Senate Fiscal Cliff Doomsday Countdown Thread

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by Jabbadabbado, Nov 8, 2012.

  1. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    But that's not the theme of Derpy's rant. He presents nothing but the usual laundry list of Fox News talking points. For example, no mention is made whatsoever of Iraq or Afghanistan - probably because those expenditures can't be blamed on Democrats. And in the end it all comes down to "why would anyone vote for Obama?" This is a far cry from "both sides are equally unrealistic" or "both sides suck".

    Uh, no. Perhaps I should have said "only the extremely affluent aren't facing bankruptcy in the event that they get sick"?

    Well, that's nice. Guess what? In the real world, single-payer isn't going to happen. Thus we are faced with the choice between a so-called "lousy, ramshackle plan" and doing absolutely nothing at all about the problem.

    Access to health care is not "crap". In fact, in every other advanced country in the entire world, it's considered a right. America stands alone. Gotta love rugged individualism, right?

    Well, yes, and that's the point. Barack Obama is indeed not serious about the all-important task of kicking the **** out of the lower and middle classes. That's why teabaggers don't find him acceptable. He's looking out for the 99%, not the 1%.

    Yeah, just keep telling yourself that. You're not fooling anyone. Telling uninsured people with cancer to go **** themselves can hardly be called a position of moral superiority. Republicans are all about protecting the rich from higher taxes. Despite their rhetoric they care about nothing else. They've proven at every turn that they'd rather crash the economy than see their backers pay even slightly higher tax rates. But feel free to continue living under a delusion, or trying to delude others, or whatever it is you're doing.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Dec 29, 2012
  2. Vaderize03 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 1999
    star 5
    Three possible outcomes looming:

    1) Last minute mini-deal, followed by an immediate opening of negotiations on a larger one after the new Congress convenes later this week.

    2) No deal, taxes go up, and the new Congress and the President strike a deal within the next two calendar weeks; this option gives Republicans 'political cover' in the sense that they can now claim they are voting to cut taxes

    3) No deal, and we stay off the cliff as both sides dig in, with a market crash and recession.

    I put the odds of each outcome as 20% for #1, 70% for #2, and 10% for #3. Apparently, the Democrats are willing to consider a higher threshold on increasing rates OR a looser estate tax, but not both. Republicans remain opposed to any tax hikes without deep spending cuts.

    How the markets will react are anybody's guess. I expect a drop with anything less than a grand bargain.

    Peace,

    V-03
    Last edited by Vaderize03, Dec 30, 2012
  3. Fire_Ice_Death Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 15, 2001
    star 7
    I feel Arawn is arguing with the wind at this point.
  4. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
    Lindsey Graham is saying the President won on taxes.

    We'll see about the rest, I suppose.
  5. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
  6. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    I don't understand why the President is bothering to deal at all, rather than waiting until January 1st. He gets everything he wants and Republicans lose every bit of leverage they have at the stroke of midnight on January 1.

    Republicans should be thankful that the President doesn't run the office the way he ran his two campaigns, particularly the second one. If he did, there would be no dealing until after the beginning of the new year, excluding remarkable concessions that the GOP would never make.
    Last edited by KnightWriter, Dec 31, 2012
    Blithe likes this.
  7. Vaderize03 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 1999
    star 5
    I think a bigger problem here is that the election has already been forgotten, and the tone has been set for 2013, and possibly the rest of Obama's second term, as well.

    The Tea Party faction has made it clear that they will not allow anything meaningful to be accomplished with Obama in the White House if there's even the slightest chance he will benefit from it; as such, his entire second-term agenda may already be scuttled.

    It's amazing how the calculus can still be "If we block everything, refuse to compromise, and blame the President and Democrats, eventually, the country will collectively wake-up, slap themselves on the forehead, say 'Wow, you guys were right all along!', and vote in Tea-Party supermajorities at all levels of government".

    If the election didn't change that, I fear nothing short of a major catastrophe, such as a default, will. Already, talk of the President's agenda on discussing gun control are on the ropes, as well as immigration.

    The most conservative Republicans in the House and Senate represent districts that overwhelmingly voted for Romney, and are so insular they don't seem to care about anything outside of their own little world...certainly not the rest of the country.

    It's a shame. Happy New Year to all.

    Peace,

    V-03
    Last edited by Vaderize03, Dec 31, 2012
  8. LAJ_FETT Tech Admin and Collecting/Games Mod

    Administrator
    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 9
    CNBC said Obama is going to speak about the fiscal cliff at 1:30 ET - about 25 minutes from now.
  9. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    This deal sounds bad. We should go over and start negotiations again next Monday.



    EDIT:

    Perhaps I spoke too soon.

    Obama blamed Congress for being obstructive (*gasp*), and House Republicans are so shocked and insulted that they're thinking about... obstructing the deal.

    Which is fine by me. Better to wait a few days for a better deal.
    Last edited by Summer Dreamer, Dec 31, 2012
    Jedi Merkurian and KnightWriter like this.
  10. VadersLaMent Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 3, 2002
    star 9
    Breaking news, no house vote tonight.

    LOL DERP BALAH BLAH. Why do people take this? Vote out the GOP from the Gov. Get them out.
  11. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
    Well, um....damn.

    I guess this means we're going over the cliff?
  12. Ramza JC Head Admin and RPF Manager

    Administrator
    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2008
    star 7
    Of course we are - Boehner hasn't been reelected as Speaker yet, and a compromise now would basically doom his prospects. And, well, that's all he cares about, because he's a politician.
    Last edited by Ramza, Dec 31, 2012
    Arawn_Fenn likes this.
  13. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
  14. KnightWriter Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2001
    star 8
    Everyone get your oars ready.
  15. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
    No, I will not post a picture of Sam Jackson about to turn the breakers off from Jurassic Park no matter how tempting it is to do so. :p
  16. Vaderize03 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 1999
    star 5
    I guess I shouldn't have sold off my puts on the Dow this morning.

    I would have made a much larger profit if I had held them through at least Wednesday.

    So who thinks we get a deal by next Monday?

    As an aside, the CEO of the largest private cardiology pratice in the northern virginia area issued a statement that if we go over the cliff without fixing the SGR cuts, as of January 1st, they will no longer accept any new Medicare patients.

    Maybe this is what it will take to get something done? Real pain?

    Peace,

    V-03
    Last edited by Vaderize03, Dec 31, 2012
  17. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
    Maybe this is what it will take to get something done? Real pain?

    Always thought that was the point of the entire sequestration process, myself.
  18. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    There will be something done (like on taxes for the middle class, the "doc fix," etc.) by Innauguration Day.

    It won't be a fiscal cliff, a fiscal curb, or a fiscal slope... it will be a fiscal bungee jump!

    [IMG]
    Last edited by Summer Dreamer, Dec 31, 2012
  19. darthcaedus1138 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2007
    star 5
  20. VadersLaMent Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 3, 2002
    star 9
    They gave themselves a raise, then sat back and let taxes go up on the rest of us.
  21. Vaderize03 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 1999
    star 5
    Supposedly, the deal is done, except for $24 billion in spending cuts. The vote won't be before tomorrow, probably to allow taxes to "technically" go up, after which Republicans can claim they cut them, at least for the middle class.

    The thresholds for income, dividends, and capital gains are higher than I was expecting the democrats to go for, which surprises me. Apparently, Senate liberals are furious with what Obama is agreeing to.

    I wonder if they won't bother to even pass the deal?

    Peace,

    V-03
  22. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    That news was so last hour, man :p

    It's what I posted about, before I edited in that House Republicans won't be voting at all tonight.

    We're going over... and we'll be just fine. A little panic will spur action. Any damage will be fixed.
    KnightWriter likes this.
  23. Ramza JC Head Admin and RPF Manager

    Administrator
    Member Since:
    Jul 13, 2008
    star 7
    Alternatively, time to start hoarding gasoline and bad leather punk fashions.

    [IMG]

    Be still, my dog of finance. I understand your pain! We've all lost a bargaining chip we love. But we do it my way!
  24. Juliet316 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 27, 2005
    star 8
    I hope Congress burns in hell for starving the American People.
  25. The Loyal Imperial Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 19, 2007
    star 6
    That seems rather excessive, seeing as we're not even over the cliff yet.