Amph END OF LINE: TRON, Uprising, Legacy & TRON 3

Discussion in 'Community' started by edgejedi88, Jan 25, 2006.

  1. Spider-Fan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2008
    star 4
    Well the level of technology has grown significantly since the early 1980s, so I would assume the sophistication of world within the computer has become more complex as well. Sure its all 1s and 0s just as it was then but how those are interpreted seems to have developed a great deal. I have no problem with the film's look.
  2. Jedimarine Force Ghost

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    Feb 13, 2001
    star 5
    For some reason...the look of this film reminds me of the film "A.I."
  3. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    The original's mix of animation and live action was a bit more creative- but I think one is meant to take it as representing the differences in technology.

    In the 80's, the old TRON world was a super-realistic version of what a virtual world could be perceived/rendered as- thus it's more based on vector graphics and the like.

    Now, what we're seeing is a super-realistic version of what a modern virtual world can be perceived and rendered as.
  4. Jedimarine Force Ghost

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    Feb 13, 2001
    star 5
    I guess I understand that.

    But I never considered TRON to be set in a "virtual" world...it was a fictional world developed on the structure of computer technology...it's about circuits and processors, not "rendering power" and "graphics engines".

    Now granted, perhaps it's not much of a difference for most people, but it's a significant one to me.

    Otherwise you're simply rehashing another "he's in a videogame"...which, granted, was INVENTED by the Original tron, but has mutated into it's own genre, with "Games turned into movies" and the occasional virtual reality concept.

    More sophisticated computer output shouldn't drastically change a universe based on what's inside the box, not what's on the monitor.

    Tron didn't take place inside a single program or "on the internet"...It was a universe on a microchip.
  5. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    True, but it was seemingly based on Flynn's gaming programs, so far as asthetics go (which make sense- not much in the way of visuals within an 80's accounting program to base a universe's perception on, thus relying on the games).

    In other words- it was avideo game world within the greater computer universe. Both of which were dictated by the technology of the time.

    Now, granted, it seems in this movie the TRON world has been running indepndently to some degree for some time, so maybe it's just a case of digital evolution within that universe, and not a reflection of modern gaminig capabilities.
  6. Jedimarine Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 13, 2001
    star 5
    It's just a dangerous road because iconic things...the bikes, the suits, the disc...it wouldn't be TRON without them, and yet, fundamentally...if you are talking about how much more sophisticated things are, these iconic things would have mutated or vanished all together. The "open top" bike is the perfect example.

    So they have to tightrope walk the line between visual mimicry of the original, while upgrading the whatever else they can into modern visuals.

    It's like if George remade the OT!
  7. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    They're not necessarily changed-yet-look-like-TRON-for-some-reason, though- the suits are changed to a more modern Matrix/cyberpunk leather from the original white, so it's a style that still works within that context and neon/blacklight party culture.

    And,a agin, if it is the original isolated but evolved, that makes it all the more plausible.
  8. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    [image=http://www.heyuguys.co.uk/images/2010/06/TRON_Wave5.jpg]
  9. Daramin_of_The_Way Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 30, 2004
    star 4
    Absolutely epic!
    I like the helmets.
  10. VadersLaMent Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 3, 2002
    star 9
    That is awesome. I think it is cool that the discs are essentially iPhones which double as weapons.
  11. Raven Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 5, 1998
    star 6
    With any new, anticipated movie coming out, there's always people ahead of time who scoff at the idea and don't expect the movie to a success, despite a vocal fan base's opinions to the contrary. Twilight? Bah, no one would want to go see that. Avatar? Meh, the visuals are nothing special and the story looks week. Etc, etc, and so forth.

    I'm afraid I'm in that camp with regards to Tron.

    I've never seen the original movie, and don't feel a huge desire to see it. More to the point, the new movie doesn't look particularly interesting to me. The specials effects are OK, but the world it shows doesn't look interesting to me. The games that seem to be going on don't interest me much. The hot chick on the couch in the trailer I keep seeing looks interesting, but so far she's the best selling point as far as I can see, and if a pretty woman as eye candy is the most interesting thing that they can show to someone who isn't already a fan, I'm not exactly circling the date on my calender.

    I'll probably see it. If it's good, I'll happily change my mind and endorse the movie. But I'll judge it on its own merits, and in my opinion there's not much in the trailer that really merits excitement to someone not already a fan.
  12. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Now, obviously I'm a fan of the franchise, but I'd disagree with you about the trailer- I think it really grabs people's interest, especially the first half producing an interesting sense of mystery (combined with the great visuals of the closed arcade) with Bruce giving a good amount of weight to the proceedings.

    The audiences I've seen the trailer with seem to have really been engaged by it at one point- then that first shot of the machine world wows them and by the end they are eating out of it's hand- and I'm sure most of them have never even heard of TRON before.
  13. dragonsith13 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 3, 2005
    star 4
    I am looking forward to the new vision of Tron, it will be interesting to see how this movie is received, for those of us whom remember the old movie I think it will be a lot of fun to see a new take on it. Looking forward to this one.
  14. Raven Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 5, 1998
    star 6
    Obviously, we're in different theatres, and we're also probably remembering the audience reactions that agree with our own. I don't understand how Nixon could have won, no one I knew voted for him! :p I remember the people who said things like "pass," "looks lame," "that looks terrible," and a more than a few who were laughing at it. No one I know who has seen the trailer is excited by it.
  15. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    I'd like to think that's not the entirely case for me- I usually make it a specific point to observe the reactions of the audiences around me when seeing a film, so that I can more honestly/accurately portray the film when asked later how a movie is (in other words- I can present my opinion in the context/contrast to the others around me).

    I do the same with trailers (for example, while audiences shared my enthusiasm for the first Scott Pilgrim trailer, the audience I saw the new trailer with didn't seem to warm to it much, despite my outright love for it).
  16. Jedimarine Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 13, 2001
    star 5
    Well the image of the arcade exterior is when I catapulted up in my seat.

    Raven...any movie that's a sequel to a 30 year old film, with hardly any other market presence in the intervening years, has to be primarily targeted at old fans and nostalgia buffs...so if the original never caught you, I can understand a reluctance here...and true enough on the fan reactions...if you are under 25, you're probably scratching your head as to what this is all about. When I saw the trailer, I was in Iron Man 2, and rows of younger people all around had almost no reaction until the final bike sequence.

    I suspect the film will be successful in much the same way TRON was successful originally...decent, but nothing huge...TRON as a franchise has maintained a cult base and some casual fans, such as myself...but has never been a runaway hit in any of it's endeavors.

    If it makes a small profit, great.

    On the outside chance it does well enough to ignite a sequel or two sooner then 30 years after the fact...that might be the best Disney can ask.

    More likely they'll incorporate the new film plot and visuals into other Disney properties like rides and games.
  17. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

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    May 30, 2003
    star 5
  18. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    I don't think it'll match the performance of the original- the original was before it's time, before a wide audience could grasp the concept. In the intervening years (and, in particular, the last 15) general audiences have increasingly become more tech-savvy and films like The Matrix have sold virtual computer worlds as a film concept to pretty wide success.

    Assuming the film is any good (and with Disney prepping sequels and spin-offs, it bodes well at this juncture that it will be), I think the lack of that handicap, at the very least, increases it's performance potential compared to the original.
  19. Hernalt Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 2
    Pushing the distinction between The Matrix and Tron franchises further...

    The Matrix is a deliberate internal falsehood meant to represent or substitute for an externally true reality that has palpable physical form and sensible temporal flow. (Baudrillard's "Simulacra and Simulation", Chicken flavor discussion, bullet time / stopping bullets.)

    Tron 82 was a collage of arbitrary artistic representations of abstract/non-physical processes made palpable (logic probe, data stream, Bit, RAM, CROM, memory, energy), along with what we now are accustomed to as virtual representations of inherently palpable, physically-oriented objects (disks, cycles, walls, vehicles, aircraft).

    So the consumer of the Tron franchise is a bit more "hostage" to the artistic vision, because it must necessarily be more detached from palpable reality, than is a consumer of The Matrix.

    And I don't know how that will fly, or what air time, or what secondary reality, or suspended disbelief, Tron2 will achieve with modern audiences who are accustomed to immediate and repeatable computer customization. From what I can tell, the modern demographic for this kind of movie is already getting what their evolved killing instinct prefers when they play retinal-class resolution first-person shooter games. There is no "reality" inside the Tron franchise, and so it is not VR, Virtual Reality. Tron2 is a throwback to a period when Tron 82 offered a compensation for the impossibility of consumer-level VR. I cannot figure out how the modern first-person-shooter demographic will be edified, except as it being a visual ride through a pristine, homogenous, sterile land with no fractal symmetry, no granularity, no dirt under the fingernails. For instance, I get a saccarine-sweet jaded nausea when I see commercials that feature heavily involved CGI characters in a heavily developed CGI environment, all surfaces gleaming and perfect.

    Compare <http://rares-iordache.filozofie.eu/2009/11/10/fantasy-creates-a-secondary-reality/print/>

    Objections welcome. Tron is an interesting thing to try making relevant in this age of |actual| VR.
  20. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    The Matrix has artistic representations of abtract processes as well, though- the Agents are programs made manifest, as are things like the Oracle, Merrovingian, Twins and such (same way the programs in TRON are, as well as Bit and other factes. Specific glitches/events are shown to represent concepts like deja vu (cycles, data stream). Phones represent in/out ports (I/O towers), etc.

    There are just different skins at play.
  21. Hernalt Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 2
    Good points - I appreciate the inversion. My argument is that the visceral gullibility is more easily placed into a proper sense of "Virtual Reality" with the Matrix, where these reified abstractions are far and few between, than in Tron, where the visual field is mostly occupied with them (an entire landscape representing data).
  22. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    It's a matter of aethetics/skins, though. TRON's world is inspired by an era when computers were represented by corcuit boards, monochrome-color-on-black text screens & vector graphics.

    The "upgrade" to that becomes something more sleek in an "Apple store"/Mac kind of way, the suits become more like leather, and you break into more versatile gaming constructs (bikes able to move within realistic physics instead of solely 90 degree turns, etc).

    The Matrix comes in the wake of the end of 90's, a decade that was semi-obsessed with VR environments becoming more lifelike (even if VR never really came to pass), and the extension/upgrade to that is something so real you can't distinguish it from reality.

    It's a matter of artistic preference- TRON is where normal actions/characters are brought into a stylized and fantastical world, Matrix is where the fantastical actions/characters stand out from a more mundane/normal setting.
  23. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    I remember watching Tron when it came out. I was ten, and while the effects were amazing, the story was confusing. I watched it again when I was in college, and thought the story was weak, written by Disney execs who had no understanding of computers whatsoever as anything other than a magic box. But it was pretty.

    I saw The Matrix when it came out and thought it was a horrible, boring, idiotic piece of crap--an overhyped wire-fu action movie pretetiously posing as mystic sci-fi. In fact, "Poser" pretty much summed it up perfectly.

    I'll go with Tron.
  24. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Fincher & Pixar helping tweak TRON: Legacy

    Seems some rough test screenings were held in advance of scheduled June reshoots for input from David Fincher, John Lasseter, Ed Catmull, Brad Bird, & Toy Story 3 writer Michael Arndt to help beef up "character, emotion, and theme", with some script pages subsequently done by Bird and Arndt.
  25. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Theatrical Trailer!

    Though it doesn't blow me away as much as the previous trailer did, it still looks quite awesome. The effects for (presumably) CLU look flawless.