1. darthtuttle Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 2, 2004
    star 4
    What type of relationship do you think the protagonist will have with his or her father. It's hard to say because we don't know the gender or if it's Luke's child or if it's Han and Leia's child.
    If it's Han and Leia's child, he or she might feel pressure to follow Han's legacy to be an expert pilot but desire to follow the Skywalker heritage. Han might die, leaving him or her as an orphan.
    It could be Luke's offspring with some issues. Perhaps he or she will feel pressure to live up to the family name. Perhaps Luke would be an overprotective father who doesn't want his offspring to be a Jedi.
    Perhaps it's not an offspring of any of the big three and Luke starts training an orphaned hero. Personally I think Luke will have a daughter. So, what type of relationship do you think the protagonist will have with his or her father?
  2. Leias_Left_Bun Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2013
    star 2
    You're right; we don't know the gender or last name of the new protagonist. I've gone on record as saying that I think it will be a young man, but I could be wrong. In any event, the new lead almost has to be the biological child of either Luke, or Han and Leia. That's the only way to tie in his story with the overall Skywalker legacy, and it gives the audience an instant connection to the new character. So I think that leaves out training an unrelated orphan.

    There has to be some kind of internal tension or there's really no story, other than a simplistic tale of good guys vs. bad guys. So the child must have some issues either with the father, or with the destiny that the father is pushing him into.

    IMO, if the main protagonist is the son of Han and Leia, this is a rich area to create tension. This young man would have two father-figures, his bio-dad Han and his spiritual father Luke, and of course Leia as the mother. That ties him to all of the Big 3 characters, and it creates a natural tension between the two father-figures, who will be pulling him in different directions. Luke wants him to be Jedi, while Han does not.

    In any event, the relationship(s) between the new generation and the OT parent figures -- and the tensions of those relationships, along with the looming legacy of grandad Darth -- should play a major role in Episode 7.
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  3. Bazinga'd SWC/PT/ Spinoff Manager -Destroyer of Spam

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    Nov 1, 2012
    star 5
    I think that any tension between the protagonist and his or her mother/father is somewhat inconsistent to the the theme of redemption in the OT. Despite knowing his father was a galactic hooligan (a bit of an understatement-I just wanted to use hooligan in a sentence today), Luke always believed there was good in him. His goal was to redeem him and not to settle and father / son issues. If his case was to settle his childhood angst, Luke's conversation with Leia would have gone something like this:

    Luke: Even though I think there is good in him, I dont give a s@#$. That SOB left abandoned us, and I want to know why. :p
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  4. Leias_Left_Bun Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2013
    star 2
    I don't mean tension in terms of some major angst or falling-out between the child and the parent. But tension of a more subtle kind, where the parent is pushing the child in one direction, but the child has his own ideas about what he wants to do with his life. Children always do. The next generation has to find their own way and make their own mistakes. They cannot simply and easily follow in the footsteps of their elders.

    And I agree that redemption was the main theme of the OT, but this is a new trilogy that should have its own direction and its own theme.

    Hooligan is a great word.
  5. JaimePrater Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 15, 2002
    star 1
    Any offspring of Luke, Leia, or Han would have to plausibly be in his or her thirties at the very least.
  6. Rawne Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 2, 2008
    star 2
    Why?
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  7. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    :confused: What happened to Leia?
    Last edited by Count Yubnub, Feb 25, 2013
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  8. BountyHunter76 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 2, 2012
    It could be cool to see a father/ child setting with Luke where the 20-something year old protagonist respects his/her Jedi father, but has never yet seen him in action. Then the audience gets to experience through the kid's eyes what kind of power Luke can bring after all these years. In my humble hopes, I would love to see a wildly powerful display of veteran force power by Luke.

    It may sound boring to some people, but let Luke and his kid have a solid relationship. The tension can be when one is taken/ threatened/ or pit against a formidable foe.
  9. Bazinga'd SWC/PT/ Spinoff Manager -Destroyer of Spam

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    Nov 1, 2012
    star 5
    That makes more sense. In ANH, that is the tension that exists between Luke and Uncle Owen. Hopefully any such tension in the ST is resolved differently.
    Last edited by Bazinga'd, Feb 26, 2013
  10. Trebor Sabreon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 15, 2010
    star 4
    My favorite of the themes which comprise the very foundation of the Skywalker saga is "Fathers and Sons." As has been stated, we don't yet know the surname or gender of the new protagonist, but my single wish for the crop of new heroes that the ST will provide is for the continued exploration of this father/son theme, specifically in the shape of the relationship between 'Old Master' Luke and his protagonist son (for the sake of argument, I'll call him "Ben").

    As to the relationship between Luke and Ben? Well, as the OP suggests, "Perhaps he or she will feel pressure to live up to the family name." As the new protagonist in a Star Wars episodic feature, Ben would almost be assurred of undergoing the Hero's Journey we have all become so familiar with and I could see something along these lines taking the shape of the "Refusal of the Call." As was suggested in Darth Chiznuk's Monomyth discussion (http://boards.theforce.net/threads/joseph-campbell-the-monomyth-and-the-st.50009903/), I think we could see a multi-exploration of this pattern, where Ben begins his version of the journey as Luke completes his. For me, this would be a most welcome devolpment, indeed.

    We've witnessed the relationship of the absent father and the son in the PT and of course, the original films brought us Luke's complicated relationship with his father (ulitmately culminating in the redemption of Anakin), but what we've not yet witnessed is a healthy, supportive (even idealized) father/son dynamic come into play. This is fertile ground for exploration, I think.

    Regardless of how it is executed, though, as long as the tradition of the Skywalker father/son theme is upheld in the ST, I will be one happy little Jedi.
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  11. Fleab88 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 12, 2012
    star 3
    Because people are still demanding the EU remain in tact. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the EU and appreciate the entertainment it has given me over the years, but if a better story for this trilogy requires scratching it all out then I say give a very respectful thank you for the service. Then move on for a united storyline in all entertainment mediums. It really bothers me when people say there need to be X amount of children at X age because that is just how it has to be.
  12. DARTH_BELO Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 25, 2003
    star 4
    I just really hope that, whatever the nature of the relationship, that it's not just some cliché "rebellious son that has resentment towards his father/parents," and the two of them are estranged from each other for most of ep VII...that's been grossly overdone in films lately to cater to what seems to be unfortumately a growing thing with parents/children today.
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  13. Leias_Left_Bun Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2013
    star 2
    Yes, that's the kind of tension I was talking about. If Luke has a son who is force-gifted, and that son has been training since birth to be a Jedi and he adores Luke and is eager to learn everything that Luke teaches and to follow the life path Luke has chosen for him -- there is no tension or drama in that whatsoever.

    One of the first rules of dramatic storytelling is: conflict = drama.

    Yes, there will be bad guys in the story to provide some conflict, but if the ONLY conflict or tension in the story comes from the bad guys, that's dull.

    If Han and Leia are the parents of the main protagonist, I do think we'll see a similar end as what happened with Owen and Beru, e.g. death of at least one parent-figure. Maybe both. Hopefully they can have some sort of resolution first.
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  14. Leias_Left_Bun Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2013
    star 2
    Agreed about the EU and I don't think they will use it. It would be a dead weight, compromising Arndt's ability to tell us a new story about this extended family.

    Besides, the fans aren't in a position to "demand" anything with regard to the new trilogy.
  15. run_luke_run Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2004
    star 3
    Hmm.

    Interesting topic. Like others have said, the parent-child themes in Star Wars are what have pushed the story forward. Little exposure; I'm a therapist and a psych professor, so I may have a teeny tiny tendency (say that three times fast) to over-analyze this stuff, but isn't that why we're all here?

    If you've never looked it up, Wiki yourself "Attachment Theory"...it's always been one of my favorite theories in all of psychology, and it resonates all throughout life (there is childhood and adult attachment, which are two different things). In a nutshell, it's about how we act in close, meaningful relationships with regards to important relational issues such as security, anxiety, and emotional closeness/separateness. I actually use the films quite a bit in my classes to talk about these themes. :)

    Let me toss something out about this "orphan" idea...an angle I had not previously considered.

    Perhaps we could see some "prodigal son" theme emerge...meaning, there is jealousy that develops between a biological child and the "special" manner in which an adopted child is being treated. Now there is a ripe area for the dark side to grow and fester in.
    Last edited by run_luke_run, Feb 28, 2013
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  16. darthtuttle Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 2, 2004
    star 4
    I'll say that skywalker men tend to be rather impulsive. Luke's child might show an avoident attachment pattern. I wonder if instead of an adopted child, Luke will spend time training the Solo kids. I could see Luke wanting to protect his child from the dangers and dark side tendencies.
  17. Darth Claire Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 21, 2012
    star 4
    I can definitly see there being a lot of tension between Luke and his child because that poor kid is probably has to deal with these:
    1. Insanely overprotective parents. I can definitly see them being protective of this child because he/she will probably be a target for kidnapping, assasination, coercion to the dark side and blackmail cause of his last name and what his parents did
    2. People either having high expectations or high fears of you. I can see people either expecting you to become a powerful jedi and the next savior of the galaxy....or the next Darth Vader
    3. Huge responsibility to be able to take control of the Jedi order after Luke is gone
    ect ect ect
    Must suck to be a Skywalker.
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  18. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    Well, that's odd. So am I (not a therapist though); and I use the films in class in the same way, to teach attachment theory.
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  19. run_luke_run Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2004
    star 3
    Great minds think alike! :D It's just a perfect framework for everything the theory discusses.

    Here's a sample of how this works. I'm not sure if it offers any clues as to what would happen in the ST, but it provides excellent ideas of what could come to pass from my perspective.

    Attachment Theory is all about our close, intimate relationships. In childhood, it's concerned with the relationship a child develops with his/her primary caregiver (PC). It's critical to our physical and mental health that we develop a secure attachment, and most of us do. Simply put, that means we develop a reciprocal relationship with a PC that is based on security (from which to explore the world), trust, warmth, and emotional responsiveness. It's our "base" from which we branch out and form social networks and eventually intimate relationships with a partner, which is known as "adult attachment".

    It's well documented that children can develop "attachment injuries", which typically result from some trauma, death, loss, separation, etc. (there is even a clinical diagnosis known as Reactive Attachment Disorder). I would assume that up until the Jedi arrived, Anakin had a secure attachment with Shmi...but his removal from her (regardless of it being mutual) resulted in an attachment injury...namely, a deep-rooted fear of loss and a looming sense of insecurity with parental figures. Of course to make matters worse, when she died in his arms an intense attachment response was ignited, and resulted in Anakin becoming what is known as a "Preoccupied" attachment style as an adult. This means he has high anxiety combined with low avoidance in relationships...hence, he's insecure, quick to anger and jealousy, but all these secondary emotions are rooted in fear.

    Yoda was right. Anakin was too old, from an attachment point of view. Much, much safer to remove a child before attachment is solid and stable with a parental figure, which is pretty much cemented by age 2. Assuming, of course, that the Jedi did provide some sort of parental figures for the children. Too late for Anakin, though...and the Jedi should have had a child psychologist on staff. :)

    Hence, the wisdom of Yoda. Fear -> Anger -> Hate.

    That's attachment theory...and apparently old Jedi wisdom as well. I've actually always been curious as to whether George ever read any material with regards to attachment, because it's such a good fit.

    I could go on with Luke, but I don't want to put anyone to sleep. :)
    Last edited by run_luke_run, Feb 28, 2013
  20. Trebor Sabreon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 15, 2010
    star 4
    I wish that you would, with special attention to Luke's childhood CP (the Lars'), how Obi-Wan may have played a role in this (if there's enough info to go on. We'll surely learn more with this year's publication of John Jackson Miller's Kenobi.) and of course, the role of Anakin (first when Luke thought his father was dead and later, after the revelation.). And finally, if you had any other theories on the way in which all this may play out concerning Luke's abilities as a father himself and any relationship with a potential son/daughter.
    run_luke_run likes this.
  21. run_luke_run Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2004
    star 3
    Well OK then....more to come tomorrow. :)
  22. LANDO_ROCKS Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2002
    star 4
    A good twist on the "I am your father!" thing would be an "I am your daughter!" moment.

    Basically something like Han & Leia have two children, twins. Leia and the daughter go on some sort of diplomatic mission and the ship they are travelling in goes missing, wreckage is found and no survivors. Years pass, maybe 20 years.

    Han and his son carry on, but Han is now broken. He's a bit of a drunk and his son is embarrassed by him - possibly goes to live with Uncle Luke?

    Luke trains Han's son as a Jedi, they get pulled into the action somehow and the mysterious new Sith is none-other than the missing daughter! It turns out that she was brought to the darkside after being captured when the ship was boarded.
    Last edited by LANDO_ROCKS, Feb 28, 2013
  23. DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2002
    star 4
    I want to see their kids — plural. As many as possible. It would make this new trilogy interesting knowing Luke had some, too.
  24. Vastor Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    star 2
    Latest rumor has it Luke have a Jedu daughter so we will see, but i sure hope Ben is there aswell from the EU.
  25. MillionthVoice Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2013
    star 1
    One angle that could be fun would be to have a brother and sister SkySolo where one is Force-sensitive and the other isn't. And the non-sensitive one could be the one through whose eyes we saw the story. It could be spiced up with the Force-sensitive one being the sister, so we get a funny protective/strong dynamic to play with. For laughs, not politics.
    Last edited by MillionthVoice, Mar 1, 2013