Discussion in 'Literature' started by Ganner, Oct 20, 2000.
C'mon guys! Ease up on the personal attacks!
Do I see the Abyss looking back into you?
That's what we should avoid in order to stop further attacks on the EU...
just doing some Preventer work! We do need an underground squadron of preventers!
Red Five, signing in for about five minutes =)
Callsign? Call me "Wizard."
And lets not rearrange the squadrons so that Red Flight has the most stars and posts... as people gain stars we might have to keep switching people out, which would be a pain. Let those in Red Flight stay there, on the basis that we were first to answer the call to arms.
'Course, maybe I'm biased here...
Red Five, signing out. Good night! =}
What are you referrig to when you say 'personal attacks'? Are you talking about what we say here or what has been said there?
If you mean my back-and-forth with DarthGato, well...I was being easy on him actually. I didn't flame. But I did tell him something about himself that he didn't like. (I told him that he wants to be 'right'.)
One of the biggest problems with these 'bashers' is that they are often actually just being mean, rather than having an actual point that is being discussed. When that is the case, it is sometimes necessary to point out the ACTUAL thing that is the problem - namely, their ATTITUDE. But the emotion with which we point that out is the thing to watch.
That IS what we are handling, after all - THE ATTITUDE. We don't care if they disagree with the EU. We just want them to cool out and not be so savagely against it...and that breaks down to ATTITUDE. For some, the attitude is just based on data, in which case debate about the DATA is what improves the situation. In other cases, the source of their attacks is just their own personal attitude problem, in which case, that is pointed out candidly.
Well, that's my view on it.
Contrary to your impotent and infantile attempt at a flame, I am quite literate Genghis and had read the entire thread in question. I found it amusing to be perfectly honest- the downtrodden EU masses have taken it upon themselves to organize a Crusade! LOL!
The point still stands - there is no need for two threads, regardless of Ganner's request. If this forum were as heavily patrolled by admins as some of the others, this thread would be eliminated. The idea may well have been spawned from good intentions, but it seems likely to invite a flame war.
To classify me as an EU hater is inaccurate. I've read quite a few EU stories and actually enjoyed some such as Shadows of the Empire, Tales from Mos Eisley, & Heir to the Empire.
However, when dealing with the Prequels and the Original Trilogy, I (along with everyone else) will debate the validity of any theory posted. I am admittedly of the opinion that EU ideas are at best marginally relevant to debates currently raging in Prequel and Classic threads.
Don't expect your attempts to swamp EU "bashers" such as Darth Gato to sway too many people's hearts. It will only galvanize resistance.
Well, looks like something is boiling in a Episode II thread: A Great Scene for the EU (Exploited Universe) in Episode II, sorry, couldn't get the URL! Anyways, nightwatch, if you could keep an eye on it, Gold 8 signing out for the night!
Be seeing you all
Even a preventer's got to sleep!
If the admins wanted to delete the old thread so that there is only one, that would be fine with me.
Would we THEN be acceptable in your eyes?
This is the Commodore, signing out. I'll be back late tomorrow night.
I never said I had a problem with EU FANS. I will debate their THEORIES... Love the sinner, hate the sin .
There seems to be an unhealthy obsession with
"bashers" around here.
Er, yes? The first thread is just our counterpart to the Exploited Universe.
I must admit I'm beginning to regret posting the other one, because practically everyone misunderstood me.
If you want to be taken seriously, debate using logic and evidence. Turning debates into emotional pissing contests never accomplishes anything.
I admit there have been some rude response to EU fans and their ideas, but doing likewise is pointless.
When have we not been using logic and evidence?
Er, I've never flamed or anything. The "tease and annoy" ideas just came to me in a SHAZAM! and I knew I had to post them.
Gold 3 checkin in here, Lead.
The "Between Ep I & EpII..." Thread is oing pretty good. It's pretty sympathetic to the EU. Perhaps some passive, quality posts can do more to help the whole situation...
It's a pretty good discussion.
Darth-Seminole, from your sig and this statement: "I never said I had a problem with EU FANS. I will debate their THEORIES... Love the sinner, hate the sin ." I'm not sure what to make of you. Do you see using the EU to theorize about the events of Ep. II & III as a "sin", or just theorizing in disagreement with your theories?
This is an honest question. Like I said, that last bit of the quote and the John/Austin 3:16 thing intrigue me.
The "Love the sinner..." remark was made in jest.
I thought as much.
You didn't answer my question, though.
Red 9 to EDF Lead:
I was referring to the swipes at Darth Seminole, inferring that he didn't read and such.
Personal attacks, even on our home turf, don't make us look good...
hey, i have no problem with a different opinion, but just because we like the EU is no reason to try and start fights. i am here to protect the EU and to teach people to be a little more open minded.
Black 6 here, can't stay very long.
Looks like there's some tension on this thread. Maybe I can help.
Then again, maybe I can't. Sorry.
*hangs head in shame and logs off*
"Contrary to your impotent and infantile attempt at a flame, I am quite literate Genghis and had read the entire thread in question..."
No flame intended. Had you paid attention to what you read, you'll see that the previous thread was requested to be dropped and replaced by this one. A point of fact is that you were the only person keeping near the front by posting to it.
"The point still stands - there is no need for two threads, regardless of Ganner's request."
Which is why the first was allowed to drop. If you don't think we need two threads, then why post to _BOTH_ threads.
"If this forum were as heavily patrolled by admins as some of the others, this thread would be eliminated."
Correction, the previous thread would be eliminated. And, btw, don't knock Darth Ludicrous and the Gatherer. You only wish you had admins like them. While DL could still use some help in understanding the strengths of the Marvel series, that's a minor point
"The idea may well have been spawned from good intentions, but it seems likely to invite a flame war."
Only by those people who wish to start one. However, if you _DID_ actually read our intro in this thread, you will see that the EU Defense Force would do no such thing. However, the EU-bashers have as you've pointed out done just that in the past.
"To classify me as an EU hater is inaccurate. I've read quite a few EU stories and actually enjoyed some such as Shadows of the Empire, Tales from Mos Eisley, & Heir to the Empire.
However, when dealing with the Prequels and the Original Trilogy, I (along with everyone else) will debate the validity of any theory posted."
And that is our whole point. SW topics should be debated not on source but on content.
"I am admittedly of the opinion that EU ideas are at best marginally relevant to debates currently raging in Prequel and Classic threads."
However, since you do claim to know about the EU, you must also know that not all of the EU is comprised of new works by "outside" authors. In fact, a lot of it, using WEG material as an example, uses actual information from movie backgroun concepts and notes. To stereotype the entire EU based on a few high profile novels is just wrong. There's a lot of material which can offer some good insights on both the prequel as well as classic threads.
"Don't expect your attempts to swamp EU "bashers" such as Darth Gato to sway too many people's hearts. It will only galvanize resistance."
Hmmm, I am not aware of any collective effort to single out anyone. If that's going on, it's not by the EU Defense Force-sanctioned. However, if Darth Gato is spewing a bunch of inaccuracies about the EU, then rest assured the EU Defense Force will probably correct his mistakes so that others don't get taken in by them.
This is not a debate thread, this is a safe, NO FIRE ZONE for both sides, like Exploited Universe and any attack on it will be met ten-fold, at least by myself and any other war hawks that are in my Squadron or any other. I repeat, let this thread stay a base for the EUDF w/o interference.
That being said...
After reading the posts of Darth Gato and those by Darth Holliday, jewlmc and others, I have come to believe we are in fact failing in our mission. We have not succeeded in getting our point across, we have not succeeded in stopping ridicule, and yet we persist in this course of defense, defense, defense.
We are the New Republic in the shadow of the Yuuzhan Vong.
We must fight back. I vote for an amendment to the rules of the EUDF:
-*- If you are attacked/flamed/ridiculed, you can "open fire" at the attacker through Private Messages or, if repetitive, the open thread. We cannot show the accomodation and weak stance we have; that is why the EU-bashers are winning.
-*- Expantionistic Defense. Our ideas are as valid as some yahoo who claims to have been here since '98. If you have an idea, make a new thread and post your idea there, we will back it up 100%, not matter how far of a stretch it is. This goes for ANY OTHER pro-EU thread in the Movie forums. Basically, do not limit defense to the thread an attack has been "declared"; preemptive defence stances in other threads work just as well to catch new readers and move swing-supporters to our side.
Those are my two rule amendments. I go by them, regardless of consequence because I cannot stand losing this war of attrition. We must be set in stone, built in the rock of our convictions. As we exist now, we constantly are force to accomodate and change our views; we are built on shifting sands.
That is my opinon.
C-C Black Lead out.