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Discussion Episode IX Story Discussion

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode IX - Spoilers Allowed' started by Darth Formidious, Dec 13, 2017.

  1. redxavier

    redxavier Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 23, 2003
    The double standard is choosing to see the "things that are overt" and "others that can be logically inferred" in some locations and not in all. The double standard is applying a set of criteria you've determined and then not applying it to your own favourites in a manner that's consistent. It all ultimately boils down to whether you personally liked the film. Jakku and Canto Bight have far more layers than most worlds we see in these films. And yet you remain wilfully blind to those layers. The irony is that you're the one with the reputation for essay-length subtext mining love letters to defending your favourite things. You figuratively couldn't say anything bad about those. And now you figuratively couldn't say anything good about these. See how extreme your position shifts depending on if you like the movie or not?

    Besides, I knew you wouldn't actually answer the question - I suspect you know you can't actually answer your own questions about your favourite worlds... You and I have ridden on this merry-go-round before.
     
  2. dogprivilege

    dogprivilege Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2015
    Well, like it or not, this is quite literally what Canto Bight did (I loved TLJ but am not a fan of the sequence). And Rose. That entire sequence directly showed us and told us that common people were feeling oppressed by the FO and were rooting for the resistance. This is something that frankly isn't in the OT like at all.

    That said, I would like to see a large scope for IX. I too would like to get some urban planets and settings back in the mix, I agree there's been too many desolate planets. Coruscant would be great. I also think IX needs to do this in order to build off that entire subplot in TLJ. I would love to see Rey/Rose/Finn/Poe in maybe seperate locations at the beginning of IX, living underground and trying to drum up support for the Resistance. Some decent worldbuilding in that way would add a lot to the ST.
     
    DARTH_BELO likes this.
  3. MrElculver2424

    MrElculver2424 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 11, 2014
    But how did Canto Bight show us that? The kids are rooting for the Resistance, but why? Cantonica didn't seem to oppressed by the First Order. The First Order had no presence there. It was the local government/casino leaders and police of Canto Bight that were doing the oppressing. Yeah, Canto Bight tried to show us that, but I'm not sure it did that very well. I still don't buy it.

    I agree Coruscant would be awesome, although I have doubts they'd ever go back there. Watch them create another planet just like Coruscant but name it something else. You don't have to do that, JJ. You can go back to Coruscant. It IS ok.
     
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  4. MrElculver2424

    MrElculver2424 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 11, 2014
    So, I've been thinking...

    Because Rian Johnson decided to create such unimportant new characters in TLJ who either died or have no lasting relevance, JJ is probably going to have to go and create a handful of new characters again to fill the story. Holdo gone. DJ was quite a generic character that he didn't even get a name, so it looks like he has no place to come back either. Rose is there, but what significance does she have other than a maintenance worker who helps the Resistance sometimes?

    Ackbar gone, Han gone, Luke gone, Leia gone. Snoke gone. Phasma gone. So there's gonna have to be some new additions to keep the story from feeling claustrophobic again.
     
  5. RandomGreyJ

    RandomGreyJ Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 14, 2016
    Wouldn't it feel claustrophobic if there were more characters to focus on? If anything that's what I didn't like about TLJ. I think Pablo mentioned something similar where TFA got worse once Han showed up because he pulled the focus from some of the newer characters. I think the same could be said for Episode IX. It would be nice to see the newer heroes have to thrive on their own. Without their mentors there to help them. It would show that they really are ready to carry on the heroes' legacies.
     
  6. MrElculver2424

    MrElculver2424 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 11, 2014
    Interesting point. To me, the fewer the characters, the more claustrophobic it does feel. I would bet JJ will have to create at least 1 or 2 new ones. But at the same time, it's kind of late to do that and establish them in any way since this is IX. That should've been done in the first two movies. It's almost impossible to introduce characters in IX that will have deep, relevant backstories.

    So yeah we'll see. I'm sure the focus will be on Kylo, Rey, Finn, and Poe of course.
     
    Doom_Buggy likes this.
  7. Aetius888

    Aetius888 Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    May 23, 2005
    Or they could focus on the characters that matter. Instead of ignoring them.
     
  8. Darth Geezy

    Darth Geezy Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2016
    My bold prediction - Snoke cheats death and gets revealed as Darth Plagueis, setting up the final trilogy. #neverlettinggo
     
  9. Adept

    Adept Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2006
    [​IMG]
     
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  10. Doom_Buggy

    Doom_Buggy Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Aug 2, 2016
    We'll probably get a couple new characters and the kor. I wonder if Maz will have a larger role.
     
  11. Darth Geezy

    Darth Geezy Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2016
    Hopefully her role is bigger than TLJ. I felt like someone waiting in line for a Disney World ride.
     
  12. RandomGreyJ

    RandomGreyJ Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 14, 2016
    Maz was like waiting in line for four hours and then when it's your turn, you get to watch someone else ride it in vr. Then that's it. Maz in a nutshell
     
    Darth Geezy likes this.
  13. Krueger

    Krueger Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 9, 2004
    I did think the Maz bit was quite ridiculous, actually. I mean, what the bloody hell was she doing? Bearing in mind, it was only set a couple of days after we last saw her.
     
    ImpreciseStormtrooper likes this.
  14. MrElculver2424

    MrElculver2424 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 11, 2014
    I didn't have a problem with Maz. I mean, I guess she's a pirate, does her own thing. Has connections that help the good guys sometimes. I assume she left Takodana with the Resistance but then went off to deal with her "union." lol

    I would welcome more of her though in IX, especially if more background is given to how she got Luke's lightsaber.
     
  15. The Regular Mustache

    The Regular Mustache Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 22, 2015
    Prediction! In the crawl we learn that the Rebels haven’t made contact with the First Order since TLJ. Six months to a year has past since TLJ.

    ETA: Poe and others are starting to wonder how much longer they should continue hiding.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2018
  16. ImpreciseStormtrooper

    ImpreciseStormtrooper Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 8, 2016
    The characters seemed to behave in an all knowing way as if they had 2 years of hindsight about everything going on in SW fandom since TFA or something.

    They really needed to have a break in time between the two movies. It would have made scenes like that Maz oddity less bizarre.
     
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  17. Doom_Buggy

    Doom_Buggy Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Aug 2, 2016
    I think Maz will have a larger role on 9. I have a feeling she'll help the Resistance build up their forces w/her connections. She'll probably offer some more brief insight to Rey too.
     
    ImpreciseStormtrooper likes this.
  18. ImpreciseStormtrooper

    ImpreciseStormtrooper Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 8, 2016
    Well Maz is a thousand years old. You'd think explaining things about the past would be her raison d'etre.

    Let's hope she talks in fewer riddles in IX.
     
    KDC1972 likes this.
  19. ObiSpamBaloney

    ObiSpamBaloney Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Feb 12, 2014
    Maz and Snoke should be used to tie into a future ancient prequel trilogy to tell the story of the early origins of the Jedi and Sith. Surely they know something, and their introduction as characters in the sequel trilogy could be a springboard for that. Maybe they ever know of one another.

    How I'd handle it in Episode 9
    - Rey reconnects with Maz & ghost Luke, who helps her interpret the ancient Jedi texts and tells of the Jedi's early origins
    - Snoke returns in ghost form to torment or takeover Kylo's body, and during the course we learn of the Sith's early origins and where he fit in, etc.
    - More flashbacks could include Maz and a younger Luke post-ROTJ meeting with Snoke who was once thought to be a potential allly, which results
    in a battle later on, and Snoke's injuries at Luke's hand/saber
    - The ancient prequel trilogy could flesh out those backstory talking points they would briefly describe in Episode 9
     
    ImpreciseStormtrooper likes this.
  20. darklordoftech

    darklordoftech Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 30, 2012
    I hope we find out what Sidious sensed in the Unknown Regions in the Aftermath novels.
     
  21. Albert T

    Albert T Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Jan 14, 2018
    I've got a different idea for Star Wars 9.
    Star Wars
    Episode IX
    Triumph of the Force

    1. Rey, Finn, Poe Dameron, Rose Tico, Chewbacca, C3-PO, R2-D2, BB-8, Lt. Connix, the Porg and the remainder of the Rebels are in hiding on Kanos, where they orchestrate a refugee camp on the luscious, yet desolate planet. A group of refugees, led by Maz Kanata, are brought to Kanos, which includes Lando Calrissian and his family, who have been struggling to get the remainder of the galaxy to fight this re-born Empire. Amongst the rest of refugees is the boy from the end of “The Last Jedi”, who is being taught the ways of the Force by Rey, as well as learning the Jedi legends, such as the tale of the “Black Diamond”. The tale of the Black Diamond is of how the Prime Jedi was corrupted by the power of a massive dark Kyber crystal. The Prime Jedi had seen a vision of himself wielding the Black Diamond and using this ultimate power to destroy all life in the universe, so as to be able to recreate the universe and bring order to it. The Prime Jedi is thwarted by seven Jedi Knights who became the first armored warriors of the religion. Rorar Qane, Manatath Kor, Brusius Veng, Varnasas Tror, Alkona Nier, Zakeer Zala and Darth Vader (with slightly alternate armor from Anakin’s version) were the seven warriors who defeated the Prime Jedi. Darth Vader, the Prime Jedi’s son, soon became corrupted by the Black Diamond and began his own sect within the Jedi called the Sith. The remaining six Knights destroy Darth Vader and give the Sith its first defeat. The six Jedi Knights hide the Black Diamond so no one, especially the Sith, can harness its power and gain control of the universe. The Rebels have been on Kanos for several years and during that time, Leia Skywalker has died and joined with the Force.

    2. A spy on Kanos informs the First Order of the Rebel’s refugee camp and Kylo Ren leads General Hux’s Storm-troopers into battle on Kanos. As Kylo Ren mourns over the grave of his mother in the midst of battle, Rey engages Ren in a light-saber duel (Rey has made a crude saber that is powered by Luke’s old Kyber crystal). Suddenly, a group of four people, who are not associated with the Rebels or the First Order, retrieve the Jedi boy and try to leave with him. As Ren attempts to kill Rey (with great reluctancy) one of the four people, Kan-Ki Mar, comes to Rey’s defense and activates his light-saber, revealing himself to be a Jedi. Rey and the Rebels escape and Ren duels Mar until he delivers a fatal blow (by accident). Before Mar dies, he tells Ren that “he” is coming, for revenge on what Ren did to him.

    3. The Jedi ship is captured and the Jedi aboard are interrogated, but will not divulge where they emanate from, while the child is sent to the training camp on Stronnar, home of the First Order. Kylo Ren is told by a voice he has not heard in a long time, that “I am on Mustafar. Come to me…” Ren takes a ship against Hux’s wish and rages to Mustafar, where he is led by the voice to Darth Vader’s old castle. Once in Vader’s fortress, Ren is locked in combat with a Sith lord named Darth Dread who, flanked by the Knights of Ren, wants revenge for what Ren did to him. Armed with the Dark-saber, Dread battles Ren in a fierce light-saber duel that forces Kylo Ren to don a damaged set of Darth Vader’s old armor, just to protect himself from Dread’s onslaught. Dread claims his revenge is complete and leaves Ren for dead, after eviscerating Kylo’s Vader armor in the midst of battle. Dread also destroys Ren’s cross-guard Saber and uses the bled Kyber crystal to cause a massive explosion within the castle’s power core, which Kylo Ren narrowly evades. Ren escapes from the planet after Dread has left with the Knights of Ren and is soon captured by a pirate ship and taken to the planet Noirion.

    4. Darth Dread, still flanked by the Knights of Ren, boards Hux’s command ship and declares himself the new Supreme Leader, to Hux’s chagrin. Dread enters the observation tower and has the three captured Jedi delivered to him there where he duels with them until he coerces the name of their home planet, Eliquoth, and where it is located, which is the Unknown Region. Dread then kills the Jedi when he has beaten them.

    5. Mean-while, the “Millennium Falcon” has been captured and loaded onto the pirate ship “Slaughter”, captained by Demethur Krull, where they are being taken to the planet of Noirion, the epicenter of the criminal syndicates of the Outer Rim. Krull sells the Rebels to fight promoter Kiio Nane, who takes Kylo Ren, who was also caught by Krull and sold to Nane, and Rey to Praetoria, while the rest of the Rebels are sold to the prison planet of Carceron.

    6. On Carceron, the Rebels encounter the slicer DJ, agrees to help them escape the planet, as long as they help him free his father, who is imprisoned on Carceron as well. The Rebels are aided by General Grievous who, after surviving his fight with Obi-Wan, became a bounty hunter, until he was arrested and sent to Carceron. The Rebels discover Captain Phasma has survived the events of “The Last Jedi” and has been hired as the Vice Warden of the prison. Phasma, revealing her guilt in her part in the First Order, helps the Rebels escape by causing a prison riot, which DJ facilitates by destroying the computer main-frame of the prison. The Rebels help DJ free his father from his cell, who turns out to be Boba Fett (there might be a pattern of returns here, but who cares). DJ, or Guro Fett, as he is called now, and brings the Rebels, along with Phasma and Grievous joining the group, to Praetoria, to save Rey and Kylo Ren.

    7. On the Unknown Region planet Praetoria, the Praetorian king, Roban Gorah, sentences Rey and Kylo Ren to fight in the Capatheon, a mechanized arena on Praetoria that is featured in Kiio Nane’s fight league. The Praetorian Empire, which is a part of a union of planets that form a tyrannical monarchy in the Unknown Region, was the catalyst for the First Order gaining the wealth necessary to amass the armory with which they now wage war with. Roban seeks vengeance for the dishonorable death his Praetorian Guard suffered during their battle with Rey and Ren in “The Last Jedi”, so the fight in the Capatheon is to the death. Rey, with her light-saber repaired and improved, and Ren, armed with Darth Vader/Anakin’s Sith light-saber as a “gift” from Darth Dread, who acquired it from Vader’s grave duel until Rey has Ren at her mercy, but she relents. King Roban sends his Praetorian Warriors into the Capatheon to destroy the pair of Jedi, but they are able to repel there attack. The Rebels, given the information of the pair’s location by having watched the previous fights while still at the prison (they get there with the hyper-drive) arrive to save the pair as Rey and Ren are now locked in battle with Dread and the Knights of Ren. The heroes blast their way back into space and set course for the planet Mekalokis, the industrial epicenter of the galaxy.

    8. Rey receives a message from Luke Skywalker’s ghost that she and Ren need to go to Eliquoth to beseech the mysterious Jedi tribe that has hidden on the planet for thousands of years for their help in fighting the First Order. The pair leaves and the Rebel’s fly to Mekalokis, until they are captured by Darth Dread and the First Order. The Rebels are taken to Stronnar, where they are tortured by Hux, who has been left in charge while Dread flies to an uncertain location in space. Phasma, finally resisting her masters in the First Order, helps Finn kill Hux and free the Rebels. Phasma and Finn reach the center of the First Order base and, through the communication console, urge the Storm-troopers to rebel against the Imperial officers who kidnapped and weaponized you. The Storm-troopers revolt from the First Order command and seize the planet. Phasma fights the Storm-trooper leader and kills him.

    9. During the scenes on Stronnar, Rey and Ben arrive on Eliquoth and learn of the clan of Jedi, several hundred strong, who have lived on the planet for thousands of years, rescuing those with Force-sensitivity during the many years of their occupation of Eliquoth. Providing a haven for potential Jedi Knights, they chose to remove themselves from the conflicts of the galaxy and from war itself. Among the Jedi on Eliquoth are, Kyle Katarn, Ezra Bridger, Ashoka Tano and Mara Jade, Luke’s apparent widow, who was ushered to Eliquoth after her son with Luke, named Racen, was killed by Ben Skywalker. Rey hears the voice of Luke in her head and he urges the pair to hike to the top of Mount Tano. Rey and Ben arrive at the top of the mountain and meet… Luke Skywalker. Luke did not die at the end of “The Last Jedi”, but was instead transported to Eliquoth by the Force itself, with the task of uniting the Jedi of Eliquoth with the galaxy. (Rian Johnson states in an interview that you never hear Luke’s robot hand clank on the ground after he disappears, which would normally happen as that appendage isn’t actually a part of his real body. This is a good way to imply Luke never actually died if asked by the press.) Luke takes the pair to a cave inside Mount Tano, where the Black Diamond has been hidden for all of these years. The three Jedi surround the Black Diamond and harness its power to see into the past so as to recover Ben’s memory of what happened to Luke’s son Racen and Rey’s family. Luke discovers that Racen had a premonition that the galaxy would fall into eternal darkness at the hands of his child, Kira Skywalker. Racen kills his wife Vaenella Eaon when she tries to stop Racen from murdering their child. Ben, who had been with the family during this time, saw what Racen was doing and dueled Racen until he dealt a powerful blow to Racen that sent him plummeting from the cliff they had fought upon. The Skywalker family thought Ben had tried to kill the whole family and, since Ben had lost his memory due to the trauma, he could not account for the carnage. The child, Kira, is sent away to a friend of the family and is raised until she was a pre-teen. Kira is then left on Jakku when her guardian runs afoul of the First Order. Rey realizes that she is Kira and that Racen was her father. The Black Diamond begins to tempt Ben into killing both Luke and Rey but, after a brief battle with the two, he resists the seduction and frees himself of evil’s grasp, once and for all. Darth Dread, the Knights of Ren and Dread’s First Order battalion arrive on Eliquoth to take the Black Diamond, as well as destroy the Jedi clan. After a fierce battle, Dread leaves with the Black Diamond, but not before the Jedi are able to escape to Mekalokis.

    10. Darth Dread reaches a mysterious moon, which is revealed to be a space station. Dread places the Black Diamond into the core of the space station and it activates. Dread kills the remainder of the battalion he had brought to Eliquoth with his new weapon, the Apocalypse. Dread takes his space station, the Apocalypse, to Stronnar where the Storm-troopers have just revolted and he destroys the planet and the troopers, but not before the Rebel’s escape to Mekalokis.

    11. The Rebels find the massive armory as the rest of the Galaxy’s warriors arrive on Mekalokis, now free of the First Order’s control. We find that both the “Slave 1” and “Millenium Falcon” ships are in the junk pile on Mekalokis and are repaired for war with Darth Dread’s “Apocalypse”. The armor from the tale of Black Diamond is forged for seven new Jedi Knights, including a set of Darth Vader armor for Ben Skywalker.

    12. Rey, Mara and Luke decide to fly to Darth Dread aboard his battle station, to confront him and save him from the dark side. Dread/Racen, reveals that he has not simply brought the Apocalypse with him, but an army of warriors bred from the Prime Jedi’s DNA to fight the Republic as the Apocalypse recharges its power. Dread then reveals that the Black Diamond has housed the spirit of the Prime Jedi since his demise. Through the power of the Black Diamond, the Prime Jedi has turned the likes of Sheev Palpatine, Darth Plageius, Count Dooku, Anakin Skywalker and the Prime Jedi’s own son, Darth Vader, all in an effort to complete his prophecy of bringing order to the universe.

    13. The Apocalypse arrives at Mekalokis and the battle finally ensues, with the likes of Lando, Maz Kanata, Captain Phasma, Kyle Katarn, BB-8 and others dying during battle. Dread’s Demolishers, as the “clones” are called when in battle, are ferocious in the fray and are a tremendous force. Ben, in his Darth Vader armor, leads the six other Jedi adorned in the armor to the Apocalypse to aid the Skywalkers who are now fighting Dread and the Knights of Ren. After the other six Jedi Knights are killed, along with the Knights of Ren, Ben is forced to kill Dread/Racen after Dread refuses to stop his assault on his daughter. The spirit of the Prime Jedi merges with a body built from his own DNA and is re-born as the Prime Jedi, once more. The Prime Jedi kills Ben and battles the three remaining Skywalkers. Rey combines Racen’s Dark-saber crystal with Mara Jade’s kyber crystal, which is the original white Light-saber that was hidden on Eliquoth, and creates a golden light-saber that she uses to slay the Prime Jedi. General Grievous infiltrates the Apocalypse in an attempt to use it as his own weapon to hold the universe hostage with, but Luke defeats him in a duel and sends him plummeting to his doom in the reactor core of the battle station. The Skywalkers escape to Mekalokis as the Apocalypse explodes, destroying the Destroyers and the Black Diamond, forever.

    14. The galaxy celebrates their triumph on Salabrey, with Luke and Mara embracing their grand-daughter and their family now whole.
     
  22. The Regular Mustache

    The Regular Mustache Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 22, 2015
    Inner conflict has been a theme in the ST and Star Wars in general. Kylo's conflicted, arguably Rey's had an inner struggle over her parentage, Finn's had an inner struggle whether to leave the Resistance or to stay etc...Maybe Ep. 9 will be about the inner conflict within the Resistance and the First Order?

    I've touched on this before but I think we'll learn from the crawl or early on in the film that Leia has been away for weeks if not months and completely out of communication with the Resistance.

    Perhaps we'll even see people in the Resistance starting to wonder and doubt if Leia coming back at all. Maybe some will suggest that Leia has abandoned them as improbable as that might sound. Seems like that could be a good source of conflict among the Resistance.

    Also if the Resistance haven't been in contact with the First Order since TLJ, (my current theory) and the Resistance remain hidden from the FO it seems like it would be a good idea to create some internal tension in the Resistance for dramatic effect. If people in the Resistance know that Kylo Ren is Leia's son and that Leia hasn't been seen or heard from in a long time I could easily see a paranoid person in the Resistance start to wonder if Leia has left the Resistance behind and has been in contact with Kylo Ren. I don't think that would be a popular belief among the Resistance but I could see it being the opinion of a vocal minority.

    On the one hand you might have Poe honoring Leia's last order to stay hidden until she returns, (Poe's trying to be less of an impulsive hothead in Ep. 9) and then on the other hand you have a vocal minority saying, "how long are we going to hide? How long are we going to wait for Leia? Where is Leia anyway? Why won't anybody tell us where she is? How do we know she's not in contact with her son? How do we know she hasn't been killed? How do we know she hasn't abandoned us?"

    Seems like it could be cool to see Poe trying to keep the Resistance from cracking up. Then unexpectedly Rey takes the side of the vocal minority that has their doubts about Leia. Though Rey clarifies that she doesn't share the opinion that Leia has abandoned or sold out the Resistance Rey does feel like the time for waiting is over and that they need to start being more proactive.

    Or maybe Rey lies to the Resistance and tells them that she's been in touch with Leia and this calms everybody down. Then she reveals to Finn and the rest of the inner circle that she lying and that they're on their own. Rey, sees that the Resistance is starting to fracture so she tells this lie to buy some time, enough time for Rey, Finn and the gang to carry out their own secret plan. Plus Rey is thinking/hoping Leia really is going to help them out somehow. Rey's thought is, "the lie I told the Resistance won't be a lie if Leia really does help us out in time, and in the meantime we need to carry out a mission that will help the Resistance.

    Or maybe it's something different. Maybe in Ep. 9 we'll learn how the Resistance is running low on food, fuel, supplies, and people and instead of trying to fight the FO, the Resistance is simply doing all it can to survive. They're flying around the galaxy trying to rebuild while trying to remain hidden from the FO. Perhaps a desperate member of the Resistance sells out the Resistance for the promise of some food and shelter.

    On the flip side maybe we'll see an inner conflict within the First Order a la Kylo and Hux.

    So there you have it. Star Wars Episode 9: The War Within. It'll be First Order vs. First Order. Resistance vs. Resistance.
     
    hermiona52, Lost_Hope and modaubr like this.
  23. BalanceOfTheForce

    BalanceOfTheForce Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Dec 18, 2016
    I doubt it. I'm expecting the next TV show to be Rebels vs First Order between TLJ and IX
     
    cerealbox likes this.