or about Rian Johnson collaborating in the development of a book that you didn't read.

 

Would TLJ have been better if Holdo had been a NR Vice Admiral and not a member of the Resistance?

So we get some explanation about the New Republic and the reveal from BF2 where you discover the First Order had rebuilt it's Fleet to levels even the Empire didn't have!

 

It was more of a stab at the "collaboration" that supposedly went on between Gray and Johnson when so little of Bloodline actually made it into the films. I'd hardly call it trolling.

 

I feel like the issue is "they" are not putting enough in the movies, and by that I don't mean "exposition" really. I think that the ST is trying to go with this feel more like the OT where we don't see all the worlds throughout the galaxy and see how it's all connected, but I think that might have been a bit of a mistake. I mean obviously I wouldn't like more quiet moments of sitting in the senate building with staring and stilted dialogue, but there is this feeling of a disconnect where we don't really know that much about the galaxy. That worked in the OT, but after the PT and the cartoons people have gotten used to more interconnection. I think there would have been a way to get people the feel of the scope of things without a bunch of exposition. Also I think that Leia's character WAS underdeveloped. I know they were saving Leia for IX, but that doesn't really excuse how she was used (or rather not used) in TFA. I don't know that the cut Leia scenes would have helped (I'm glad they were cut), but we just needed something. I actually felt like Bloodline was a really important book for understanding the ST, and actually Aftermath was rather helpful too. It's to the extent that I'm not sure they have mastered the art of spattering the story all over all these different mediums, while keeping the movie/trilogy the focal point where all the important and most meaningful stuff is.

I almost feel like we need a prequel trilogy for the sequel trilogy... Haha.

 

I think it boils down to JJ/RJ trying to make Star Wars like how they remembered it when they were kids and ignoring the evolution of the franchise in the past 38 years between ANH and TFA where the development of the lore and backstory has become such a central part of the franchise. So they ignore filling out the background information since there wasn't really necessary in the OT for them and no politics since that reminds people too much of the prequels.