Dooku over Obi-Wan

I have never seen the thread, "Could Obi-Wan beat Dooku?" Kind of glad I haven't but what do you think makes Dooku superior to one of the most powerful Jedi in the universe.

Could it be because of the Qui-Gon connection?

 

[obi wan] Possibly [obi wann]

 

I read in another thread that explained that Dooku could predict every move Obi-Wan made because of the connection. Remember too that Dooku held his own against Yoda. I doubt very few Jedi would be able too including Obi-Wan.

 

Well, Dooku was able to to hold Yoda off twice (the second time in Dark Rendezvous). I read that Mace Windu was only out sparred by Yoda and DOOKU. So I guess the only people able to out duel are Anakin and Sidious.

 

of course obi wan could kill dooku, i mean aniken killed dooku and obi wan defeated aniken so there you go of course he could defeat dooku

 

I've always thought Obi was pyschologically afraid of Count Dooku. He trained qui-gon so naturally, Obi-wan would have the same weaknesses and fighting styles. Obi knows this, knows Dooku's reputation, knows he can't win, when you go in like that, you proably aren't going to win.
Also, if you look at training as family, Dooku would be like grampa, so you wouldn't really want to hurt your grampa, I know that sounds silly, but it is partially true.

 

obi wan beat anakin on mustafar..but he got his butt kicked by dooku and anakin was a sith

 

In the novel it was stated,that during Dooku/obi/Ani confrontation,Obi was in fact toying with Dooku,until Dooku caught him off guard and unfocused.

For RockmeAmidala:It Anakin,not Aniken

 

It's not as simple as that

Both times we see Obi Wan go up against Dooku he got owned. So everything seen in the movies tells us that Obi Wan would have struggled to beat Dooku.

 

Yes Obi Wan was "toying" with Count Dooku in AOTC and ROTS yea right whatever. His toying almost got him killed twice if not for Anakin

 

Oh no, another "in circles debate" is brewing, I can feel it. Look Obi went down to Dooku, it doesn't make him any less of a hero or a Jedi. It just means Dooku was a really powerful man. C'mon is it so hard to believe that the guy who trained Qui-gon beat his apprentice?
Toying? Yeah, well, we all know Obi likes to do that from time to time, but it wasn't too smart of him eh?
Both times, Count Dooku got the better of him.

 

Every duelist has a weakness, Obi's is Dooku, like Anakin's is Obi.

 

Obi-Wan lost to Dooku because Anakin had to be the one to fight/kill him to drive the plot. Simple as that. It was the "Let's put Obi-Wan out of commission so that Anakin will be the only one fighting him" plot device. Pretty easy and convenient and no thinking involved. Too bad GL couldn't have been more creative.

 

Too true; as we have already seen from rots obi-wan is a much superior duelist when compared to anakin. (as anakin's charred, drooling, barely alive carcass is testament to )

The fact is that dooku could have crushed anakin as well (just as he did in ep 2); however he was toying with him in order for anakin to go over ot the dark side, just as sidious ordered him to. Had sidious not done so, dooku would have ended the duel in a heartbeat by crushing anakin via the force like he did obi-wan.

 

It seems uncreative because you appear to have missed an important plot point that is only briefly hinted at in the movie. Obi-Wan being put out of the fight was planned by Dooku and Sidious before the Jedi even arrived (explained in the novel). It WAS so Anakin would be the only one fighting Dooku. Dooku believes the plan is to kill Obi-Wan, thus sending Anakin into a dark rage. Dooku would then hold back a bit (rofl) allowing Anakin to defeat him, and then Anakin and Palpitine would bring him back as a political prisoner (to be released when the Empire rises). Sidious had convinced him neither Jedi is a match for him. By taunting Anakin and hurting Obi-Wan, Dooku would show Anakin the benefits of using his anger, thus giving Sidious an opening to begin his teachings. Sidious keeps up a cowardly act until Anakin takes Dooku's hands. As soon as this occurs - HELLO - Sith teachings away, lol. Dooku did everything Sidious asked, but unfortunately for him didn't forsee the plan through to its logical conclusion.

 

i disagree, the actor who plays Dooku said in an interview that Dooku was "past his prime". This would have no relevance to the story if he was just toying with Anakin the whole time. He did at first, then realised he was in over his head

 

Dooku>Obi-Wan>Anakin>Dooku>Obi-Wan>Anakin...etc...it's a circular argument if you use that logic.

Given what we've seen in the films, it seems that Dooku is stronger than Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan never even gives him a run for his money. He blocks a little lightning, then he get owned. In ROTS, Dooku throws him around like a ragdoll while fighting Anakin. Obi-Wan is my favorite character and quite the Jedi, but in terms of pure skill, he's not on the top level with Yoda, Sidious, Mace, etc...

As rated by Nick Gillard, the saber coordinator, Obi is an eight on the saber skill level, all those other guys, including Anakin, are nines.

"On Attack of the Clones, I had to give them levels," he (Nick Gillard) said, "Sidious is a level nine [out of ten]. On this film, Obi is eight - he's moved up - Anakin is a nine; Mace is a nine, Yoda is a nine. They're up there with Sidious"

Page 133, The Making of ROTS.


"You have to be either Mace or Yoda to compete with the Emperor" Lucas says. "If Anakin hadn't gotten all beat-up, he could've beat the Emperor"
From the Making of ROTS, page 205

Notice Lucas doesn't mention Obi-Wan.

 

if yoda, mace, and the emperor are all 9's then what the heck is a 10? Would that be what anakin would end up being if he never went to the darkside?

 

Probably.

 

Obi-Wan lost to Dooku because Anakin had to be the one to fight/kill him to drive the plot. Simple as that

I agree and the reason is Dooku's style - it's something few Jedi have seen or have much knowledge of. The novel does a good job of explaining to me (no experience except movie watching) that Dooku used the tip of his lightsaber a lot, and in fact ofen retracted his blade rather than parrying. In AoTC, when Obi-Wan went to block a swing, Dooku retracted his blade and there was "nothing" there for Obi-Wan to block; Dooku then extended his lightsaber into Obi-Wan's shoulder, and repeated this in the thigh.

If you're not expecting or trained to handle this type of fight, it's no surprise you don't do too well. Too bad this wasn't more obvious in the movies, as many folks have complained about Obi-Wan's failure to effectively fight Dooku as misleading folks into believing Obi-Wan was not a good fighter, rather than ineffective in fighting Dooku.