Lit Empire and Rebellion: Razor's Edge (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Dr. Steve Brule, Sep 3, 2013.

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  1. Dr. Steve Brule Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 7, 2012
    star 4
    In what is a first ever for me, I received an advance copy of the new Leia book by Martha Wells. I asked about making a thread for this since it's less than a month since the release, but since there was no response, I thought I'd take the initiative.

    Now, to be fully honest, I haven't yet in-depth read the novel, and I don't know if I'll get to it before the release, but I have skimmed through it, and I have a few general thoughts.

    First, given this is the Lit forum and everyone here is an EU hound, here's how the book ties into the EU: Almost not at all. There are a (very) few EU references, but almost all of them are either species (including one that's only been in the Hand of Thrawn series) or planet names mentioned (including several cities on Alderaan from various EU sources). The one exception is that the main Rebel ship featured is the Independence. As far as I can tell, no EU characters show up and there is no reference to any EU story. I get the distinct impression that when writing the story, Wells needed a planet to reference or a city from Alderaan to have a character from, and just selected one from Wookieepedia.

    There is, however, a lot of references to stuff from the OT (I wasn't able to find anything from the PT or TCW, however). Besides the strange choice of General Willard, Madine also appears, Mon Mothma is mentioned, and the plot involves the establishment of Echo Base. Plus, of course, lots of reflection on ANH. There are, however, a large cast of original characters, including several original species.

    Overall it definitely seems like Martha Wells was an author who was probably a fan of the OT but not really familiar with anything else Star Wars and was being very tentative in entering the saga. It actually reminds me a lot of Legacy Vol. 2 in that regard.

    In terms of the actual plot, from what I've skimmed through it's not a lot more complex than the blurb. I like the idea of Leia having a run-in with Alderaanian pirates (specifically mentioned to have been part of the former defense fleet) but not really sure how I feel Wells succeeded in making them believably be willing to turn Leia over to the Empire. The Imperial antagonist crew and the Rebel rescue crew are really nothing to write home about. Same with the characterization of the OT cast - decent enough, I guess it's a good if somewhat bland Leia, not as sure about Han.

    Overall I'd say it's not a terrible read, but just kind of...exists. Don't think it will make anyone's most-hated list, but also doubt it will make it on anyone's favorite list either, and assuming the EU continues to exist, I can't really see any characters from it really being interesting enough to any other author to take their place in the wider EU.
  2. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    Someone here mentioned that this trilogy of novels was deliberately written to be as detached from the Expanded Universe -- and each other -- as possible.
  3. Dr. Steve Brule Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 7, 2012
    star 4
    I can definitely see it. This is about as much of a pure standalone as any Star Wars novel can possibly be.
  4. krtmd Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 5, 2012
    star 4
    Well, that's a bit disappointing. As a Leia fan, I was really looking forward to this book. I'll still read it, but *sigh*.
  5. Barriss_Coffee Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2003
    star 6
    Darn. I was holding out hope this would be an interesting series since it's basically the only new stuff we're *confirmed* to be getting for a while outside of the comics.
  6. Revanfan1 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2013
    star 5
    Sometimes new is good–in this era, new is necessary, with VII coming. Leaving the old EU behind isn't necessarily a bad thing–as long as these books don't contradict the EU, I see no problem with them being "disconnected" because that was the intention, just as it is with Dark Horse's Star Wars series–pretending ANH was the only thing out at the time (with the exception of Mon Mothma's mention and General Madine's appearance). Hence General Willard instead of, say, Cracken. If you want a book in this era with heavy connections to EU, that's why Allegiance and Choices of One were written. Anyways, that's my feelings on it totally based on nothing but assumptions made from the first post. :p

    I still intend to read it, but this will probably be library material–no reason to pay hardback prices for this (or, really, any of the books in this series, probably).
  7. BoromirsFan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2010
    star 4
    Darn. At the very least I wanted a solid book..EU references or not.
  8. Todd the Jedi Mod and Sitcom Dad of SWTV

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Oct 16, 2008
    star 5
    Yeah, I'm in no rush to read these books. Unless the Han and Luke ones have something awesome in them, like, say, Crimson Jack, then I'll be perfectly fine waiting for the paperbacks.

    But yeah, way back when Shelly Shapiro or Jen Heddle or someone said that these authors were free to write whatever stories they wanted, as long as each revolved around their given character and took place 0-3 ABY. Clearly it's up to the individual writers whether or not they actually want to incorporate EU material into their book.
  9. _Catherine_ Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2007
    star 4
    And the Emperor, and the second Death Star, and the Executor, and Ackbar, and TIE Interceptors, and Boba Fett. Basically it failed its mission statement right out of the gate. :p
    cdgodin and Revanfan1 like this.
  10. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    Ignoring Empire and Jedi was a dumb idea anyway because it's restrictive. You know there's stuff like everything listed, but you won't use it because you're "ignoring" it, but you also can't use other stuff because it would contradict the stuff which you're "ignoring."
  11. Jeff_Ferguson Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 15, 2006
    star 4

    Crap, you're right. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Upcoming_novels is looking pretty skimpy these days.

    These are hardcovers?
    ... Why?
  12. AdmiralWesJanson Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 5
    Ishori? Diamala?
  13. Zeta1127 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    All of the currently planned novels are hardcovers as I understand it, which basically means I will be waiting for the paperback if I am interested, because I can't afford hardcovers unless its something special like HttE:20thAE.
  14. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5

    Friend gave me his preview copy because he is bored beyond help with this book and I can't blame him, but one EU reference is there right at the start that nearly blew my mind, an Imperial Customs Light Corvette. ;)

    http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Light_corvette
  15. AdmiralNick22 Fleet Admiral of Literature

    Manager
    Member Since:
    May 28, 2003
    star 6
    Does Ackbar appear?

    Also- details on General Willard. We almost never hear about that guy, even though he was a Rebel commander at Yavin Base.

    --Adm. Nick
  16. GrandAdmiralJello Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2000
    star 10
    You still won't hear much about him. But that's all I'll say about that, because...*ahem*


    Folks, I think I'll post a little reminder about the spoiler policy here, just in case. We've a lot of users here who get advanced copies of things, and those users should respect the trusted position they're put in and not abuse it.

    Advance Copies

    Any preview, evaluation, or otherwise advance copy of a Star Wars product that is NOT the official final release obtained early for some reason (like Del Rey handing out the book at a convention, or Amazon shipping it early) is subject to a spoiler firewall. You are not permitted to post spoilers from advance copies, whether obtained legitimately or not.

    You MAY, however: post your opinion about it (whether you liked it or disliked it), and post some light hints about it ("no, there's not much of Bastila/Trioculusromance, but Wackbar fans will be pleased."). The opening post straddles the edge of acceptability, because it stays away from a plot discussion and the author admits just skimming the novel. But in general, please do not ask about specific details and if you are privy to the answers, please do not answer

    The reasons for these are many: it's to prevent spoilers, for one. It's also to preserve good relations with Del Rey and the VIPs, who release advance copies for evaluative purposes, not to have their releases ruined. Finally, leaking about advance copies you may have received is probably a good way not to get more advance copies.

    Early copies of final releases

    A final release is a novel that looks just like it would in the store. In fact, it is the novel you'd get in a store. Sometimes these books are finished and the publisher may hand them out early, or sometimes a shipper may break a street date. The spoiler rules here are slightly different: you can post spoilers as long as they have an adequate warning, are part of a thread marked as containing spoilers, and do not spoil major plot points. If received within a couple of days of the release date, we might be less strict about this rule.


    If there is any doubt as to whether a spoiler post about an advance copy is acceptable, please read the Lit forum rules sticky for the Official Spoiler Policy or PM a mod. Thanks!!
    Last edited by GrandAdmiralJello, Sep 4, 2013
  17. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

    VIP
    Member Since:
    Jul 8, 1999
    star 6
    And for those who don't have the book, maybe take the opinion of one person who admits to skimming with a grain or two of salt. Imagine if this had been the first word on Kenobi.
    instantdeath likes this.
  18. JackG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2011
    star 4
    Isn't Echo Base found in like six comics already? And I think the end game of Star Wars will be to establish Echo base, too. It's becoming the new Death Star plans, I swear.
    Could you not put a mysterious link into a spoiler-filled thread, please? [face_hypnotized]
    Giovs likes this.
  19. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

    VIP
    Member Since:
    Jul 8, 1999
    star 6
    Apologies--the post in question is just vague opinions.
  20. Lugija Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 3, 2009
    star 4
    I was hoping it'd include Bastila/Trioculusromance.
  21. GrandAdmiralJello Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2000
    star 10

    Don't worry, Echo Base will be destroyed again in the next SW video game, which will feature the never-before-seen Battle of Hoth.
  22. _Catherine_ Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2007
    star 4
    My hope was that they actually were going to ignore everything after 1977 and continue from ANH as if ESB, ROTJ, and the EU didn't exist. Luke and Leia aren't siblings, Vader really did kill Luke's dad, the Emperor is just a figurehead, etc. That's a story I would have been interested in, as opposed to Post-Yavin Story #4678.
    Last edited by _Catherine_, Sep 4, 2013
  23. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    But... continuity...
  24. Bly Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 28, 2005
    star 4
    You know, that actually sounds like it could be pretty sweet though. Like Nick said, we've seen almost nothing of Willard...and what has Madine done in the EU besides die?
  25. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    Maintained a generally terrible haircut and put on some weight, from the look of it.
    [IMG]
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