ST Episode 7 - parallels to TPM and ANH

And we all agree now to keep the discussions civil and that it will not escalate any further, yes?

 

No, that is exactly the point. That is the intention. It's not needless. It's THE story.

So you seen to be saying that you don't want any lightsaber duels, no battles in space or on the ground or pretty much anywhere. You don't want rescue missions, you don't want the hero's journey, you don't want romance or bounty hunters or friendship or hatred. You don't want...anything?

So you don't want it to be Star Wars?

I really am missing your point.

 

And that, is why you fail..

 

I fail because you can't make your point?

Once you figure it out please tell us what you want.

 

The rumors suggest a strong resemblance between ANH and this film, and rumors like the one in which Kylo Ren is transformed into Vader don´t help IMO. If Star Wars is a rescue on every movie, a superweapon on every movie, Tatooine on every movie, the quest for the old master, the lightsaber lost, the Vader helmet... It´s all rumors at this point. But so far the rumors suggest they are playing it safe with certain aspects of the story. And that´s it, we have to accept it and hope the story is good.

 

Everyone is aware of the clear copying of certain events in the OT that played out the PT. Many view these purely as lazy storytelling and an example of pure GL brain fart when it actually came to making the PT it's own entity story wise. His own assertion that hopefully the 'rhyming' works is testament to that. That says it all. No matter what convoluted rubbish you come out with.

 

There's a sense of history repeating itself with SW. It's an easy way to take from previous plots but make it a fresh take. It's kind of like reality shows that have the same ol' structure but different people, thus making for new dynamics.

With SW, I think there's a bit of acceptance with certain rhyming and cyclical patterns. It's like a slightly similar take on an old idea with fresh faces and personalities, some reversal and ironies, and boom you have a decent new SW movie that feels strangely but pleasantly nostalgic while being different that the same time.

 

Maybe if there is a Superweapon, one of the original cast sacrifices themselves to stop it. You get the Hero's death and a Death Star being destroyed sort of ending. I'm going to go against the grain with everyone else's speculation on who's dying and say it's gonna be Chewy.

 

Yeah, one of my biggest fears is that TFA will turn out exactly like Star Trek: Into Darkness, which was basically like a meat loaf made from Star Trek references, particularly Wrath of Kahn.

 

It works for people opened to the idea.

 

In some ways they are. In most ways I don't think so. The level and degree that Lucas repeats situations with different outcomes in story, character and visuals from the OT to the PT and within the OT itself and the PT itself is incredibly intricate, planned out and amazingly detailed to such a degree that 10 years after ROTS we are still peeling back all the layers across the 6 movies.

Those who view an intricately craft story across 6 movies and 4 decades with each trilogy taking some 10 years each of basically living it every day for those 10 years have a very odd definition of lazy storytelling.

If they apply that kind of definition to lazy storytelling then they had better do it equally to the new films coming out. I guess those will be comatose storytelling?

 

This is an excellent read on how the two trilogies are connected in terms of storytelling, and as such it brings some interesting questions about how the post-Lucas movies will fare in comparison:
http://www.starwarsringtheory.com/

 

the blowing up of the droid control ship was bad rhyming and random, the 4 story arc ending was busy, the feeling of giant armies of droids made less the sense of urgency and danger, no lives *seemed* to be at stake. i'm all for rhyming as long its not just for the sake of it. of course it will and should "rhyme", it needs to be derived from myths and classics, but just dont need to randomly blow up a big ball just to blow it up.

 

You should stop being a Star Wars fan right now...just lock yourself away with your OT VHS tapes...because you have already been left behind and your are going to be very disappointed on December 18 2015

 

Easy there

 

So so sorry about my opinion causing you that level of offence. I'll just disassociate myself with the ST from this moment forward ok? Sorry sorry..sorry

 

I found excellent rhyming and it wasn't random at all. It was totally planned out.

The droids had no lives to lose and that was all just a distraction anyway. The real point of the plan was to get Gunray. Get him and the battle is won.

 

No lives seem to be at stake during the final battle? Was that supposed to be a joke? Try to watch it more carefully next time maybe then you'll see how many characters die during the battle. Not to mention that the fate of the entire planet is at stake.

 

Wouldn't it be awesome if something like this was to happen in ep7? or anywhere in ep7-9?
( goto 0:50 ) - (minus the ''do you want to live forever'' line of course, a simple smile would suffice)


...this could play out like this:
1. Mentor fights villain, but instead of dying he is saved by a force ghost who actively intervenes!
2. Hero fights villain, but the mentor who is someplace else senses the danger & willingly becomes a force ghost in order to actively save the hero!
It still rhymes but the opposite happens!

In the place of Conan you could have:
A. Luke
B. Rey
C. Leia (just throwing it out there, because it would be awesome if she was saved by Anakin...she sees him and says ''Father (?!)''...he just smiles at her... she looks at the enemy striked down...she looks back and the force ghost is gone...)

In the place of Valeria:
A. Anakin
B. Luke

I think it rhymes with TPM & ANH in situation, but the result is the opposite.
Maybe even have the 1AA scenarion in ep7 and the 2BB scenario in ep9???

(please don't kill me... )

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

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Lucas' attempts to link the trilogies though similar scenes sometimes came across to me as ham-fisted. Anakin (being guided by the Force) flying into the hangar and blowing up the droid control ship works within the context of Star Wars where one can use the Force to explain literally anything, but I didn't find it clever or professional storytelling. The Jedi-in-training watching helplessly as his mentor is cut down, Anakin getting his arm cut off by the Sith Lord he apparently wasn't trained enough to fight yet and winding up with a mechanical hand, the Chancellor sitting in a room with some very strong similarities to the one he'll be sitting in in RotJ watching his Sith partner fighting his new candidate for apprenticeship, Obi-Wan cutting off somebody's arm in a cantina ... all of these things felt forced to me. I consider them to be nods to the OT masquerading as storytelling devices. "Hey guys, Luke is just like his father!" and "Chancellor Palpatine is the Emperor!" Yeah, we know.

On the other hand, there are more subtle "rhymes" that are interesting. For example, in AotC it would first appear Anakin and Padme going to rescue Obi-Wan on Geonosis is like Luke rushing off to rescue Han and Leia and face Vader in Cloud City. But another way to look at it is the Jedi (Yoda ,Mace, etc.) playing Luke's role in TESB, which lends weight to Yoda's pleading in the later movie: they did rush off to rescue "friends" before they truly understood what they were up against, and everyone paid because of it. This works because it contributes to character development (Yoda is wiser in TESB because of his failures in the PT) and cues the audience to think of character actions from the perspective desired by the storyteller (Yoda is right, Luke is walking into a trap and putting the galaxy at risk). Or even the first ten minutes of the two trilogies. In the PT the fate of the planet depends on two rather capable Jedi who escape to the surface and provide the reason for the local to escape. In the OT the fate of the rebellion depends on two comical droids who escape to the surface and provide the reason for the local to escape. The contrast between the two Jedi and the two droids highlights the desperate straights the rebellion is in during ANH.

I would love to see that latter type of "rhyming" between the ST and earlier trilogies. However, I'd rather pass on yet another Skywalker improbably blowing up another space station to save another bunch of people and scenes of that ilk.

 

So which films will episodes 7,8,9 mirror? 1,2,3 or 4,5,6?

 

I honestly like the rhyming in the saga. My favorite being that the first of each trilogy being a stand alone film. Works to JJs advantage I believe. I just hope it's conveyed with a little more subtlety this time around. The rhyming, that is.