Oceania ELECTION 04 - Who *will* win? (Official Discussion of 2004 Federal Election)

Good luck, have fun! ^.^v


Think of me when you are voting, sitting at home with the co-president of my own little late formed party. Missing out on all the action. I bet voting is a lot more fun than I remember.

 

I don't believe it is very fun...

 

dead right DR, not fun at all

 

"...and remember exactly how well off this country is right now."

Not the country, the entire world. There's very little Australia can do to run its own economy. Australia is a small leaf bobbing about on the tidal currents of the global business cycle, especially so given how much we need to import. When the worm turns and we hit a recession, you best believe those interest rates will rise regardless of who is in control of the nations parliament because global banking and finance organisations control them....not the Australian Government.

This is why we have "good times" economically now and suffered "bad times" under the Keating years....the entire world was in a massive economic recession. Austalia is not immune to that. Howard is full of hot air on the economy, aside from constricting spending across the board and reaping billions from the GST and NOT SPENDING IT for the past 8yrs. Surplus budgets? Great! That means we can invest in cool things to help the citizens. And not just at election time!

When Howard says "who do you better trust to run the economy and keep interest rates low".....it's not something he has any control over. So ignore the economy as an issue for a moment and look at who has the better social policies in place, policies that will effect your life on a daily basis. Look at who committed you to ongoing wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, look at who is refusing to be even remotley environmentally concious enough to ratify the Kyoto Protocol on carbon emissions (every country in the world has signed it aside from Australia, America and China or Christ sake!) Look at who has outright lied to you as a taxpayer on many issues on many occasions. Look at who is turning your country into the sheriff of the Pacific. Look at who tried to sell your cultural future up the river for a few bucks with a grossly unfair Free Trade Agreement. Look at who took money away from the primary and high school you went to and gave it to a couple of expensive private schools in Sydney. Look at who promised not to sell the rest of Telstra....then tried to anyway. Look at who introduced ****eloads of new taxes on your superannuation payments then made superannuation compulsory for every working Australian.

Is this the Government you want for the next 3yrs?

This is not an election just about the economy!

 

Katana: I agree with you there, the NUS isn't being very subtle about who it thinks you should vote for. You'd be an idiot to vote against the Liberal party simply because they tell you to. However, part of being an educated and intelligent member of society is that you form your own opinions from a variety of sources, which are going to be biased to various degrees in various directions. It's unfortunate that the valid points that they make get lost in some of the other rubbish they espouse, but that's politics for you.

 

So the election is tomorrow.

In the years since I have been allowed to vote, I can't remember an election that has been so important in it's result and it's impact on our future as a nation.

There are a few things that have me deeply concerned.

I am now aware of quite a few people I know for whom this is their first vote. This should be a time when these people are supposed to be excersing their democratic right to have their say, but far too many of this group have been sat down by a parent or similar, and effectively told how to vote.

Now there's nothing wrong with advice, or hearing an opinion, but being told who to vote for is effectively one person doubling their say by taking the voice away from their child.

I remind you all that this is a secret ballot, it's illegal for anyone to watch you vote, or ask who you voted for before you hand that folded slip of paper into the ballot box.

If you're being pressured to vote one way or another and you don't want to do it, then they will never know what you put on that ballot paper. Just fill it out how you want, and then place it in the box, you are the only person who will see it before you leave the building.

As for those who are being brow-beat into voting for their parents political parties, ask yourself if your parents way of life is how you see your life being lived. If you're being told to vote for a party that goes against your way of life, or feel your lifestyle would be restricted to levels below that of the average "normal" citizen, then I urge you to re-think your parents politics.

For many of you it is your first vote, your chance to have a say who runs our country and it's your opinion that's being asked.

Don't stuff it up by being told who to vote for, or by turning in an invalid voting form.

This time it's far too important for your voice not to be heard.

I'm sorry for the preachy nature of this post, but it's something I felt I had too say.

 

Is this the Government you want for the next 3yrs?

Of course when your precious Laborites are concerned, everything they touch turns to gold and all the positives are their doing? I don't know why but this little voice screams "Hack" in your general direction.

E_S

 

As for the senate situation, that's a bit more complicated. You either choose one box and they decide where your preferences go, or you go through ever party and order them. So I thought a little English to Politics translation would be helpful. Yeah I know it's a bit late but I couldn't log on until now.
Not comprehensive, but every name on the right exists in at least one state.


The Australian Tree Huggers - the greens

National Poofter Bashing Party - family first

Nazis for Jesus - Christian democrats

The Make Grey Hair Mandatory Party - citizens electoral council

The Sheep Shaggers - the national party

Maoist Communism Party - socialist alliance

We Hate Children - liberals for forests

Kill the Whales Party - fishing party

Cannibus Collective - hemp

Anarchy for Australia - non-custodial parents party

Democrats for the Lynching of Poofters - democratic labor party

The AKKK - one nation

The Arse Lickers' Union - progressive labor party


Enjoy your vote.

 

Coalition won.

 

Hardly surprising, but dissapointing nonetheless.

 

Fantastic news! With a swing to the government of 1.6%! We haven't seen two successive swings to a government since the heady days of Bob Menzies.

And look out Senate, here we come. Expect those Telstra 3 offer documents in the mail shortly

 

Yeah, I agree, fantastic result.

E_S

 

More proof that the minority is usually correct.

 

It's amazing how the masses always praise mediocrity, isn't it?


I worked in a polling station yesterday and when counting the votes in the evening, it was amazing how many people wasted their votes and wrote smart arsed comments instead.

Not to mention the amount of people who ****ed up their votes by accident, and after spending half the day slowly explaining to people how to fill out the forms, it's slightly irritating.

I don't know about any other stations, but at mine about 1/3 of the wasted votes were people who placed a 1 below the line in the labor column instead of a 1 above the line. About 1/4 did the same for the liberal.

Would be interesting to see how it would have turned out if one would be allowed to include votes which were obviously made towards one particular party, but mucked up their filling out of the form...

 

Oh, how correct I was in predicting that people would either piss and moan, or belittle the result, because in their Triple J inspired trendy state, they wanted Labor to win.

Should have bet upon it.

E_S

 

Ender, people dislike a sore winner just as much as they do a sore loser. So either say something constructive, or save us all the waste of time and not post anything.

 

I couldn't agree more with Dingo. I think we should keep rude comments to ourselves. I prefer Labour over Liberal, but certain attitudes deterred me from even participating in this debate.

And Ender, "Triple J inspired trendy state"? I think you need to realise you're not the only one that can make independent decisions. There are many sensible people on JC and in this Fan Force - and I'd bet they made up their own mind without listening to your diatribe or media influences etc.

Ams

 

Oh, how correct I was in predicting that people would either piss and moan, or belittle the result, because in their Triple J inspired trendy state, they wanted Labor to win.

Should have bet upon it.


Yes, a remarkable prediction. Never heard of people doing that before ... [/sarcasm]


Why do you assume people upset by the result wanted the ALP to win?


And people in a "JJJ inspired trendy state" are more likely to vote Green than ALP.

 

A lot of Green/ALP supporters will be understandably devastated by this result, especially the followers of Philip Adams, Margo Kingston et al. I think they were expecting Australia to repudiate Howard's evil agenda of lying at every opportunity, aligning himself with the Fascist US and deliberately smashing the poor. As my own poor mother plaintively put it "I just can't understand it".

Well understand this: the soft-left Keating-esque agenda is utterly dead in this country, and good riddance. We are in a golden age of conservative politics where social stability and economic prosperity (which, I firmly believe, leads to greater individual liberty and thus is the paramount goal of every government) reign supreme.

This also sends a message to all the tinpot dictators and islamofascists out there who think the West is decadent and weak; the first leader of the coalition of the willing passed with flying colours, and so will the second. The proudest moment of Saturday night, for me, was Howard's mention of the election in Afghanistan and the fact that as a nation we stand up for what we believe in. Howard is a statesman; Latham looked like a school bully who'd been told off by the headmaster.

Oh yeah, and Mike Moore: *** **** and ****!

 

It was a scare campaign I telsses yous!

 

Howard Politics:

Step 1: Deny there is a problem.

Step 2: Deny any knowledge of the problem.

Step 3: Blame it on someone else.

Step 4: Lie about it.

Step 5: Throw money at it.

Step 6: Get re-elected.


I can't understand why anyone can justify Howard. His ambitions are to destroy Medicare, raise HEX, make the school system less affordable for ordinary people, and do away with long-term revenue sources, so that we will be poorer in the long run. He is also actively feeding hostilities from the Muslim world ie. Indonesia, and following in George Bush's footsteps by making the country an international enemy. I won't even go into his refusal to sign Kyoto. The fact is, at his age he can afford not to care about the future for Australia. That's why he makes no effort to bring down foreign debt and the account deficit, despite claiming it was a top priority for his government; instead he spends excessive amounts of public money on propaganda for his party. Trailing in the polls, he got back through massive handouts and scaring people with the idea that interest rates -might- rise under Latham, because he couldn't find anything concrete.

His pandering to US demands and refusal to admit his mistakes shows weakness, not strength. Being a strong leader is one thing, but pig-headedness is entirely different.

And by the way, I live in the US so I do think for myself on this.

 

Sore winner?

Please. If I ran around going "lol we pwn3d j00 n00bs lol!!1!" maybe. Perhaps I'm a little tired of people equating Howard with the systematic destruction of the country and suggesting Australians are, by and large, stupid for reelecting him.

I do feel sorry for Labor because for them, this was a disaster. But I'm not sorry that I voted Liberal, nor do I think the result was bad, dire, or any other drastic prediction.

So, I'm sorry you lost Dingo but to accuse me of being a sore winner, sans proof, isn't going to change ****. And people suggesting that Australians are stupid for voting Howard in are unlikely to convince anyone of anything except perhaps arrogance.

E_S

 

Perhaps Ender, Dingo was more concerned that at every possible moment you equate anyone who has raised an objection to the coallition government or John Howard, to being part of some quasi-mystical JJJ listening, tree-hugging, uneducated babel that mills about looking for something to whinge about.

Democracy is based on the central tenant of diversity of opinion being brought together to a majority consensus. That on this occasion the coallition won in a most dramatic fashion in no way invalidates or undervalues the impassioned and informed beliefs many of we others have.

Personally, I am quite heartbroken, because I devoted months upon months of my time, working hundreds of volunteer hours to try and get my mob over the line. My work has amounted to something worse than failure, in that we have gone backward. Although I give kudos to the liberal party and those who worked for them for an excellently won victory, I do take exception to comments that undervalue the work I and many others put in, or that scorn the beliefs I and many others firmly hold.

We are not upset because it is "trendy" or that we read that was how we should feel in the latest issue of Left Weekly.

It is said that the true victor is he who is humble at his moment of greatest glory. A bit of civility is all we ask.

 

i thought the zoo would end when the elction was over

Please exuces me while I run out of the thread and throw up

*runs out*

that's better, now this will be the last i comment on politics until next election

I'm glad howard one, I had a very bad feeling about Latham from when I saw him which was why i voted Libs

what i didn't like was how my parents BULLIED my sistser and i into voting liberal. she voted labor because of HECS and my mum asked her why she did a thing like that. she had an awful time saturday night while my stepdad lectured her on the kind of people who vote labor. He saud she voted selfishly/

In the end i felt like telling him to stick his head in a bucket as she's entitled to vote for whoever she wants.

 

So, I'm sorry you lost Dingo but to accuse me of being a sore winner, sans proof, isn't going to change ****. And people suggesting that Australians are stupid for voting Howard in are unlikely to convince anyone of anything except perhaps arrogance.



I love it when I can predict people's reactions. Quick bit of background so you don't have to go hunting for it yourself. I live in the ACT where both seats, Fraser and Canberra, are mainly heavily entrenched Labor seats, with Canberra requiring about a 8-10% swing for Labor to lose it, and Fraser (my electorate) required 12-14% (approximate swings as I don't have the exact figure handy). In the Senate, we have one Liberal and one Labor senator.

Now, in both the Senate and House of Reps, even though the results were almost guaranteed here, I voted Liberal. I did not "lose" anything especially since I'm not a member of either the Liberal or Labor, but one of the fun group of swing voters. Come Saturday's Territory election I will be voting for Labor here in the ACT because of what the Stanhope government has to offer over the still not-totally-together Liberal team, and I have no qualms over either of my choices.

So, please remove your head from where it is firmly inserted; and, along with a fair number of people who have been posting in this thread, start acting like an adult.