CT ESB Vader/Paltpaine flub

In the DVD/Bluray edition of ESB Lucas added a newly recorded scene of Palpatine talking to Darth Vader and revealing to Vader's shock that he has a son.

Problem being Vader refers to "Skywalker" in earlier scenes meaning that he is aware of his son.

The original scene doesn't have this contradiction and it likely only exists because Lucas didn't remember that earlier line of dialogue.

 

He doesn't have to be aware Luke is his son merely because he knows Luke's name. He may only suspect that there is some connection at this point.

 

Also Vader is trying to get to Luke before the Emperor does. He is feigning shock in order to throw the Emperor off his scent.

 

I'm not sure if that's the way Lucas intended it to be interpreted. Certainly, the writer of the YA novelization of TESB (published shortly after ROTS came out) portrayed Vader as being shocked and surprised in his own work (The Rise & Fall of Darth Vader) and I think he may have done so in the aforesaid novelization as well.

Rise & Fall of Darth Vader version of the scene:

"What is thy bidding, my Master?"
From light years away, on Coruscant, the Emperor replied, "There is a great disturbance in the Force."
"I have felt it," Vader said.
"We have a new enemy. The young Rebel who destroyed the Death Star. I have no doubt that this boy is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker."
Offspring?! The surviving tissue in Vader's throat suddenly went dry. Through his shock, he managed to say, "How is that possible?"
Without offering any explanation to support his stated conviction, the Emperor answered, "Search your feelings, Lord Vader. You will know it to be true. He could destroy us."
Having fought Luke Skywalker on Mimban, Vader was even more aware of the young man's powers than was the Emperor. But he also knew something else; Luke was as ignorant of their familial connection as Vader had been. If he had known the truth on Mimban, Vader thought, I would have sensed it. Still grappling with the Emperor's declaration, he struggled to find words that might discourage his Master's interest in Skywalker. "He is just a boy," Vader said. "Obi-Wan can no longer help him."
The Emperor believed otherwise. "The Force is strong with him," he said. "The son of Skywalker must not become a Jedi."
The Emperor had not said in so many words that he wanted Luke Skywalker dead, so Vader — needing Skywalker alive to accomplish his goals — took a different tack. "If he could be turned," Vader suggested, "he would become a powerful ally."
"Yes," the Emperor mused, as if he had not thought of that possibility. Vader could only imagine what the Emperor was thinking. The Sith had long maintained their rule of two: one Master, one apprentice. Even Vader knew that there wasn't room enough in the galaxy for three Sith Lords, and yet the Emperor's hooded eyes seemed to sparkle as he said more emphatically, "Yes. He would be a great asset. Can it be done?"
"He will join us or die, Master," Vader said. He bowed, and the Emperor's hologram faded out.
Now that the Emperor was interested in Luke Skywalker's fate, Vader knew he had to do everything in his power to find Luke before the Emperor found him.

 

Lucas , i'm sure, watched ESB many times as he was making changes. I'm sure he didn't forget it.
Beside's Vader doesn't act like he's never heard the name before, he says "how is this possible" that he has a son. Still, he was feigning ignorance to the Emporer. Had he gotten to Luke without the Emporer knowing about it he may really have tried to turn him and overthrow the Emporer.

 

It's not a contradiction at all. The whole point is that it makes it clear that Vader and the Emperor as Sith as lying to each other as is the Sith way.

The opening crawl tells you Vader looking for Luke as does his probe search and his wanting the Falcon to get Leia and Han to lure Luke.

Vaderr is trying to do this all behind the Emperor's back. Then he finds out that Sidious knows but he pretends that he doesn't know. "Oh really?" OK I didn't know that. I'll get right on that thing (which I was doing already). How long Sidious knew we don't know.

It's basically "I know what you are thinking. Don't think you can put one over on me"

In the original version the Emperor is telling Vader "new" information that they have a new enemy and his name is Luke Skywalker. There is no reaction from Vader that he suddenly has a son. Odd that. Unless Skywalker is as common as Smith.

Now in the actual context of the movie it's being kept as a surprise for later so it's a cheat to keep that secret. In the new version he has to act suprised by saying "How is that possible?"

Now you could read it as maybe he thinks this Luke Skywalker is his son and the fact that he was hanging out with Obi-Wan might be a clue but he's not sure.

 

That makes Vader look like an idiot. Typical for Lucas, to try and make Vader look more and more pathetic.

 

I get the feeling that Vader knew about Luke being his son from the beginning of Empire. It's in the opening crawl that he's obsessed with finding him. He mentions Luke by name to Admiral Ozzel and tells him to go to Hoth. He then lands in the middle of a battlefield and searches for him on foot. Afterward, believing Luke may be on the Falcon, he focuses his pursuit on that vessel in order to track him down. He then drags his flagship into an astroid field to find the Falcon. The Emperor contacts him and tells him about Luke being his son. I don't think it's a coincidence that the Rebel pilot he's so extremely intent on finding turns out to be his son all of a sudden. I feel he had to have known all along. His line of "How is that possible?" was simply meant to show him playing dumb in the hopes that the Emperor wouldn't find out he was planning to betray him.

 

It seems like another one of those things which since the father reveal doesn't seem QUITE right. It CAN work. You can MAKE it work with various explanations, but it doesn't work all that naturally.

 

It's made perfectly clear in the scene that Vader suspects, that the rebel called Skywalker famous for destroying the Death Star may be his child he thought died along with his wife. I doesn't have to be explained.

 

While I agree with you, I see Vader as knowing Luke is his son and being obsessed with finding him; playing devil's advocate I must say he could have been just as obsessed with the only other man in the galaxy who managed to outfly him, destroy the Death Star and make a fool of him.

Clearly you're not too familiar with this community. Every minor detail must be explained, again and again, and again..

 

How is he an idiot? He, along with everyone else in the galaxy, saw Padme's pregnant belly at her funeral. The last time he ever saw his pregnant wife was when he choked her into unconsciousness and then abandoned her on a platform for an extended period of time without medical intervention. His master confirmed that he killed her. That's a lot of evidence that says Luke being his son is impossible. Luke having the same last name as him doesn't automatically make all that evidence go away, especially since Luke was hanging around with Obi-Wan (and thus the name could just be a ploy to mess with Vader's head).

Obviously Vader has an underlying suspicion about Luke despite his internal protestations to the contrary, which is why he's so obsessed with finding him. But he doesn't allow himself to actually believe Luke is his son until the Emperor confirms it.

 

Works for me.

Same book, earlier scene:

The Rise & Fall of Darth Vader

Luke Skywalker.
According to municipal records obtained from the settlement of Anchorhead on Tatooine, that was the name on the registration for a T-16 sky hopper owned by a human male pilot who had lived at the Lars homestead and was approximately nineteen standard years old.
Luke Skywalker.
According to a Kubaz freelance spy in Mos Eisley, that was the name on a Spaceport Speeders sales record for the landspeeder that had been purchased from a young man who later left on the Millennium Falcon, the Corellian freighter that had also carried Obi-Wan Kenobi to the Death Star.
Luke Skywalker.
According to a captured Rebel whom Darth Vader interrogated on Centares, that was the name of the X-wing pilot who had destroyed the Death Star.
Luke Skywalker.
Even while inspecting his nearly completed flagship, the Super Star Destroyer Executor, Vader could not get Luke Skywalker out of his mind. He silently chewed on the name, and considered the fact that the boy had been born three years after the death of Shmi Skywalker. to the best of his knowledge, Anakin Skywalker had been his mother's only living blood relative.
Could there have been other Skywalkers from Tatooine? Vader allowed the possibility. After all, it wasn't an entirely uncommon name in the galaxy.
But Anakin and Padme Amidala had been expecting a baby nineteen years ago.
Nineteen standard years.
It's not possible,Vader thought. I killed Padme. The baby died with her.
Not for the first time, he wondered if the Emperor had told him the whole truth about Padme's death. But I remember choking her ... seeing her collapse on Mustafar. I was so angry with her. And yet ...
Luke Skywalker exists.
Vader refused to believe the notorious Rebel's surname was merely a bizarre coincidence. If he had possessed any other name, Vader would not have hesitated to report what he had learned to the Emperor. But for purely selfish reasons, Vader kept the young Rebel's name to himself. To him, Luke Skywalker was more than a mystery to be solved.
He is ... an opportunity. As strong with the Force as he may be, he is an opportunity ... an opportunity for even greater power.
But who is he? Who were his parents? Could he have been Obi-Wan's son? But then why was he named Skywalker and raised by the Lars family? Or was he merely trained by Obi-Wan?
Because Obi-Wan Kenobi, Shmi Skywalker, Owen and Beru Lars, and Padme Amidala were dead, there was only one way Vader could discover the truth. He would have to ask Luke Skywalker himself. All he had to do was find him.

 

Why do you have to be a Lucas basher? Do you really think George Lucas wants Vader to look pathetic? I mean REALLY? Of course he doesn't...your dispositions towards Lucas for whatever reasons are misplaced in this context and is...well for lack of a better word...pathetic...

 

It doesn't change anything other than that we now know the fact that Palpatine did not know that Vader knew Luke was his son

"How is that possible?" is literally asking "how is it physically possible to have a son when I killed my pregnant wife?"

 

It's his opinion gawd damn it!

 

Lucas forgot that Obi Wan gave Luke Anakin's Lightsaber so I doubt he remembered one line of throw away dialogue.

Original ESB was shot with the idea that Darth Vader knew who Luke was and that he was his son, the new DVD scene seems it was filmed with the idea of this being the reveal of that to Vader.

 

Lucas simply forgot about the previous line and screwed up ... again. It's not the first time it happened, now is it?

Of course now we fans explain this by saying "Vader feigned ignorance" but it is just another workaround for a plot hole that didn't need to exist in the first place.

You obviously didn't read the interview quotes in which he called Vader pathetic and a mere flunky.

http://www.rollingstone.com/movies/news/george-lucas-and-the-cult-of-darth-vader-20050602

 

RedVad: When did he forget about the lightsaber?

Vader is either feigning shock or already suspecting it without understanding how it would be possible.

 

When filming ROTS.

The crew had to remind him about what happened in Episode IV because he was shooting it without Obi Wan recovering Anakin's Lightsaber.

 

There's also the TESB junior novelization, which came out shortly after the scene change:

TESB Junior novelization:

From light years away, on the planet Coruscant, the Emperor said, "There is a great disturbance in the Force."
"I have felt it," Vader said.
The Emperor continued, "We have a new enemy. The young Rebel who destroyed the Death Star. I have no doubt this boy is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker."
"How is that possible?" Darth Vader managed to ask through his shock. Could it be ... true?
"Search your feelings, Lord Vader. You will know it to be true. He could destroy us."
"He's just a boy," Vader pointed out, the belief rising within him that Anakin's son could exist. He thought, If the Emperor knows about the boy, he also knows the fate of Obi-Wan Kenobi. Vader added, "Obi-Wan can no longer help him."
"The Force is strong with him," the Emperor said. "The son of Skywalker must not become a Jedi."
The Emperor had not said, in so many words, that the young Skywalker must die, which was fortunate because Vader had something else in mind. He told his Master, "If he could be turned, he would become a powerful ally."
"Yes," said the Emperor, his expression thoughtful, as if he had not previously considered the possibility. Sith Lords had long maintained a rule of limiting their numbers to only two: one master and one apprentice - but now, the Emperor's eyes seemed to ignite, and he repeated, "Yes. He would be a great asset. Can it be done?"
"He will join us or die, Master," Vader said. He bowed, and the Emperor's hologram faded out.
Nothing will stand in my way, Darth Vader thought. Nothing will stop me from achieving my goal. If I must search the farthest reaches of the galaxy, I will find Luke Skywalker.​

 

To fix this Lucas would need to edit the "skywalker" line.

Since Lucas is not involved anymore I'll doubt we'll see anymore alterations, maybe Disney will make the Original OT the main version?

 

I don't see Vader knowing Luke's name as a huge problem.

 

double post. please delete...

 

When did that happen? That was a 2nd unit shot if i remember correctly.
Things like that do happen while filming btw all the time.

What previous line?
What plot hole?
What screw up?
Wth?