Resource Fanfic Writer's Desk: Your Place for Writing Discussion, Questions, and Advice

Discussion in 'Fan Fiction and Writing Resource' started by Luna_Nightshade, Nov 24, 2011.

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  1. divapilot Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 30, 2005
    star 4
    Quick off-topic question. Did Bail Organa know who Leia's father was when he adopted her? If not then, when did he find out? Did he ever find out? If he did, was it that he learned Leia's father was Anakin, and that Anakin had become Vader?
    Snocone likes this.
  2. whiskers Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2005
    star 4

    Don't know about Disney's canon, but in Legends (specifically Last of the Jedi: Master of Deception) says that he does know. Probably ever since her birth.
  3. Cowgirl Jedi 1701 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 21, 2016
    star 4
    In one Star Wars book I read (I think it was The Rise of Darth Vader, but I'm not completely sure), Bail Organa figured out Vader was Anakin all by himself.
    Briannakin likes this.
  4. divapilot Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 30, 2005
    star 4
  5. Briannakin Grand Moff Darth Fanfic & Costuming/Props Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Feb 25, 2010
    star 5
    Yes, it's been awhile since I've read Rise of Darth Vader but, if memory serves me correct, Bail always knew Leia's father was Anakin, but figures it out Anakin still lives via Vader because he knew Anakin had taken on that name.

    I can look it up if you need exact details.
    Last edited by Briannakin, Jul 14, 2017
  6. divapilot Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 30, 2005
    star 4
    Thank you, I'm good. I wound up simply alluding to it rather than stating it flat out.
  7. Mistress_Renata Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2000
    star 4
    Obi-Wan guessed when he talked to Padme before he confronted Anakin, and of course he saw Bail when they were discussing what to do with the kids; so I think you're safe to assume that Bail knew.

    When I type it out that way, it sounds like Days of Our Lives...
    Last edited by Mistress_Renata, Jul 15, 2017
  8. Cowgirl Jedi 1701 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 21, 2016
    star 4

    Now that's a plot bunny.....
  9. FireKeeper Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2017
    star 1
    Is there any possibility of some other members of Luke's Jedi Order surviving Kylo Ren's massacre? I don't like Luke and my OC being the sole survivors of it, I think it is kinda unrealistic.

    The way I see it, there should have been other high ranking individuals in the Order than Luke( some might have joined the Order as adults and became Masters by the time it was destroyed, there is no way the Empire could have found absolutely everyone in the galaxy during it's rule and did whatever they did to untrained Force sensitives at that time). Surely some experienced ones could have managed to escape if they realised they couldn't win, or were just away on missions, like my OC was. That doesn't rule out the Knights of Ren hunting them down later, but there's no way of making sure absolutely everyone was at the temple during the time of the attack.

    Second, the very idea of Kylo killing everyone by himself without anyone else is borderline impossible. Even the most prodgious and experienced Force users can be overwhelmed by sheer numbers. Palpatine took down 3 Jedi at once, but was almost defeated by Windu by the time Anakin came, and he was a Sith Lord with decades of experience. The only way I see someone fighting multiple Jedi in great numbers is achieving Emperor Vitiate( SWTOR antagonist, can devour all life on entire planets) level of power, which Kylo obviously hasn't done. In fact, judging from his failures, I don't see him close even towards TPM Obi-Wan level of power. That's why I think there should have been at least a few other capable Force sensitives with him, as well as some troops under their command, possibly even some ships in case an aerial strike is needed( I doubt it is a good idea to do this, though, could always hit one of their own with these).

    I don't know exactly how many Jedi were there at the time, since I suspect the new Jedi Order was much smaller than the old one( there should have been some hunt going on in the Empire when it came to Force sensitive, haven't seen Rebels though, so don't know for sure), still, I suspect there were at least a hundred people at the time( don't know the exact numbers of their population before and after the Purge though). If the flashback in TFA is annything to go by, there were some other Force users alonside Kylo, no signs of any troops, ships or droids at their disposal. If he was commanding them, he most likely was the strongest of them, which means even together they weren't that powerful. However, staying together would have given them a tactical advantage, and in case they played smart, they could have just taken down the Jedi by fighting them one by one, or in smaller groups, overwhelming them with their numbers. However, with so many Force sensitives grouped up, someone must have sensed them and at least tried to do something.

    The aforementioned points make me think that there could have been survivors of Kylo Ren's attack. Whether they were hunted down later or are alive to the present day is a whole another discussion. But the point is, they couldn't have killed just everyone at once. Even during the Order 66 some of the Jedi survived( in the old canon, at least), and during Order 66, Palpatine had much more resources at his disposal than the First Order. By all means, Order 66 should have been more severe than whatever Kylo did. And if even after that there were survivors, surely there must be some after Kylo's attack.

    What do you think?
    Last edited by FireKeeper, Jul 18, 2017 at 5:15 AM
  10. Anedon Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2016
    star 4
    I guess its absolutley possible for survivors of the massacre to exsist somewere. Of course we only have very little information about it right now, for example how large Lukes new order was or how it was structured. Maybe it was still fairly small depending on Lukes training methods. It seems the Jedi are kinda a myth at the time of TFA so I guess Lukes order didn't have much of an impact on the wider galaxy.

    Though I don't think Kylo was alone it seemed that other Knights of Ren fought with him, maybe they were traiterous Jedi as well. And maybe they had soldiers with them too.
    But I don't see why there can't be a few survivors as you said both in Ledgends and Canon there are several more order 66 survivors than just Obi Wan and Yoda. In fact in Ledgends more named Jedi survived than died.

    So yeah there are probably survivors and you could use in your fanfic. There can be plenty of explanations why they aren't with the Resistance in TFA, maybe they are on a mission from Luke, maybe they are recovering from the betrayal, or maybe some of them have been captured and so on.
    Gamiel likes this.
  11. Gamiel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2012
    star 6
    Do we know of any species or culture that have been described as boring/dull/similar?
    Last edited by Gamiel, Jul 18, 2017 at 6:14 AM
  12. DARTH_MU Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 9, 2005
    star 4
    In my fic, I just used a couple of kids and their Masters barely escaping while they were unexpectedly attacked by the KOR.
    I've got Tenel Ka 2.0 with Kyp 2.0 as one group, Jysella Horn and Corran Horn as one group. Gantoris 2.0 survived the attack and told Luke it was Ben Solo, and died of his wounds. Luke's wife, whose identity is undetermined at this time, is knocked out and kidnapped by KOR. The KOR itself is Luke's students.

    .......................

    Disney canon version.

    I have no idea. But Rey survived. In the Novelization of the TFA, apparently Kylo Ren says to Ren, it is you. So they met? At the academy? as kids before the academy?

    In the Force vision, things were burning, the sky was red, and Rey was standing there (in place of some adult in the real version?). Maybe 6 or some masked figures stood beside a single figure with a red lightsaber (Kylo?). So that was the end of the massacre.

    Where did those 7 or so boys and girls came from? It is inconceivable that the KOR, or whatever organization these 7 belonged, they did ot suffer any casualties. So there were more of them. Where did they come from?

    If there were survivors. those survivors would have been hunted down and maybe killed or coerced into join the KOR. It's the logical thing.

    However, if they came up and joined Luke after running, and Luke told them something like "It's time the Jedi ended.... Then
    What do people think? Would they listen to Luke and disband?
    Last edited by DARTH_MU, Jul 18, 2017 at 5:44 AM
  13. FireKeeper Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2017
    star 1

    I assume you are replying to my question, so I'll reply back. In my fic, Rey wasn't in the Academy, so she doesn't count. And Luke would never say something like that in my fanfic. Ugh, that novelisation brings even more messy details that I dislike. I guess I'll just go with my headcanons then.
    brodiew and DARTH_MU like this.
  14. FireKeeper Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2017
    star 1
    Sorry about the double post, but I have another question.

    I want the new Master of Ren villainess to pursue my characters to Ahch-To. She knows Luke, Rey and my OC are there because of a First Order spy within the Resistance. Unlike Kylo though, she is not dumb. She wouldn't make an orbital bombardment of the planet because she wants Luke alive, and while she is confident in her abilities, she doesn't underestimate her enemies( especially if it's the former Grand Master and one of the Masters closest to him). That's why she decides to take 8 Knights of Ren and a legion of Stormtroopers with her to gain an advantage. Even with their presence noticeable in the Force, the KOR have a huge advantage. Meanwhile, our heroes are busy exploring the first Jedi Temple and digging up ancient artifacts. The Temple is confined space, so not many directions to run, amd even with multiple exits, those can be covered. I am thinking of an elegant way of allowing the heroes escape without making the bad gal look like an idiot or a weakling( I made it a point to make her smarter and more badass than Kylo when developing her).

    One variation is to make a secret exit that can be opened from the inside, so that while the KOR are busy covering the known exits and searching the inside, they can slip past. However, there are several problems:

    The new Master of Ren still senses them and follows them, and she won't be alone. If Luke, Rey and Ari are fast enough though, they might just run to the ship in time. The problems don't end there, though, since there is also a Star Destroyer, as well as several other ships, orbiting the planet, so our team is up for a joyride not unlike the one in Luke's youth.

    The second idea is that, one of them goes to hold back the pursuing KOR, and gets captured in process, which leads to the KOR taking them to their headquarters. But there is a number of problems with this.

    First, whoever throws themself at the KOR and manages to 1v9 them long enough for the others to escape, starts to seem very OP( especially prevalent in the cases of Rey, who isn't trained, and Ari, who is an OC, and therefore must not be a Mary Sue). Also, either Luke or Rey getting captured is redundant( in Luke's case because he disappears once again after just being found, in Rey's case because she was already was kidnapped by Kylo in TFA).

    Second, because the rescue mission that needs to be performed in this case( I am not ready to kill any of these characters yet) is a lot longer and riskier than having to 1v9 KOR. Not only will it take time to find out the location of the KOR headquarters, it will also involve getting into a stronghold that is crawling with KOR with little to no knowledge of the layout. Even if the escaped ones manage to assemble a rescue team, or even an army, by the time they do it the captured one may just die from the torture inflicted on them( since I imagine that a trained Force user's mind is much harder to invade than the one of an untrained or a non-Force sensitive, they may resort to physical torture as a backup plan).

    Any ideas on how should I have my charas escape?
  15. Chyntuck Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 11, 2014
    star 5
    @FireKeeper They have Artoo and Chewie with them on the island, right? So they can arrange a pickup at a specific point. Also, they can lure as many as possible of the KOR to follow them inside the temple, then cause a lot of mayhem (e.g. cut through columns with their lightsabers to cause galleries to cave in) in order to trap them -- thus fewer enemies to confront when they come outside. Or somehow summon a flock of birds/a herd of cattle/a swarm of insects to keep the KOR at bay. Or jump in the sea but land on a boulder that's hidden from view, cloak their Force presence (Findswoman has a cool fanon Force ability for that, described here) and make their way to the ship. Or use your OC's ability for premonition to be prepared when the KOR come. Or all of the above :)
    DARTH_MU likes this.
  16. DARTH_MU Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 9, 2005
    star 4
    @FireKeeper

    I would like to know a bit more about your headcanon.

    Where did the KOR come from?

    What is your villain's back story?

    Who is Snoke for you?


    Did you already have these KORs on planet? ie How much of this fic have you written?

    If you have not started writing, what if your villain pretends to have escaped the horrible KOR, bringing some 8 or so fellow escapees. Telling Luke that a legion of Stormtroopers are on their way to get them back. Gaining Luke's and co's trust, once they get in, they start the carnage?

    If we assume you have the KOR already on planet, blocking every exit, then

    Your first idea:
    Is it possible to cram the three of them inside the KOR's shuttlecraft? They don't go to their own ship, but take over the KOR's relatively empty ship, and make a run for it, having advanced jamming technology, your villain would not be able to order capture of said shuttle, and the FO doesn't consider their own shuttle to be taken over....

    Your second idea:
    If anyone can 1 vs 9, It would have to be Luke. Maybe Rey and Ari can tell everyone after they escape that yes, indeed they did find Luke, but then nobody believes them. Luke, if captured, would have to be brought to Snoke (or your villain try anyway). Ari and Rey can go after him themselves (in another fic? In this fic where someone who believes them are brought along? This guy/girl can be the spy, your decision. Then Luke escapes by himself.
  17. FireKeeper Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 2017
    star 1
    I have headcanons, but these aren't the final versions yet. Anything is up to change if I find plot bunnies/ ideas that I like more than the current ones.

    In my headcanon, the original Snoke was either Vader's or Palpatine's secret apprentice( I am leaning towards Palpatine now, because I don't want to pull the same card used in the Force Unleashed, besides, from some scans I've seen of the Vader comic, Vader was beginning to plot against Palpatine in the last years of his life, would make sense for Palpie to suspect this and look for a replacement) who managed to escape with the Imperial remnants. His search of the new resources, however, lead him to an ancient holocron that housed a Sith entity, whose knowledge greatly helped him form and stabilize the First Order. However, the more he used the holocron, the more he fell under the entity's influence, which ended with the entity taking over his body( something akin to Vitiate in SWTOR) and the coming of Snoke as we know him( in the later text the Sith entity that took over Snoke will be referred as just Snoke for the sake of convenience, because the original Snoke's mind is destroyed). The disfigured body is because of the heavy Dark Side corruption.

    I know that this version of Snoke looks a lot like Emperor Vitiate, and I know that taking inspiration from him is not very original, just I kind of supported the "Snoke is Vitiate" theory for a short period of time, and besides from Knights of the Fallen Empire and on a lot of things in SWTOR's story I would have liked to have been handled differently. So I thought, Snoke is so mysterious anyway, a perfect opportunity to write a story with a cosmic horror villain as I saw it, and made Snoke something similar to Vitiate. I am thinking currently about how he rose to power though. One of the ideas is that the disbalance of Light and Dark was what allowed him to rise in the first place, with the Force trying to balance itself out, which puts up such questions as whether, it is right to follow Light or Dark, or whether following the will of the Force and the natural course of things is truly the best thing to everyone. I kinda have mixed feelings about this idea, so I doubt it will be included.

    Which leads us to the formation of the Knights of Ren. They were formed by Snoke shortly after the takeover, with the Master answering directly to Snoke, while the Knights answered to the Master. There was indeed a Master of Ren before Kylo. However, he was killed shortly before Kylo took over( either because he tried to betray Snoke or just because Snoke was so intrigued by the Skywalker-Solo family he was ready to sacrifice one of his servants just to work with one of them personally, and since that one is already troubled, turning him would be a piece of cake).

    As for the villain. She was a war orphan surviving on the streets of the First Order controlled planet, trying to use the Force. This lead to her being noticed by KOR. She considered Kylo unworthy of leading the KOR and planned to kill him, however Nyros rid her of such joy. She was chosen to replace him, but her ambition doesn't end here, and she wants to overthrow Snoke himself, although she understands she knows too little about him and isn't influential enough to strike yet( she doesn't know about him being an undead cosmic entity though). Personality wise, she is a complete opposite of Kylo: pragmatic, cautious, manipulative, seemingly cold and keeping her anger under control. She has a clear vision for the First Order: to create a society where law is absolute, the strongest( mentally or physically) survive, and aliens are face less prejudice( I decided to make the FO racist towards aliens like the Old Republic era Empire, or at least most of the military, might as well explain why there are no aliens among them in TFA). She thinks that Snoke's rule is not always the most rational, not knowing that Snoke is following a goal other than returning to the "glorious old days of the Empire". While she is cruel and punishes Imperial officers just as Vader did, she may show mercy whenever she sees personal gain in it, and she doesn't rage and wreck tech whenever her plan fails like Kylo did( Did that idiot even think that he might have hit life support systems or something serious? Then his emoness would cost him both his life and the lives of everyone aboard the ship).

    Actually, that is an interesting suggestion. But I am not sure thether she wouldn't previously get noticed. In my fanfic, while the Rep fleet was regrouping, and the new senators were being put instead of the deceased ones after the destruction of Hosnian Prime( I figured it would be more realistic that every planet had representatives so it would actually bepossible to replace the Senators rather tham the Republic just ceasing to exist), FO used the chaos to attack and conquer a few more planets. Since she did lead troops into battle, and doesn't wear a helmet( she's a twi'lek, lekku don't allow that XD), and Nyros followed the holonet news, she could have recognized her face. Plus, even if she wouldn't have followed them, she would be suspicious( because she is always suspicious towards strangers.

    As forthe first idea, there are R2 and 0-1-0 on Nyros' ship. Droids' memory could be sliced and viewed, giving the FO even more knowledge of the Republic and the Resistance. Not wise to leave the droids to the KOR.

    P. S. Force, what a long post... I am sorry for forcing anyone to read this.
    Last edited by FireKeeper, Jul 18, 2017 at 1:10 PM
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  18. Snocone Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Sep 14, 2015
    star 1
    Most definitely the people of Khomm are who you're looking for. "Boring/dull/similar" are the exact words to describe them. Dorsk 81 is the only famous person from that planet because of a glitch in his genetics (i.e. the Force).
    Gamiel and Tarsier like this.
  19. Chyntuck Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 11, 2014
    star 5
    Okay, I need two planets as homeworlds for two new OCs I'm creating.

    There should be something about the people of the first planet being a bit arrogant and stubborn.

    There should be something about the people of the second planet being proud and cultured.

    Both OCs are human.

    Any suggestions of existing planets? Or should I just make them up?
  20. DARTH_MU Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 9, 2005
    star 4
    Corellia and Jelucan(especially second wavers) in the new Canon

    Corellia and Thyferra in the Legend EU?
  21. Findswoman Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 27, 2014
    star 4
    Naboo seems like it would fit well for "proud and cultured"; Alderaan, too, depending on the period in which the story takes place. As for "arrogant," the Wook entry for Chandrila describes their inhabitants as having a reputation for being "slightly haughty, pedantic, and interested in politics"; could that work perhaps? I wonder if the Kuat might work for that as well, given their powerful aristocracy.
  22. Chyntuck Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 11, 2014
    star 5
    Thanks both. I'm sorted out now :)
    Findswoman likes this.
  23. Gamiel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2012
    star 6
    What kind of interstellar organisations do people think should be represented in a sector? Beside trade houses and pirate clans
    Findswoman likes this.
  24. DARTH_MU Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 9, 2005
    star 4
    Restaurants and Retail?

    Post office?
    Findswoman and Gamiel like this.
  25. Sith-I-5 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 14, 2002
    star 6
    In a sector?

    EVERYTHING!
    Ewok Poet, Findswoman and Gamiel like this.
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