Evolution

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by Captain-Communist, May 2, 2002.

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  1. Captain-Communist Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 24, 2002
    star 3
    Why do many Fundamentalist Christians not believe in evolution?
  2. C-ThreeSleepyToes Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2001
    'Cause it's not in the Bible, Captain.
  3. Captain-Communist Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 24, 2002
    star 3
    is Chemistry in the Bible? Is the Periodic Table of Elements in the bible.

    Just cuz its not in the bible doesnt mean its not true right?
  4. Jedi_Master201 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2001
    star 5
    Because it contradicts the idea that death entered the world through sin.
  5. Obi-Zahn Kenobi Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 23, 1999
    star 7
    I suggest that you bring this up in the Creation thread or the Bible thread...
  6. Darth_SnowDog Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 10, 2001
    star 4
    Hey, evolution theory doesn't contradict Buddhism, Shintoism, Hinduism, Confucianism, Falun Gong, Hare Krishna and... well, almost as much as 50 percent of the world's religions. Heh, how about that.

    The reason fundamentalist Christians don't believe in evolution is because they underestimate the ability of whatever brought this universe into being... they belittle that omnipotence and try to make it fit within the confines of just one book of thousands which describes "god", because of their well-indoctrinated fear of going to hell for using all the faculties god gave them, and yet they still have not been able to reconcile why other religions exist... except to either concoct an excuse such as "free will" and/or to chalk it up to the devil... just another imaginary, unprovable character in a 2000 year old comedy of errors.

    I say comedy of errors because while evolution has gained evidence and support and acceptance in the world, fundamentalist Christianity has done nothing but stumbled upon itself time after time again, backpedaling and receding continuously from the once magnanimous ignorance and intolerance it wielded like a sword to guard people from the truth for so many centuries.

    In my experience and observation, and the observation of many throughout history, any person or culture that isn't adaptable and amenable to growth and the expansion of knowledge, wisdom and skill eventually dies. One has to wonder how non-proselytizing faiths (not to mention atheism) such as Buddhism and Hinduism can exist with such stong numbers (Hinduism being the third largest, only behind two proselytizing faiths... Islam and Christianity).

    If these other religions aren't expanding through aggressive marketing efforts, or by cutting down other faiths, then it must be by the merit of their own content... I think that says something very strongly. People are not content with turning off their better judgment and being blissfully ignorant to the world around them in favor of a doctrine that hasn't really awarded them anything but hope... which, really, can come from anything... even a sandwich. (Except a sandwich doesn't carry two-thousand years of dogmatic baggage with it.)

    Evolution theory and the multidisciplinary range of sciences which support it, which collectively are referred to as astrobiology, are about actively pursuing the truth, not sitting around starving of knowledge, waiting for it to someday fall from the sky.

    If there is a God, and he didn't intend for us to gain this knowledge, we wouldn't have found one fossil, or one intermediary species, or DNA, or anything else that brings us closer to the truth than a few crafty writers could in an age where so little was known about the world around them, much less the universe... and anything that couldn't be explained was chalked up to an invisible man who still hasn't used his omnipotence to show himself to the whole world for once and for all.
  7. Garli Pesan Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 13, 2000
    star 4
    Well the catholic church didn't acknowledge the earth moved around the sun until like the 1990's, so give them time, they could come around.
  8. Goldberry Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2001
    star 4
    The Catholic church has acknowledged Evolution as fact - the frightening thing is that 40% of American Catholics still don't.
  9. ArtificialStupidity Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 20, 2002
    star 3
    I have also witnessed the ignorance of Christians regarding the theory of Evolution. They defend their view by saying it is nothing but a theory and holds no evidence - that Bible holds the one and only truth, which they follow blindly.



    Evidence is within our own body - for if we had not evolved, we would not have the useless remains of a tail-bone. That mere fragment located in our lower body indicates that we have lost our tail via course of evolution - due to the fact that we are in no need of a tail anymore. I strongly believe in Evolution; for it is generally supported and is clearly visible in the animal and plant-life of our Planet.
  10. Obi-Zahn Kenobi Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 23, 1999
    star 7
    " Evidence is within our own body - for if we had not evolved, we would not have the useless remains of a tail-bone. That mere fragment located in our lower body indicates that we have lost our tail via course of evolution - due to the fact that we are in no need of a tail anymore. I strongly believe in Evolution; for it is generally supported and is clearly visible in the animal and plant-life of our Planet."

    Meh, I'll pay for it to be removed.

    Then you won't be able to poop. [face_plain]
  11. Wylding Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2000
    star 5
    The Catholic church has acknowledged Evolution as fact - the frightening thing is that 40% of American Catholics still don't.

    Unless it's an observable event, from a scientific standpoint it will always be called a theory and a working theory at that. There are constant revisions to it all the time and that is as it should be. Science is not faith and faith is not science...

    All the evidence points toward speciation through natural selection, but unless you can observe that directly, it will only be a theory. Ever heard of the Unified Field Theory? We have the same problem with that right now...

    So watch where you throw out the word fact. It might be based on facts, but science needs observation to confirm theories based on fact. That's just the way you confirm or deny a hypothesis.
  12. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    Good points, Wylding. I don't believe in creationism, but it still irks me to hear evolution thrown about as absolute and proven fact. It's not.

    The Catholic church has acknowledged Evolution as fact - the frightening thing is that 40% of American Catholics still don't.

    Error on both counts. The Church has not acknowledged evolution as fact, and I don't think 60% of American Catholics acknowledge a theory as fact.
  13. Wylding Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2000
    star 5
    Good points, Wylding. I don't believe in creationism, but it still irks me to hear evolution thrown about as absolute and proven fact. It's not.

    Working in a microbio lab has rubbed off on me :)
  14. Greesha Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2002
    star 3
    I don't believe in Evolution because the Bible says "In the beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth." And if you don't think the Bible is fact, look at how much evolutionists have controdicted themselves. Nebraska man was a whole skeleton created in the imagination of evolutionists after they discovered a pig's tooth. Java man was a gibbon's skull. Piltdown man was an orangotan (sp?). The famous Lucy is a confusing pile of bones. Neanderthal man isn't the missing link, he probably just had rickets. How can you still believe evolution after all these mistakes that are being made? If there was a missing link, wouldn't they have found it by now?
  15. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    Why do some people believe that it must be either completely creationism or completely evolution?

    Has anyone considered the possibility that maybe God created the earth and that things evolved from there?
  16. Greesha Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2002
    star 3
    Many people believe that God created the microorganisms and they evolved from there, but in the Bible it says that death did not occur until after Adam and Eve ate the fruit, but for Evolution to work there has to be death.
  17. sleazo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2001
    star 4
    Uhh greesha you really dont know too much about paleo-anthropology. And lets calm down with the conspiracy theories on how wicked scientists are trying to make you believe in evolution
  18. Fat_Fett Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 24, 2001
    star 4
    Sleazo, exactly when did she call the scientists "wicked"?
  19. FlamingSword Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2001
    star 6
    Why do some people believe that it must be either completely creationism or completely evolution?

    Has anyone considered the possibility that maybe God created the earth and that things evolved from there?


    Exactely! I know so many people who blidnly follow evolution because it is the PC or correct thing to do. It irks me when people don't take a good look at what they believe and why they believe it.

    Also, evolution doesn't have to be all wrong or all right. There's a lot about evolution that I believe because there is evidence and it makes sense, but there are aspects I'm skeptical about because I haven't seen enough evidence or the evidence is contradictory.

    It also irks me when people assume you have to believe one or the other, but can't believe in both. Evolution doens't preclude the possibility of a Creator (or it shouldn't anyway), and vice versa.

    In a battle between evolution or creation I would have to be on both sides, or neither.

    Just my little rant for the day :)
  20. Fat_Fett Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 24, 2001
    star 4
    The main point is:

    Evolution IS STILL just a THEORY. It is not a fact, so it is not proven true.

    The same goes for Creationism.

    It may have evidence, but it is still a theory, not an automatic truth.

    I won't argue in a thread such as this simply because it is just pitting one person's theory against another person's theory. Neither person can EVER be proven 100% correct, so debate is senseless.

    I'm sure other people have the same idea and will also opt to just spare the cartiledge in their fingers rather than rant on about a belief of theirs than CANNOT be proven 100% fact/true.
  21. jediguy Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 10, 2000
    star 5
    I would like to see that 'evidence' for Creationism, if I may.
  22. Fat_Fett Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 24, 2001
    star 4
    No need to post evidence that will instantly be called false because it isn't evolution.

    No need for evolutionists to post evidence that will instantly be called false because it isn't creation.

    Visit the other threads in the archives to see how these discussions got.....including some comments by myself, but mostly from DarthSnowdog.

    I advise anyone reading this to just save their energy and not post on this subject because no one is going to change their minds on their own thoughts if neither side can be proven 100% true.

    Then again, you can just ask yourself: "Why do I even post on these subjects on a Star Wars website? The chance that anyone else who is not a Star Wars fan who has a question about this subject coming to this site is already extremely low, let alone the chance of someone without a formed opinion reading anything on these boards."

    Sorry for being pessimistic, but I don't see why I should post ideas about real life topics on a board designed for Star Wars fans. Besides, it just makes everyone mad.

    Star Wars is fun.

    Don't post on a Star Wars site if it's just going to pi$$ people off. Star Wars is supposed to make other people feel good.

    Find an actual person to talk to face to face about these subjects - it's much more rewarding. ;)



    If I'm going to spend my time on a Star Wars site, I might as well talk about Star Wars.

    To the Miscallaneous boards, Robin! :D
  23. jediguy Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 10, 2000
    star 5
    No word games, please. I promise I won't discard this 'evidence' just because I'm an evolutionist. You said that there is evidence for creationism, and I would like to see it.

  24. Goldberry Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2001
    star 4
    I was using the words of the Catholic church there - if you want to object to the use of the word "fact" take it up with them. Furthermore, I'm perfectly aware that evolution is a theory, just as gravity is a theory. The point is that science is not just about things that we observe - science doesn't work without things that we don't observe. I believe in the backside of every object I've ever seen, I believe in the existence of my parents before I was ever born, but these are not things which I have directly observed. Ever since Hume (and Kant) we've known that most of what we believe in is never observed. Insisting on observation to completely confirm all of our beliefs is a recipe for futile skepticism, not science or common-sense.

    We _test_ theories by finding predictions that can be checked against observation. So much of what we observe in biology (our classification scheme, the fossil record, the protein & genetic similarities and differences between various species, etc.,etc.) makes sense only in the light of evolution (and fits the strong predictions evolutionary theory makes about these facts) that evolution is no more in doubt than gravity or electromagnetism.

    But you're even wrong about speciation being observed. It has been, many times. Check out the observed instances of speciation FAQ on talkorigins.org.
  25. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    Maybe you could point me to the words of the Catholic Church that says it acknowledges it as fact.
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