Does anybody still think that George Lucas is a genius?

Discussion in 'The Phantom Menace' started by TheAnointedOne, Jan 14, 2003.

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  1. TheAnointedOne Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 2, 2002
    star 2
    When I was younger, I used to think that he was a genius, but now, I wonder. I'm inclined to believe that he has some talent, but probably isn't a genius. Just wondering what people think...
  2. LottDodd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 4, 2002
    star 4
    Never thought of him as a genius... but I always loved his movies. I think his faculties are better used as a producer, but you cannot fault a guy for living his dream.
  3. Lars_Muul Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 2, 2000
    star 6
    I think he is a storytelling genius.
  4. TokyoXtreme Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2001
    star 4
    I think that this belongs in Misc.
  5. OnlyOneKenobi Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 2002
    star 3
    He is a storytelling genius and has an enormous sense of imagination.
  6. JediGaladriel Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 1999
    star 5
    Well, the definition of a genius is pretty much someone who totally redefines his milieu... I'd say Lucas qualifies. He's been redefinining filmmaking since the seventies, and he shows no signs of slowing down.
  7. TokyoXtreme Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2001
    star 4
    To answer the thread's question, I'd say Rick McCallum does.
  8. Master Salty Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 1999
    star 6
    I don't know if I would go as far as "genius", but he is a great story teller.
  9. batvader Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 23, 2002
    star 3
    Well, in order to be where he is now (i.e. an important player in the business, and a million collector), the guy can't be ''dumb'', can he? :)

    Seriously, I believe he is a genius at creating fascinating stories.
  10. TheAnointedOne Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 2, 2002
    star 2
    "I think that this belongs in Misc."

    I'm sorry, let me clarify. I'm wondering what you guy think of GL based on what he did with TPM.
  11. TokyoXtreme Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2001
    star 4
    I think you're just afraid of the Misc. forum.
  12. JediGaladriel Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 1999
    star 5
    Well, based just on TPM, absolutely.

    As a storyteller, the story was incredible and wonderfully structured. It took a twenty year old franchise and revitalized it, giving a solid back story and simply picking up as though it had never been left.

    As a filmmaker, he and his people invented things that hadn't been done before (Jar Jar, totally CGI environments done photorealistically with live action interacting with it, etc) which became the standard within a year.
  13. TheAnointedOne Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 2, 2002
    star 2
    "I think you're just afraid of the Misc. forum."

    I'm afraid... I'm very afraid.

    To me, a genius is someone who is so gifted on a particular subject, that he is head and shoulders above the average person in that area. It seems to me that many on this very forum have crafted as good (if not better) a story as GL. I guess that's one of the reasons why I'm saying that he's not the genius I thought he was.
  14. Darth_Deagol Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 22, 2002
    star 2
    He's a heckofalot smarter than I am and I consider myself a genius. :mad:
  15. Lady_Sami_J_Kenobi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2002
    star 6
    Anointed,

    Well, I used to think GL was a genius until I saw the X-Files movie and discovered that "Foam Tatooine" is what the native Tunisians call their desert home. I also thought the underground dwellings in ANH were fantastic until I saw a picture in an atlas of the native homes of Tunisia, which were underground and looked much like the underground dwelling in ANH.

    Then I came here and found out how much GL has 'borrowed' from other sci-fi stories, most so old the younger fans would have no idea they were 'borrowed' ideas.

    Up until the time I saw TPM, I thought he was a storytelling genius, too. Now, nope. Not any more. ATOC eroded my opinion of him even more.

    Sorry. That's my opinion.

    Lady Sami
  16. stone_jedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 17, 2001
    star 4
    Nope. I never really did though. I don't find his new stories engaging or particularly fun, and not very creative as well. I hold a very similar opinion about things as does Lady Sami.
  17. DamonD Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2002
    star 6
    The mere fact such a website as TheForce.Net exists, with so many on this forum, indicates to me that Lucas is definitely a genius. Why else would so many people discuss and enjoy his work?
  18. JohnWilliams00 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 29, 2002
    star 4
    Before the prequels, I really admired the man and I even thought he had moments of genuis (some of the things in ANH and American Graffiti showed this).

    TPM came out and shook my confidence a little, but I tried to shrug it off as a minor mistep and attributed it to rusty direction after a 20 year hiatus. Lucas will dig deeper and deliver the goods again in AOTC. Yeah, that's what I told myself. But then, to my horror, he repeated the same weaknesses and flaws as he committed in TPM, and managed to invent a couple new ones.

    I joined these forums and I learned quite a bit about Goerge and his filmmaking process too. I didn't realize that Lucas really got much more help than I thought. (For instance, ANH's script had two uncredited writers to help out. Also, I learned more about Gary Kurtz's contributions. I learned that ESB benefitted from a talented director like Irvin Kershner, who paid attention to performances more than George ever would...)Also, Lucas, I would learn, "borrows" from a LOT of places. Not to mention he borrows so much from Kurosawa's body of work that I begin to wonder where does the term "homage" end?

    I used to think Lucas, like Spielberg, deserved an AFI Lifetime Achievement Award. Now, I don't think so, because he had two major chances to deliver something spectacular, and had every opportunity to improve upon his past successes, but has failed and fallen well below the mark in my opinion. And that's what stings the most. Wasted potential. Sort of sounds like Anakin's life, where the man has become increasingly dependent upon technology and has lost something along the way. And all along, he could've opted for better decisions.

  19. DarthMalifluous Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2002
    star 2
    Star Wars is nothing more, again, nothing more than combined sythentic knowledge. However, the simple realization that George had concerning this 30 years ago and utilizing this powerful storytelling/creation technique and also realizing that the public really do have a short memory or no memory at all, make him a genius of sorts.

    I also believe that he HAD the ability to recognize genius within people. He still has this gift to an extent, but it's fading fast; as evidenced by ILM's push into full CGI features... they're a little too late to get behind that 8-ball.
  20. JediGaladriel Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 1999
    star 5
    Well, I used to think GL was a genius until I saw the X-Files movie and discovered that "Foam Tatooine" is what the native Tunisians call their desert home.

    That's not exactly news... there are whole books on how he used Earth elements to create the SW cultures. They've been around for years--The Magic of Myth exhibit (and accompanying book) shows the original source and the SW derivative. That's why he's a genius--he knows how to translate reality into myth.

    The prequels are even better than the Classic in this way; the imagery is a wonderful synthesis of cultural symbols and icons.
  21. Lady_Sami_J_Kenobi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2002
    star 6
    Well, I think it's all in how you define genius. I define genius in story-telling as 'original' not derivative. Not simply recombining old elements in a new and different fashion. But, that's my opinion.

    Lady Sami
  22. JediGaladriel Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 1999
    star 5
    I think that storytelling is a traditional art, and most "all original" stories aren't very powerful as stories because of that. And most that are powerful use the same recycled elements and images (check Christopher Vogler, The Writer's Journey). Stories work on a deep symbolic level, and symbols only acquire meaning through being recognizable. The genius of SW is using them brilliantly (we're having a great conversation about the crucifixion/pieta imagery in Shmi's death scene).
  23. jasperjones Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2001
    star 4
    For the prosecution: Greedo shoots first.

    I rest my case. I'd like to see someone defend that as the work of a genius. On the other hand he did come up with most of this- I'll give him flawed genius.
  24. JediGaladriel Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 1999
    star 5
    For the prosecution: Greedo shoots first.

    For the defense:

    Greedo exists to shoot at Han, who also exists, in the cantina in Mos Eisley on Tatooine in the GFFA...

    And further, so what?
  25. Lady_Sami_J_Kenobi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2002
    star 6
    JediGaladriel,

    My response to you is Ursula K. LeGuin, esp. her EarthSea series. And Anne McCaffrey. Philip K. Dick.

    Greedo shooting first ruins Han's character.

    Lady Sami
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