Does anyone else get rankled hearing the PT actors disparage the trilogy?

I'll tell you why he DIDN'T Alpha... PRIDE. It was his story and he told it how he wanted to. Was it fun to watch? Absolutely. Was it well thought-out, and well-written? Heavens no. Lucas wanted Vader's story to be the story, and that is where he failed. StarWars was never intended to be all about Vader. But Lucas saw the dinero that Vader could bring him, and like every savy business-man, he capitalized on the opportunity. The result of his GREED is that the story comes across disjointed and choppy... all for a good reason. That's exactly how it was written.

 

Assuming this is true, for a moment, why should he be ashamed? So he didn't like the films. Big deal. A lot of actors don't like all of the films they've done. George Clooney hates his turn as Batman and the Killer Tomatoes film. Mariska Hargety (sp) would probably rather forget she did "Freddy's Nightmares". The Govenator would probably rather forget that he did the two Hercules films and "Red Sonja". A lot of actors have films that they'd rather forget existed. Ford has talked smack as much as he said that he was glad for the opportunity it opened for him.

And how does that make him ungrateful? He already had work before he signed on. Work that he is proud of.

 

Yeah, I guess Sir Alec Guinness should have been ashamed as well. Oscar nominee? Psh, you're ashamed of a single role.

 

GL is a great director, THX-1138, American Grafitti, SW/ANH, SW/TPM, SW,ROTS. Who cares what actors say. Hell, Harrison Ford has said bad things about SW and Indy for years but he also acknowledges the fact that w/out them he wouldn't have had the success he did. Sorry forgot about AG as well.

AG and SW/ANH are in AFI's 100 greatest movies of all-time. Has to say something for his directing skills.

Now, having said that, I think GL is still better at inventing stories, and Producing. Not bad as an editor. In the business he's been called a "super-editor." GL, by HF's words, said "GL knows what he wants and it's all right there in the script, but sometimes he has a hard time conveying it the way he see's it on screen." Still, considering he has changed the way Hollywood does movies, and how merchandising took it's que from SW/ANH, GL hasn't done bad.

Sorry for the tangent, but I really don't take any actor's perspective too seriously when critisizing SW. They accepted the role and all that encompasses that. Don't bite the hand that feeds you IMO.

 

^Fixed.

 

Indeed. The Crown-Jewel of the saga is ESB. Lawrence, Marcia and Irv gave that film a depth and quality that was equal to Lucas' razzle dazzle. He should have stuck with the original plan of having a different director for each movie, or in the very least left the ESB crew intact.

 

People accuse Lucas of having yes men, but do they have any proof of this?

 

As an Aries myself I can appreciate the way you can put your foot in your mouth. I believe his criticism is self directed. He thinks HE should have done a better job. He loves his costars and was great and a friend to all of them and likes George. He says his performace was god awful. Which is wasn't at all. He did a good job. Obi-wan is repressed. There was no way to make him unpretentious.

 

"He said the favourite movie he'd done was Trainspotting and the one he liked least was Star Wars."

This is the only direct quote in the article. The rest is the writer of the article's interpretation of that quote and possibly of other things Ewan may have said (or not). It should be remembered that most actors when talking about their favourite and least favourite films are talking about whether they enjoyed the process of making it, not the artistic achievement. Many actors don't like to watch films they've made as they know too much about how things were done. The illusion is broken for them.

The only quote directly from Ewan doesn't say that he thinks it was a bad film(s). It was his least favourite, which ties in with his previous comments about how fustrating he found the green screen work. Nothing new here, mountain out of a moleill.

I thought Ewan was great as Obi Wan.

 

The problem for actors with Star Wars is that it is such a unique phenomenon which everybody knows about, but it goes in directions that few people understand or at least are not mainstream by any stretch. There is alot of semi-esoteric didactic lore in Star Wars, especially in the prequel trilogy, which are just not common place conversational pieces in regular life. So alot of it seems to be cheesy on the surface to many people.
GL and Starwars are victims of their own success in this regard, cause as he has said a few times, he's amazed that stuff he likes has had such universal appeal, well not completely as he has mined some pretty universal sources as his inspiration. The average movie goer sees Star Wars, mayby a couple of times and it's a case of been there done that, what's the next tourist sight to check out type of thing. And because most people don't really get it, there is the whole issue of actors being stigmatised with a "cheesy, blue scren effects ridden, completely commercial toy commercial, they just did it for the money type putdown".
Star wars is actually more art, less product than the majority of stuff that gets made and it doesn't really compromise itself, especially the prequel trilogy but like anything that has such huge popularity, it's the easy to relate to stuff that gets the most attention. So the actors have all this highly visible stuff going on that is not the rule in their industry, an industry which can be known for being utterly pretentious, so they may lash out from time to time.
Star Wars is it's own thing, has it's own particular magic and it is some of the differences listed above that can be hard for the average person, actors included, to come to grips with.

 

Regardless of what the actors think, I believe they did a wonderful job at portraying their characters. Also, if they did so terrible at the PT, why don't they blame themselves?

 

Curious why this sort of empty-headed nonsense is allowed here?

 

You can't be seriously suggesting we censor someone because you don't agree with him. Thats absolutely crazy. Especially when he makes a valid point--Willard Huyck, Mark Hamill and John Milius have basically made the same argument, people who personally know Lucas best, so it seems its not as ill-founded as you would wish it to be.

 

It's got nothing to do with that. It's got everything to do with the fact that people like Jedi_Keiran_Halcyon have this silly little routine where they quote people back and alter their wording, without substantiating their point of view.

 

Jedi,

It's interesting that you bring up that specific issue; actors blaming themselves. While doing press for her recent film, Natalie Portman discussed this very same issue. She blamed herself totally with Episodes I and II. In a nutshell, she said that it was difficult to get work afer those two films and a lot of directors lost confidence in her acting ability. She even said she lost confidence in herself because of how the critics and fans went, in my opinion, overboard with their criticisms of the performances in the Prequels.

For me, Portman is a special case because I think she and Lucas worked really hard to make Amidala the way she was in Episode I. I think that's the performance that Lucas wanted, considering the character's situations in that film. And, I think she nailed it, except for the scene with the Gungans and Boss Nass starting the third act. And yet, she got killed and I think she lost a lot of confidence after that film came out. I think in Episode II she's spotty but it's not entirely her fault. It brings me to another point about the performances in these films.

The ADR work for Hayden and Natalie protrayed them a lot in the last two films. The reason I say this is because if you go back and look at the trailers for Episodes I and II and listen to how their voices sound in those trailers compared to the finished film, 9 times out of 10, their voices sound more natural in the trailers than they do in the finished film. It's not always but I sometimes wonder why Lucas didn't use the original production track instead of ADR.

For example, in Episode III when Anakin and Padme first meet, that is the actual production dialogue on set and both Hayden and Natalie nailed it. It sounded natural. It helped with their overall performance. The scene in the meadow in Episode II, I think is ADR but that's another example of them getting it right. But, there are other examples of them both getting it wrong. They do have trouble with ADR, especially Hayden.

I'm am curious to hear and see what their performances would've been like through the trilogy had Lucas, if able, were to use more of the production dialogue instead of ADR. I'm almost willing to bet that their performance would've been much better in certain spots. Another example is the Extended Arrival of Naboo scene on the Episode II DVD. They sound natural and it helps with the visual performance for both. They have chemistry. If you compare it to the scene in the actual film, both are off.

Again, this is just a theory I have but it's supported by some hard facts about their acting. Personally, I think they both were fine with some rough patches that could've been solved easily through another go round in the editing room (especially in Episode II) and ADR work or lack there of.

Sometimes, its on the actor. Sometimes, its on the director. Sometimes, it's on both. But, I still believe, with the stylized, theatrical way Lucas was doing these films (historical dramas in a sci-fi setting), the criticisms was a tad too overboard.

 

Regarding ADR, its normal to re-record most of the dialog in post-production. In normal dramas you can get a lot of it onset but you still end up re-doing a good 30% of the dialog again in a sound-studio. In action films its normal to have 50-80% of the dialog re-recorded, and the same with movies that are shot on location. So the PT is not at all special in this regard. Any typical big-budget film, from LOTR to Harry Potter to Spiderman to Bourne Ultimatum has much of the dialog re-recorded again. Which is why nobody really complains about this process so much--its part of the normal process (as opposed to the lengthy bluescreen work, which often recieves flak and is unusual as far as typical films go).

 

You do know this post was made in SEPTEMBER. You coming in here and quoting something from that long ago smacks of trying to start trouble. Let it go.

 

zombie,

Yeah, I know that ADR is pretty standard when it comes to films of this size. That's really not the issue. The issue is that, at times if you go by the trailers for these films, their own set dialogue sounds much better than the work they did in ADR and I'm curious as to why Lucas choose the ADR work than the production dialogue. I mean, it's his films but one of the very few criticisms I have toward Lucas on the Prequels deals with this specific aspect. I mean, Natalie sounded ten times more natural if you go by specific shots in the trailers for Episodes I and II plus some deleted scenes than what ended up in the film.

I just have this theory, especially with Episode II, that if Lucas went back to some of the production dialogue in some parts of the first two films, Natalie and Hayden's performance would get a huge bump in quality.

I mean, the prime example is the line Natalie says in the hangar in the beginning of the battle for Naboo. It's "Get to your ships!" See how it was in the trailer and compare it to how it was in the film. I don't know why Lucas went that route. It's not like she was in full Amidala gear during that specific sequence. She was Padme. It wouldn't have been a bad thing to use her real voice because, again, she nailed. It sounded on point and more natural. The same can be said for Hayden as well in Episode II.

Again, this is just a small pet peeve of mine when it comes to the criticize of the performance. I think, at least for me, that you can separate the visual aspects of their acting from how they sound as well. It all should come together, no doubt. But, sometimes, both of them visually acted the hell out of their scenes but their voices are what may have killed a scene. I'm arguing that that didn't have to be the case at specific scenes if Lucas would've either taken more ADR takes or use the production dialogue.

I would say that this is my only, true major criticism of Lucas and the Prequels.

 

I think for many of the Star Wars actors, both OT and PT, Star Wars comes as a mixed bag. On one hand, they're a part of this massively popular cinematic phenomenon but on the other, the over-exposure they receive can get a little overwhelming. Neither are the working conditions that great. Lucas himself has admitted that his least favourite part of making a movie is the actual shooting and some of the material the actors were handed wasn't that inspiring plus working a lot in front of the bluescreen must've got tiring in the end.

Still, despite whatever criticisms they have of the process, I would still hope that the actors realise the value of what they've been a part of and the hours of enjoyment us fans have derived from their work. And personally, I think they do.

 

yodas,

They do. They realize the value of being associated with Star Wars, whether good or negative. What I find most interesting is that since Episode III, we haven't heard that much for Hayden on the subject. I just pray he doesn't come down with the "Mark Hamill" syndrome.

Natalie knows the value. I've read almost every interview and since a lot of her interviews since the very beginning and she understands the exposure she got with the films and what they mean to kids of a certain age and she welcomes that. There is another side to her opinion of the Prequels and from what I can gather, it has more to do with herself than it does with the actual films.

She's stood up for George on a couple of instances through the process but does acknowledge that, with Episode I, she was out of her element, unprepared, and by her own admission somewhat unprofessional during the making of that film. With Episode III, I know she wanted one more crack at it, like a lot of the principal actors, to send the series off right...and was happy with how the final film turned out, both for herself and for the series. Still, I bet if you asked her if she would do it all over again, I'm not so sure she'd say yes. I would hope so because I see no other playing that role, flaws and all.

 

I have a feeling that a lot of the actors probably wouldn't have taken the roles if they had seen the scripts in advance. I mean, take Ewan McGregor: he really doesn't like the prequels, he says they are his worst films, and he obviously regrets doing them. And for a seven-year commitment, thats a big chunk of your career in the toilet. But if you look back to the days from before Episode I began filming--he's so excited! "I'M GONNA BE IN STAR WARS!" is how he acts in all the documentary material from before the films began shooting, and you can see he is just giddy when he gets to pick out his own lightsaber. He loved the original films and this was a huge honor--and I think thats how pretty much everyone felt. Everyone signed on without seeing a script--they just assumed it would be more George Lucas gold, that it would be Star Wars all over again. But once they get filming and TPM is finished--they start to have this new attitude, like "...oh. Huh." I think they were all shocked at how bad the final product was. But they all signed on three-film deals at the very beginning on the basis of the original films, without seeing any scripts. And even then they assumed that maybe things would improve--it was still enough to get Hayden Christensen to sign on after TPM was out. But the same thing seemed to happen to him--I remember an interview where he says that after he got the script to Episode II (when he had already flown to Australia) his reaction was, to quote, "I'm ****'ed", because no matter what he did there was no way he could deliver the dialog and play the part without getting slaughtered by audiences and critics. And that seems to be the same thing that Portman felt.

You have to remember that when you are an actor in such a highly visible role, this is your reputation on the line; you may very well be a good actor but if you have a script thats no good then no matter how good you are it'll still come off weak, and people can only judge you by what they see you do. McGregor and Portman were already known names and got lots of roles anyway, so they could overcome it, but Christensen was and still basically is unknown, and Jake Lloyd gave up acting altogether. People often don't account for this reputation aspect, but its not to be underestimated--recently I worked on The Incredible Hulk, and I was amazed at how sensitive and involved in every aspect that Edward Norton was; it took me a few days of shooting to realise that this was his big, big star vehicle, the film that more people will see him in than Fight Club and American History X combined, so he had plenty of reason to be concerned everything came off okay. Thats why Brad Pitt recently left whatever movie it is that he was on--the script had problems when he finally read it, and even though he breached his contract and will probably be sued, he felt it a better wound to take, because if he stayed he wouldn't have been able to deliver and it would have not only made a poor movie but it would have harmed his career. On that basis I think most actors would have stayed away from the prequels if they had seen an actual script. That seems to be the case in McGregor and Portman, and Neeson was so disgruntled that he said he was quitting the biz the week TPM came out. Lucas was lucky in that he sort of "tricked" everyone (not intentionally) by getting most of the big players to sign onboard back in 1997 on the strength that it would be like 1977 all over again. I guess we should all be lucky that he was able to do that!

 

I feel sorry for Hayden now after reading your post Zombie.

 

Natalie Portman has a right tot be diappointed. She was for the most pary bad. Ewan said he was diappointed with his profomance. But, said he was thrilled to do the movies. I personally thought he did a good enough job.

 

I think they all did a good job. If they are upset by the own performace that's up to them. For me i just loved watchin them perform in SW. I loved been back in the SW universe once again. It had been far to long a wait.

 

The only thing that Ewan MacGregor has said about the Star Wars prequels that he didn't like, was having to work in front of the blue/green screen a lot. And that he doesn't consider it his most favorite series of films. That doesn't mean that he hates his work. And Liam Neeson's remarks about quitting the biz were taken out of context. He had filmed both TPM and "House On Haunted Hill" back to back. Two films with a lot of blue/green screen work. It would be a pain if you weren't used to it. And let us not forget those who found working on the PT to be the greatest thing and never had anything bad to say afterwards. Such as Sam Jackson, Christopher Lee and Ian McDiarmid.