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Flip flop

Discussion in 'Star Wars And Film Music' started by Cindé of Naboo, Feb 7, 2001.

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  1. Cindé of Naboo

    Cindé of Naboo Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 19, 2000
    Oh, I'm so excited to have this new forum! ;) I already have lots of ideas and things to talk about...

    Have any of you ever heard Rachmaninoff's Rhapsodie on a theme from Paginini? (I have no idea how to spell it. ;) You probably have, even if you don't recognize the name. Well, the 18th variation, probably the most famous, takes Paginini's orignal theme and flips it upside down, so that it only vaguely resembles the original -- but enough to have a vague similarity. He changed it from a minor to a major key, and just basically flipped it over.

    Same thing happens in two JW themes. Most of you probably know of the resemblence between Augie's Great Municipal Band and the Emperor's theme -- a very creepy resemblence, at that, but how about this: Captain Hook's theme from the movie Hook is almost a mirror copy of the Parade of the Ewoks from ROTJ. Listen to it! You'll hear the similarities in rhythm, and how the melody has been turned to a minor key and flipped over. It's fascinating! Yet another reason why I love this man's music. :)

    Anyone else noticed this in JW themes? I'd be really interested to hear it.
     
  2. Sithman

    Sithman Jedi Grand Master star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 6, 1999
    Well, you can check out my Patriot thread for the similarities I've found.

    Downloading Hook's theme... NOW! :-D

    ~Sithman~
     
  3. Ternian

    Ternian Jedi Youngling star 4

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    May 16, 2000
    In keeping with SW.

    The Emporer's theme intertwined into the Naboo parade at the end of TPM is very clever. For in itself, it is a phantom theme hiding behind the festivals of Naboo but saying nothing is quite right in Naboo.
     
  4. Cindé of Naboo

    Cindé of Naboo Jedi Padawan star 4

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    Apr 19, 2000
    And the fact that they have children singing it is so ironic, isn't it? Especially considering the way deep, sinister men's voices sing the Emperor's theme. Spooky....
     
  5. Ternian

    Ternian Jedi Youngling star 4

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    May 16, 2000
    Exactly! The last remenants of the old world.
     
  6. Dark Lady Mara

    Dark Lady Mara Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 19, 1999
    Palpy's motif also bears some disturbing similarities to the Force theme. Although it's obvious that Palpy is a Force-user, it's a little strange to think of him as being associated with a theme that generally follows the Jedi.
     
  7. jamesdrax

    jamesdrax Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 30, 2000
    Anything negative in Star Wars seems to obviously be the opposite of everything positive.

    Palpy = minor key

    Augie = major key

    Vader = minor key

    Anakin = major key

    Just an example from my sheet music.
     
  8. Cindé of Naboo

    Cindé of Naboo Jedi Padawan star 4

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    Apr 19, 2000
    It's curious that the Force theme is minor, though -- I think it indicates the mystery, and maybe even the risk, surrounding it. What do you think?
     
  9. Mastadge

    Mastadge Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 4, 1999
    Speaking of Palpatine's theme, they used it as Frankenstein Monster's theme in a frankenstein play I saw.
     
  10. Rogue1-and-a-half

    Rogue1-and-a-half Manager Emeritus who is writing his masterpiece star 8 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Nov 2, 2000
    I've always thought of the ability to use the Force as being as much curse as blessing.
     
  11. Cindé of Naboo

    Cindé of Naboo Jedi Padawan star 4

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    Apr 19, 2000
    "as much a curse as a blessing." Good point! Having chipper, carefree music for the Force would definitely not work.

    Palpatine's theme always reminded me of that chant the little green men in the Wizard of Oz sing. ;)
     
  12. Shmi52

    Shmi52 Author of New Jedi Order: Balance Point star 3 VIP

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 1999
    Cinde', I like your reference to the HOOK theme. It's one of my favorites from that movie, both compelling and ominous.
     
  13. yodaman

    yodaman Jedi Knight star 5

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    Feb 26, 1999
    Rachmaninov's Variations on a Theme by Pagainini is a great piece. I didn't really notice that he had flipped the theme and changed the key. I guess I'll have to listen to it again.
     
  14. bright sith

    bright sith Jedi Knight star 5

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    Aug 27, 1999
    I don't know any variations (or at least matching the name with the theme) of Rhapsody on a theme from Paginini, but I remember the first time hearing it. My god, I was floored. Beautiful doesn't begin to describe the majestic of it....
     
  15. Cindé of Naboo

    Cindé of Naboo Jedi Padawan star 4

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    Apr 19, 2000
    Wow, I really massacred Paganini's name. ;) But anyway, yes, Rachmaninoff's 18th variation is the most famous, but I have the whole Rhapsodie with however many variations, and it's fascinating to hear what he does with one simple tune. After listening to that, I was able to appreciate more JW has done with many of his themes. The Parade of the Ewoks is a light, jumpy, whimsical piece. Flip it upside down, and you get the twisted, villainous theme for Hook. Same goes for Augie's and the Emperor's theme. Cool stuff!
     
  16. NathanDahlin

    NathanDahlin Administrator Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2000
    I never noticed those Hook/Ewok similarities, Cindé. Thanks for pointing them out!
     
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