Lit Fleet Junkie Flagship- The technical discussions of the GFFA (Capital Ships thread Mk. II)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by AdmiralWesJanson, Sep 12, 2005.

  1. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5

    ImpStar are said to use a lot of test bed technology (sensors, weapons and reactors are afaik among the things mentioned) and modular assembly line production, which is said not to be that common before them at such a scale and mentioned as one reasons that the Empire can actually build that many.




    Sure but they still keep innovation and making things more efficient, otherwise they would still be churning out the same ships they did 25000 years ago, which is clearly not the case.



    One should assume, but the thing that keeps being brought up is that that warships are horrendously expensive, in all areas, from designing, to building and also in maintenance. It’s also said to be pretty much the main limiting factor in Imperial military expansion, because they can easily always recruit more people, but are apparently severely limited in ship building (Imperial Sourcebook), especially with materials flowing into the building of the Death Star.

    There must be factors limiting it we just have not been told about them specifically, one thing that is brought up quite often though is that they require very specific raw materials that are very rare, which would also explain how they keep having to mine ever remoter planets.

    It sort of does, as the Dark Empire sourcebook explains, the shield will dampen the Superlaser effect, but part of it will still pass through.

    The Eclipse also has “conventional” weapons, plus those fun gravity well projectors :D , which I always wondered about not showing up on the Executor. Though I fully trust Lira to have rushed the design so badly that they couldn’t make it work because of messed up wiring or interference fields.
  2. Tim Battershell Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 4
    Do you think the Eclipse (always think of Candleshoe when I hear that name applied to a ship) was a sort-of ancestor to the Anakin Solo?
  3. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5
    Vader the Seconds flagship? Wasn’t she just an updated ImpStar with gravity well projectors like the Mon Mothma had during the Vong war?
  4. Tim Battershell Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 4
    And long-range turbolasers! (4 of)!
  5. MercenaryAce Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 10, 2005
    star 5
    When it comes to ship building, it is worth remembering the sheer number of stories about saving "the only planet in the galaxy that is the source of this thing that we absolutely need to build ships with."
    Valin__Kenobi and Gorefiend like this.
  6. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    How long is long? The illustration of the Anakin Solo bombarding Kashyyyk, in Warfare, makes it look awfully close to the planet.
  7. Tzizvvt78 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 12, 2009
    star 4
    The Invincible-class was a larger vessel designed before the ISD in-universe and that design first appeared in a book prior to the Executor's movie debut. ;)

    But ship designs jumping from a corvette to a cruiser in the first film is not as understandable and that's why everyone is ok with there being plenty of designs in between? :p

    Hey, if Brian Daley, David Michelinie, Walt Simonson, William C. Dietz, John Jackson Miller and Dave Filoni constitute people who do retcons of this nature in SW, (outside of the usual suspects), I'm game. :cool:
    Last edited by Tzizvvt78, Nov 21, 2012
  8. darthscott3457 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 25, 2007
    star 3
    Fair enough, agree to disagree, but no explanation will ever be good enough for me :), Other sci-fi verses will fulfill my need for frequent massive naval fleet actions

    Have a Happy Thanksgiving and the same for everyone else on the board
  9. blackmyron Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 29, 2005
    star 5
    The NR did get a lot of mileage out of their Executors, though, which seems somewhat ironic.

    The top Imperial officers that were bothered by the Exes and other super ships (which seem to include Pellaeon, and implied to have Thrawn included as well) seem to be proven correct in the end.
  10. darthscott3457 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 25, 2007
    star 3
    Or just that the authors pen is far mightier than the largest dreadnought :)
    Last edited by darthscott3457, Nov 22, 2012
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  11. AdmiralNick22 Fleet Admiral of Literature

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    Member Since:
    May 28, 2003
    star 6
    That is darned near quotable. And dang funny. :D

    Happy Thanksgiving to you all as well! [face_chicken][face_peace]

    --Adm. Nick
  12. Tim Battershell Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 4
    And to you, Nick (though we don't have it over here!).
    AdmiralNick22 likes this.
  13. AdmiralNick22 Fleet Admiral of Literature

    Manager
    Member Since:
    May 28, 2003
    star 6
    Well, to my friends across the Pond, I wish an awesome day all the same. :)

    --Adm. Nick
  14. Tzizvvt78 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 12, 2009
    star 4
    "that important"

    As important as a heavy cruiser that wound up being supplanted by a larger, faster ship that didn't require a city-load of people to run or as important as said replacement, a cruiser that can get blown up by an infiltrating X-wing fighter or get tricked into flying at sublight speed into a black hole?

    I think the Executor-class's success rate is higher than the Imperial-class. You usually needed an actual fleet to take one out, not convenient plot points/holes, all things considered. :p
    Last edited by Tzizvvt78, Nov 23, 2012
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  15. blackmyron Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 29, 2005
    star 5
    "Usually"?

    I guess bad design is a "convenient plot point/hole". Wouldn't it be awful if the movies had sunk so low?
  16. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5
    Just look at the handful engagements that Executors have actually won, it is either plain overwhelming force because they brought company that could have won the whole event on their own (Vader and Zsinj are especially fond of this), otherwise they get destroyed during the event or damaged/ outfought so badly it makes the whole thing pyrrhic at the best of times.
  17. blackmyron Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 29, 2005
    star 5
    The destruction of the Executor and the Vengeance apparently did cause an update to the model for the flaw that destroyed it (i.e. the bridge shielding) for the models post-Endor like the Intimidator, according to the BFC trilogy anyways.

    Again, though, the Empire - or at least the military personnel who favored those ships - seemed to lose them in brute force usages when they should've been used more sparingly. Certainly the NR used the Guardian and the Luskanya to their fullest potentials.
  18. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5
    Lusis most glorious moment in New Republic service was it serving as spare parts for other ships before getting turned into a missile. Whilst all the Guardian did was not be permitted to join engagements until the end of the Vong War and even there it was kept in the back ranks. Them getting used to intimidate/ fight the Imps before the peace treaty also didn’t go all that splendid or gave them a place to shine, the Lusi almost getting destroyed by a simple ruse and later the two just got deployed as parts of fleets of dozens of major warships and numerous lesser ships for mop up operations.
    Last edited by Gorefiend, Nov 23, 2012
  19. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
    Funny, I must have imagined the bits of Behind Enemy Lines where Lusankya completely vaporized dozens of Vong ships before going out on a glorious kamikaze run that an entire Vong fleet couldn't stop.

    Seriously dude-I think everyone knows I'm a pretty casual poster here who couldn't care less about the minimalist-maximalist debate, but stop making stuff up. :p
    Last edited by DarthBoba, Nov 23, 2012
  20. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5
    Äh you kind of must have :confused: Did you mean the novel Rebel Dream? Where all she did was to happen to jump into the back of the Vong reserves, score a lucky hit on the unshielded part of a Vong cruiser and then have to be rescued by local forces before the Vong would blow her out of the space?

    As for her "end run" she had just about all her weapons stripped out in Rebel Stand and didn’t have a gunnery crew, they afaik also don’t mention her doing anything other than random fire and no mention of her blowing up a single ship, not to mention dozens. Other ships though did jump in during her run and blow up Vong ships and soften up the Worldship for her ramming maneuver.
    Last edited by Gorefiend, Nov 23, 2012
  21. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
    Uh-huh...right. So an unarmed ship couldn't get stopped by piles of Vong warships? Your silly bias deceives you. ;)
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  22. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5
    Äh she got an extensive escort (which prevented suicide runs once the Vong figured out what was happening) and was little more than a burning wreck by the time she did reach her target, because the Vong did savage her that fiercely, even though she had pretty much dropped out of hyperspace atop them -> only a short distance to cover and had pretty much all her power on shields and drives.
    Last edited by Gorefiend, Nov 23, 2012
  23. Tim Battershell Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 4
    A fitting send-off for the Lucy, at any rate - and she did take out something many times her own size, with an ex-Warmaster and several thousand Vong aboard!
  24. blackmyron Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 29, 2005
    star 5
    The Lucy also survived a number of full military campaigns against the latter-day Empire - and its end still served a purpose. The Empire seemed to burn through them like they were going out of style.
  25. DarthCane Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2002
    star 4