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Beyond - Legends "Empress Jaina Fel", version 1 [DN3 AU, UPDATED 10th February!! See inside, and read v.2]

Discussion in 'Fan Fiction- Before, Saga, and Beyond' started by Thrawn McEwok, Jan 19, 2008.

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  1. Elena

    Elena Jedi Master star 3

    Aug 16, 2003
    Thrawn: I venture out into fandom for the first time in six months - and as usual, fandom is hilarious. *laughs* I don't know what amuses me more - the fic, or the comments attached to it!

    Alkibiades: You watched the prequels before the original trilogy? *is amazed* My god, you're the first person I've ever met who can say that.


    What was your opinion, watching it the in-universe way?

  2. Alkibiades

    Alkibiades Jedi Youngling star 2

    Dec 15, 2007
    I did. I was introduced into SW by a friend of mine a few years ago, I think it was in 2003 - I was thirteen then. He had the KOTOR game - the RPG with Revan, you know. It intrigued me greatly, and I watched the films, starting by The Phantom Menace, as that film is listed as being the first one on the 'net. On what would you want my opinion? I can type up a three-page long response, but I wouldn't want to steal TMcE's thread, as this is all about his story. Just PM me or start a topic in the list boards (but PM me if you do; I'm not that active in the Lit area); I'd be more than happy to relate my experience.

  3. Thrawn McEwok

    Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare star 6 VIP

    May 9, 2000
    It's been really popular. I liked it. :D

    Hmph, okay.

    What about the NJO, then, or have you not read it? :p

    :p Glad you like him.

    No, they are dysfunctional!!

    Thanks! [face_laugh]


    Hey!! I don't want to tell you my plot-lines in advance!! [face_mischief]

    Where? [face_thinking]

    No, I already said that!

    Thank you! :D

    Well, if you're enjoying it, that's good! :D

    - The Imperial Ewok
  4. Thrawn McEwok

    Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare star 6 VIP

    May 9, 2000
    One of the things Kyp Durron appreciated most about having an affair with the Empress was the size of her bed.

    It was big enough to land a small shuttle on, and soft enough that you could sink into it like a foam-filled bath. The sheets were extraordinarily soft and delicate, too: the light that shone through them seemed to touch his skin more than the weight of the fabric itself.

    Kyp stretched on the big bed, grinning as he watched Jaina getting dressed.

    Yeah, he thought. I could get used to doing this more often.

    She turned as she felt his gaze on her, and gave him a Solo smirk.

    "We have to stop doing this, Kyp," she sighed.

    "What? Putting on our clothes and going back out there to our 'real' lives?"

    She rolled her eyes at that, but a smile revealed itself at one corner of her mouth.

    "Idiot," she said, turning away again, and reaching behind her back to try to shut the fastener.

    "Seriously!" he called back. "What's still keeping you here now? Fel's dead." It seemed disrespectful to say it so plainly, but it didn't make him pause. "Come back to Coruscant with me. Take Ben with you, if you want. The Empire will survive without you."

    She turned, and looked at him - and suddenly, she seemed six inches taller. She was still barely half-dressed, but it just made her look dangerous, revealing the military discipline of her body and her stance.

    "Kyp," she said, with the affection hiding behind a firmness of tone that could almost have fooled even him. "I am the Empress. I have a responsibility to the Empire. A duty to see this war through to the end."

    And you're doing it for your brother, Kyp observed. He said nothing, but the sharp glance she gave him in reply showed that she'd caught at least part of what he was thinking.

    "Okay, look," he said. "You're staying here. I'll stay too. Got any openings for a Jedi Master?"

    She laughed for a moment, then stopped, and smiled.

    "We'll see, Kyp," she said. "We'll see."
  5. EvieSolo

    EvieSolo Jedi Youngling star 2

    Mar 11, 2005
    An affair, huh? How long has this been going on? o_O

    Even at his age? ;)

    She never gave him a good explenation why. She's the Empress, she can do whatever she wants. Even if it's a Jedi Master. :p

    Because he was the only reason for her to stay... :rolleyes:

    Let me guess, ergonomic chairs that encourage straight backs? :p

    So who is she at war with?

    Which one? o_O

    Ahm... This one is just cheap! [face_mischief]

    Now tell us what's going on! :p
  6. Alkibiades

    Alkibiades Jedi Youngling star 2

    Dec 15, 2007
    NJO is not all Dark. With all dark, I mean that all light is extinguished. Let's see what comes to mind... What the world would have looked like had Hitler been a little less stupid... Like that. Someone controls everything, and all the good guys are dead. Just dead, all of them. Not one or two in hiding, no Force Ghosts or hidden recordings, not a promising kid in a hidden forest, no hidden movements, all DEAD. NJO doesn't meet the qualifications.

    I mean the kind of story where the anti-hero is the hero, where we get to identify ourselves with him, where we get to see everything from his point of view, and where we can feel gratification where he wins, and that he wins. Basically, a complete reversal of a normal plot.

    Imagine the prequels, but now told from a point of view that glorifies Palpatine though all his years of hard labor, from the point where he is recruited by Darth Plagueis, a story wherein he and Vader win totally and completely, where Palpatine defeats Yoda, where Anakin defeats Obi-Wan and wins Padme and the twins, and where Palpatine, Anakin, Padme and the kids live evilly ever after. Consider the original trilogy with our big hero, Vader, combining with Thrawn to wipe the galaxy free of the Rebel scum, and succeeding; where Luke and Leia work together to kill the Emperor, then marry someone, maybe Luke/Mara and Kyp/Leia, or a more twisted alternative: (Read this at your own peril! It's twisted and you have been warned!) [hl=black]Luke marries Leia, or Leia marries Palpatine... It's dark and twisted - fits the requirements... And then, in the genre, they live evilly ever after... Although I admit I cringe at the thought... Ugh...[/hl] They live as a happy and expanding family, evilly ever after.

    One good example, which is worth reading, is the account Niccolo Machiavelli gives of The Life of Castrucci Castracani of Lucca. You can find it here, just scroll down a really long way; it comes right after the last chapter of The Prince. It's short, 10,000 words, and proper villain-worship:

    Get the idea?

    Aha... They, as a couple. Of course. That's what I meant all along; as a couple, J/J is a really bad combination. J/S or something would work, methinks. Duracard, meet Icefish. And to judge from your last post and the change in signature, you totally agree! Round of applause for Evie? =D= =D= =D=

    I thought you meant you'd done 'fics before with a good villain Jacen... I would like to read those, if you have the links?

    Sorry, my memory messed some things up. [face_blush] Sorry! [face_blush] I cede the point.

    Yes, but I couldn't be sure you were serious.

    The new update was good. You do act on your signature. And you're keeping this one? Okay. Good.

    So she has some sense of duty to her now definitely dysfunctional husband, and Kyp will just stay with her... Hmmm. Pretty single-minded, that one, but then, it's Kyp, and he probably doesn't have much other things going on... Jedi stuff in the Empire's service... Looking after the emotional wellbeing of the Empress will be appreciated, methinks. At least by the Empress. :)

    Can't wait for more.

    Feeling eastern tonight, so,
    - The Persian Strategos
  7. Thrawn McEwok

    Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare star 6 VIP

    May 9, 2000
    The feelings have been there since EoV:R, at the least. [face_mischief]

    *fluffs out the grey hair at his temples* Hey! Kyp's not that old!!

    Just... distinguished!!

    Yeah, a distinguished Jedi Master. That sounds right!!

    [face_laugh] =D= Touché!

    But as she's the Empress, she doesn't have to explain her decisions either? :D

    There's also the power?

    Or Kyp's just not yet woken up to the sheer desirability of a funky uniform and a Star Destroyer? [face_thinking] :D

    [face_laugh] Someone's been reading the PM chatter! :D

    The guys she kicked off Dantooine in the first flashback. :p


    It was kinda unconscious, but Kyp (and I) decided to run with it once we'd said it.... [face_mischief]

    Next story update!! :D

    Two points here, reflecting my personal POV.

    #1. Oppression IS stupid. It builds resentment, builds its own overthrow. To imagine a "less stupid" Nazi Führer, or at least one efficient enough to build a sustainable Reich, would be to imagine one who didn't have to resort to genocide or race-slavery in the first place.

    #2. Eventually, SOMEONE will realise that stupidity isn't working. :p

    I think you should check out Drew Karpyshyn's Darth Bane books? [face_mischief]

    Although, of course, bear my above comments in mind? ;)

  8. Alkibiades

    Alkibiades Jedi Youngling star 2

    Dec 15, 2007
    Why do you need to oppress? [face_thinking] :confused: :confused:
    It has nothing to do with Empires. I mean, c'mon, Augustus didn't oppress... Or at least, not to breaking point, and he ruled the entire known world. All under the guise of bringing peace to the world, he lived a scandalously luxurious life, got to dominate the entire world AND his own family, and kept a good name and fame. He did it the right way.

    Secondly, with a little less stupid, I meant a Führer that did not engage his troops on more than one front, one who took the time to solidify his conquests and end one enterprise before embarking on the next one. Just a little bit of common sense.

    Maybe I should.

    Why would you tighten your grip? What grip? Oh, you mean those stormtroopers. They are just protecting. And that guy in the funny suit? He is a good guy really. Just has a bit of a short temper. Think it wouldn't work? It worked for the Romans, the Persians, the Medes, the Egyptians, the Chinese, the Russians, anyone; a tightly controlled dictatorial society is only limited by its supporting bureaucracy. Do you have any idea how popular Hitler was? In Germany, unmatched. Here in Holland, his goons outnumbered the people in the resistance greatly. And the larger part of the population was just watching it.

    Propaganda, doing good stuff, good PR guys - way more effective than armies.

    I don't despise J/J - I just dislike it. If a backstory is needed for the Fel Emperors, I'd prefer the involvement of a S/S Force user, of course; Jaina - or maybe Allana (with a son of Jag)? And I'm glad it is you too ;)

    No I don't think that. I just think they have little choice in the matter. Jaina is the dictator. She can do what she wishes. If she wishes to carry on an affair with Kyp, and if she wishes to keep it out of the press, it will certainly happen. If the dictator approves of something, everyone does - because it is dangerous not to.

    - The Satrap's Prisoner
  9. Thrawn McEwok

    Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare star 6 VIP

    May 9, 2000
    You're assuming that Augustus was aiming for domination and luxury as his primary objectives, rather than actually operating relatively fairly as princeps and being well aware of his own humanity as a man.


    I think that was the plan. Unfortunately, other people threw spanners into the works.

    1.) Britain declared war in 1939, two years before the Germans' preparations expected.

    2.) Stalin began a massive industrialization and armament program. Germany was forced to invade in 1941, or risk finding itself unable to compete with the Soviets.

    3.) The Japanese attacked Pearl Harbour, bringing the USA into the war.

    Yep. And while you're at it, try Shatterpoint. [face_mischief]

    Really? I'm pretty sure that every one of those groups you mentioned was regarded as military top dog. And the more genuinely successful ones were the least interventionist and bureaucratic, the most... participatory, I guess?

    Well, that's your prejudice. I disagree. :p

    If there's a dictator involved, they need to reward people. Then those people become jittery. Some of them might even have a conscience. And when the dictator falls (Cromwell, Stalin), most people decide to try another method.

    There's nothing better than an over-powerful executive branch to teach politicians what real people already know about "big government". [face_mischief]

    Are you sure your screen-name is the best role-model? :p

    - The Imperial Ewok
  10. Alkibiades

    Alkibiades Jedi Youngling star 2

    Dec 15, 2007
    Does history warrant any other conclusion? :confused:

    The war with Britain was set up by Hitler by attacking Poland, which was allied with both France and England.

    Secondly, the USSR was nowhere near as important to Hitler as Great Britain was. Upon capture of GB, Hitler would have ruled the seas, and half the globe. The immense wealth of resources would have been more than enough to keep all Russians in check. Hitler simply blew the war for Britain by faulty strategics and by subsidizing the wrong kinds of weapons. The V1 was a bad idea; bombing London was a bad idea.

    Thirdly, the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbour did not bring the USA into the war against Germany; it took years before the American effort started taking a toll. A well-handled war with the English, and Britain would have been German before Pearl Harbor even happened in the first place.

    Overall, Hitler's failure was caused by huge waste of resources and misallocation of funds.

    To conquer a great part of the globe and defend it against attacks from the outside, large armies are a necessity. It is good politics, however, that keeps the newly conquered territory. Take Caesar. His conquest of Gaul was due to his superior armies and tactics, but the keeping of it was due to his excellent sense of politics.

    The Romans are a good example of a bureaucratic and interventionist government, and still, they conquered and kept the civilized world for many centuries. They laid down heavy taxes, left little room for self-government, and sent veterans and colonists to settle the conquered territory at the natives' expense; they basically invented bureaucracy and interventionism. And still, they were an effective Empire.

    Dictators do not need to reward the people. They simply have to keep them content. That is generally well managed by being or appointing skilled and just legislators and administrators. By being fairly fair a lot of dictators got way with it; Stalin, Lenin, Augustus, Cromwell - enough of them.

    That makes no sense at all. Period.

    He is not my role model. When I needed a 'nick a year or two ago, this one carried over from my Greek classes; I found out about his background much later.

    His political career is kind of cool, isn't it?

    - Pericles' cousin
  11. Flowerlady

    Flowerlady Jedi Master star 4

    Dec 14, 2005
    This is definately getting interestion...But I'm still confused...why is Ben with Jaina? Is Luke and Mara dead? (Well, in the LotF version I guess she is, but this version is set earlier.)

    Waiting for more...

    FL @};-
  12. Thrawn McEwok

    Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare star 6 VIP

    May 9, 2000
    In my opinion, yes. The rhetoric of political opponents, and the underlying assumption that success requires ruthless focus, are both questionably accurate.

    A miscalculation. Hitler believed, after Munich and his subsequent, unopposed destruction of the Czechoslovak state, that the anti-war sentiments in France and Britain were too strong, and that he'd effectively neutralized them for the time being.

    That's my point: Hitler, and indeed the collective wisdom of the OKW and the Nazi Party, believed that they HAD temporarily neutralized that threat, and they'd now deal with their housecleaning in Eastern Europe, taking care of THAT before the planned war in 1941.

    You're assuming that the Royal Navy and the Empire would have capitulated (on top of the assumptions that a Channel crossing and a campaign of conquest would have been successful). More likely, the government and the Navy would have withdrawn to overseas bases and continued the fight.

    It resulted in immediate American entry into the war. It sealed the fate of Germany. It actually made things WORSE for Germany, because the Americans were tactically and strategically inept throughout the war, and just bulldozed their clumsy way into Europe on the basis of massive mobilization and arms production...

    Uhh, you do realise that for precisely one year, between 22nd June 1940 and 22nd June 1941, Britain was the only enemy country opposing Germany?

    I don't really count the Greek campaign (6th-27th April 1941), as that was provoked by a perceived need to attack British interests in the Mediterranean.

    The miscalculation over Poland notwithstanding, the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact and American isolationism combined with the direction of the Battle of France and operations in Norway and Eastern Europe, to place Hitler in the position you proposed.

    And the Nazis STILL lost.

    Human error. It happens. :p

    Did Caesar "keep" Gaul? ;) I actually think his final miscalculation was because he was thinking in terms of the things one did to rule Gaul - and Egypt - and not Rome.

    He'd become culturally assimilated. :p

    How "bureaucratic and interventionist" were
  13. Thrawn McEwok

    Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare star 6 VIP

    May 9, 2000
    Six weeks earlier

    The X-wing lifted lightly through the clouds, leaving the patchwork of forests and open country far below.

    As he rose up into a shaft of open sunlight, the pilot banked slightly, glancing down from the cockpit. The miniature landscape of the surface was almost out of sight now, glimpsed only through gaps in the lower tiers of cumulus.

    He smiled, then lifted the fighter?s nose, and pointed towards the sun. The X-wing rose quickly, speeding towards the edge of space.

    A starfighter on repulsor drives was quite literally weightless.

    Then a sharp voice crackled in his ear.

    ?Master Durron? Kyp??

    ?Hi, Corran,? Kyp grinned. ?I suppose you?re here to tell me to come back down to earth??

    ?That?s, uhh, that?s affirmative.? Corran Horn sounded as if he was frowning, not wanting to deal with Kyp?s levity. ?We?re at war, Kyp. We can?t just let you fly off to the Empire.?

    Kyp made a rude noise. ?I?m just taking my fighter for some free-flight time. Or maybe I?m going off on a personal peace initiative.?

    ?You should have discussed this with us first.?

    ?Like now? With four Jedi Knights doing their best to stop me leaving Hapes?? Kyp laughed. He opened the throttle, guiding his X-wing over the top of a tower of cloud, then circling down and round behind it, trying to shake them off his tail.

    ?Dammit,? Corran said. ?Rogues, Leader. We?re going to have to try and force him down.?

    ?You wanted me to hear that.? Kyp Durron was enjoying himself immensely. ?Calling threats the best you can do??

    ?Doesn?t mean I won?t do it. I can?t let you break ranks.?

    ?Remind me, Corran, exactly what authority does one Jedi Master have over another? Or do you think your posse back there count as a quorum??

    ?I don?t notice you discussing this with your own supporters, Kyp. If they knew what you were up to, Octa or Alema would be up here with us, fighting you.?

    ?True.? Kyp?s lips thinned into a thoughtful line. ?But you always said that me leading a private lance of knights in X-wings was bad for the Order.?

    ?That wasn?t what I meant!?

    Kyp switched off the comm, and turned the X-wing sharply towards his pursuers. Corran and his wing guards were deploying their s-foils into attack configuration.

    Kyp didn?t. Instead, he held a straight course towards them for a moment, then rolled sharply away, banking up towards the open sky again.

    Corran and his flight would pursue, of course, but the X-wings were all pretty much even where performance was concerned, and even the small lead he had should be enough to keep him ahead of them.

    The sky darkened, the stars began to come out, and laser bolts began to flash past his cockpit.

    Back home, he thought, smiling ? reaching forward, and switching on the comm again.

    ?Kyp! This is your last chance!?

    Kyp laughed harshly. ?Corran, you don?t even know what I?m doing.?

    He reached forward to, and thumbed the commlink off again. Then he sank back into the padding of his sleep, pretending that he was just out for a ride.

    He?d heard the reports from Dantooine on the morning news.

    The Alliance?s media outlets had portrayed it with the usual patriotic slant, of course: a heroic Rebel soldier killing the tyrant who had thrust the Empire into war against the free peoples of the Galaxy.

    But the Imperial feeds he had access to as the head of Jedi Special Operations had told a different story. The mood in the Empire was one of mourning, rather than revenge.

    Their coverage was focused on images of a slim, slight girl, standing vigil beside the open funeral bier of her murdered husband in the echoing hollowness of a Star Destroyer?s hangar bay.

    Kyp wasn?t sure that Jaina would feel real grief for Jagged Fel, but he could see in a heartbeat that she had been wounded. The certainty and stability the Empire had given her had been shattered.

    He knew he needed to be with her.

    And the whole Alliance wasn?t going to stop him.

    The X-wing was heading towards the stars now, and his astromech was flashing up a m
  14. EvieSolo

    EvieSolo Jedi Youngling star 2

    Mar 11, 2005
    Awwww! Kyp's hurrying to be there for his... uh... friend with benefits (? :p) AND defying Corran at the same time! :cool:
  15. Alkibiades

    Alkibiades Jedi Youngling star 2

    Dec 15, 2007
    Evie, noticed the new sig. Congratulations! =D= ;)


    More of the past. Are you going to sandwich past and present like that? ;
    Poor Corran. Heh. Might be good for him, though. :D Enjoyable dialogue. [face_laugh]

    Mr Master out there rescuing the damsel in distress? Okay, bad comparison. ;
    He's going to help her grieve? ;)

    Enjoyable update, Thrawn. And now, for that discussion we were having...

    Which political opponents? Those that were dead, those that were exiled, or those that were not yet born? :confused: There is a reason almost everything you read about August written in his own time is positive; everyone else was cremated.

    Are you suggesting Triumvirates are legal? Or that the first deed of the Triumvirate was not branding 300 senators and 2000 equites as outlaws, seizing their properties and killing those who did not escape was a model of justice and fairness? If that is not ruthless focus, than what is, McE? He even sacrificed his personal ally, Cicero, to his ambitions.

    Can you honestly maintain that ousting farmers from their land to appease his veterans was a correct course of action? And executing another 300 senators and knights after L. Antonius' rebellion was the good thing to do? That he divorced his first wife to slight M. Antonius, and divorcing the second one on the day she gave birth to his only daughter does not bother you? Really, that is one of the most disgusting things a man can do to his wife, in my opinion.

    Another one of his acts, storming the Vespian sanctuary to get Antonius' secret will is another indicator he stopped at nothing to take what he wanted. Killing Caesarion, the only son of the man whom he owed everything he had is not so laudable either, is it? He could have raised him as his successor, had he wished to do good.

    I'm not going to quote his more notable acts after Antonius' deaths; this should be enough to prove that he was, indeed, ruthlessly focused.

    True, a miscalculation. Still, it was Hitler that forced France and England, not the other way round.

    It made the situation worse for Germany, true, but the Americans didn't join until 1942; Hitler had an entire year to fight England.

    Yes, I realized that. Did you rea
  16. smash128

    smash128 Jedi Youngling star 2

    Feb 9, 2008
    I like this fanfic, very interesting. Are we going to see other characters as well like Jacen, Lowbacca, Tahiri, Tenel Ka, Danni Quee, Han or Leia, etc.? And are they for the Empire or fighting with the Rebellion?
  17. Flowerlady

    Flowerlady Jedi Master star 4

    Dec 14, 2005
    Kyp defying Corran....hehehehe[face_laugh]

    Kyp is off to see his love.

    Can't wait to see more.

    FL @};-
  18. Thrawn McEwok

    Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare star 6 VIP

    May 9, 2000
    True love, perhaps. Though I know Jaina doesn't see in that way. :p


    Sadly, Alkibiades has left the boards while I've been idle with this 'fic; I'll deal with the rest of his comments if he returns, and wants me to continue... :D

    Lowie's possibly with Jaina... I'm not sure who'll be in this 'fic, and/or where they'll be... will it be enough if there IS more of this 'fic? ;)

    Thanks... sorry about the delay. I DO hope to continue both versions now...

    And yes, Kyp and Jaina. :* :D

    - The Imperial Ewok
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