Amph For Justice, For Peace, For the Future- We Have Come Home: Babylon 5

Discussion in 'Community' started by The2ndQuest, Jan 3, 2006.

  1. NJOfan215 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 17, 2003
    star 5
    Wow, if you're only on season 2 you have a few more Tron :) nuking scenes to come.

    I would love to see a resolution to the crusade story. I don't care what form it comes in. I also want some resolution to the Legend of the rangers story, but that is something i
    m less interested in.
  2. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    And to think, if Rangers had gone to series, we could have had BOTH all in one package, come LOTR Season 2 or 3... alas.
  3. Sniper_Wolf Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 4
    Babylon 5, the last best hope for making a quick buck. I want a Londo doll!
  4. Leto II Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 23, 2000
    star 6
  5. Jedi_Keiran_Halcyon Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2000
    star 6
    I might have to try watching Heroes again.
  6. Sniper_Wolf Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 4
    Finally finished season two. Really starting to see all the planning that JMS did come into play.
  7. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    Yeah, not to mention the story and actors really kicking into a quality groove- In the Shadow of Z'ha'dum, The Long Twilight Struggle, Comes the Inquisitor, The Fall of Night, etc.

    And Season 3 is even better. :)
  8. PerfectCell Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2005
    star 4
  9. PerfectCell Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2005
    star 4
  10. Leto II Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 23, 2000
    star 6
    Update from JMS, a bit belatedly posted (though technically nothing immediately B5- or TLT-related):

    From: "jmsatb5@aol.com" <jmsatb5@aol.com>
    Subject: Re: Attn JMS: Emerald City ComiCon and Cannes Film Festival
    To: rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated
    Date: 4/23/2008 9:06:38 PM


    I know I've been absent here for a long time, but it's been necessary
    to getting out from under a number of deadlines and personal stuff
    that's been going on which basically put me into (or undre) the bunker
    to focus on getting things done. There was a two week period where I
    didn't leave the house other than to get mail. At all.

    But with so much going on at the moment, I felt obliged to come in and
    put out some information, with the note that there will be more to
    come in the next week or so.

    To the question of Emerald City Con, yes, I will still be attending,
    though I don't yet know the schedule. I imagine they'll mainly have
    me doing stuff on Saturday just because that's the main day for the
    con, but that's conjecture on my part.

    Yes, I will be attending the Cannes Film Festival with Changeling
    along with the rest of those involved in making it. The announcement
    was just flat-out stunning.

    On the work side, in the post-strike environment, I've 1) sold two
    original screenplays, 2) was hired to rewrite/basically write a new
    script for a project for the Wachowskis, 3) have just finished a deal
    to work on a project with Wolfgang Peterson, 4) have another spec
    script going to auction around the end of May, 5) just closed the deal
    on another assignment which is based on a very influential series of
    SF books, 6) have one more deal to write a remake of a nearly
    legendary SF movie that will close in a few days, 7) there's a deal on
    the table for both Dream Police and Rising Stars which I'm considering
    right now...all this in addition to writing The Twelve and Thor (which
    remains in the top 5 of best-selling comics) and getting the script
    books out the door.

    Which explains why nobody's heard a peep from me in ages.

    Now I need to take a nap.

    jms

    />
    />
  11. Rebel_Spook Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 2002
    star 4
    JMS being busy writing for movies can only be an improvement at the box office, as long as the directors don't mess with his work too much.

    The remake of the "nearly legendary SF movie" has me very intrigued, but I doubt we'll hear anything more on that for a while if it goes through, and never if it doesn't.

    Back to B5 related discussion, I picked up several of the numbered B5 novels recently and I am really looking forward to getting into them. Since these are considered canon, and they tell you where they fit in with the episodes, I figure it'll be like reading unseen episodes and might even have a better B5 feel than the Lost Tales movie did. I think I'd rather see more novels (both in print and graphic versions), since there is no concern for budgetary constraints on what an author writes to give more details on the lives of the whole cast.

  12. Kimball_Kinnison Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2001
    star 6
    I'd bet you anything that that "influential series of SF books" would be the Lensman series, by E.E. "Doc" Smith. JMS made a few comments back in February about possibly being involved in that project, and he has repeatedly named it as one of his greatest influences.

    It's good to know that it's more official now.

    Kimball Kinnison
  13. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    My understanding is there's only 3 or 4 of that series that are notably good since they were made after JMS became more involved with their development. It's why The Shadow Within & To Dream in the City of Sorrows were reprinted as standalones a few years ago. One with Londo & G'Kar is supposed to be pretty good too.

    Have you read any of the unnumbered ones? Most of them are fantastic- particularly the Legions of Fire (aka Centauri) Trilogy.
  14. Rebel_Spook Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 2002
    star 4
    I have read all three trilogies (Psi-Corps, Techno-mage, and Centauri). They were all fantastic. It was highly recommended to me to read the #7 book as it ties into the Techno-mage trilogy, and since I found such a good deal on seven of the nine numbered novels that I thought I would pick them up and give them a read.

    One of the reasons I am pulling for more novels to be written is because the trilogies were so good.
  15. Independence1776 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 3, 2006
    star 3
    There's a B5 thread! [face_dancing]

    I first heard of Babylon 5 a few years ago when a friend told me about it. I was able to find the seasons in the public library and slowly watched them over the next three years. (The slowness was due to fitting it around schoolwork and the problems of having a library to get them from.) I do have to say it was very hard watching the last part of Season 5 during the last few weeks of my senior year, due to the parallels.

    I told my sister about them, and was finally able to introduce her when I recieved the first four seasons for Christmas last year. She loves it as much as I do, and she went out, bought Season 5, watched it, and then gave it to me for my birthday a couple weeks ago. I'm rewatching Season 3 right now, and only have four episodes left until the end of the season.

    She also got me the Psi Corps trilogy for my birthday. While they aren't the best books I've ever read, I still appreciate them. In fact, they made me feel sorry for Bester (I almost like him now!).

    Other than that, the only movie I've seen is Legend of the Rangers. I'd like to see everything I haven't, as well as read the other books.

    I'm also interested in costuming (Ivonova, Army of Light) but don't have any idea on where to find resources for it.
  16. Sniper_Wolf Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 4
    So I'm halfway through season three now although I did skip ahead to watch "Deconstruction of Falling Stars" (I couldn't wait any longer :p ). B5 going independent was sweet. Marcus by far is made of win.
  17. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    LOTR is the weakest of the TV movies. In the Beginning, Thirdspace & A Call to Arms are much, much better.

    Definitely try to check out the Legions of Fire trilogy- it's basically what happens to Londo between the end of Season 5 and the events of the War Without End flashforwards.



    The Messages From Earth/Point of No Return/Severed Dreams psuedo-trilogy is a highlight of all television.

    What was it about Deconstruction that you had to see?
  18. Sniper_Wolf Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 4
    Quest, the concept sounded really shiny.
  19. Rebel_Spook Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 2002
    star 4
    With the regularseason shows having ended and there being few summer shows that interest me, I plan to go through the first 4 seasons again. I'll watch Season 5 if I have the time, but it's not one of my "have-to-see-again" seasons.

    Just finished Novel #1 Voices last night. It wasn't a great work of B5 history, but definitely worth the read to get another shot of B5.

    BTW, anyone ever heard of Stephen Austin being a B5 cast member? He was supposedly the Pak'Ma'Ra Ambassador from Season 2 on, but I can't find any official note of this anywhere, not on Lurker's Guide, IMDB.com, or any of the B5 wikis. I just got a lithograph with a bunch of the casts' autographs and his is on it, but it seems odd that he's not acknowledged anywhere. If I was a cast member of B5 (even one never seen in true form) I would want to be officially noted as being there for 4 seasons plus any movies.
  20. Independence1776 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 3, 2006
    star 3
    Good! I wasn't that impressed with LOTR.

    My main problem will be finding everything. Here's hoping the library has something.
  21. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    Well, the good news is that they only (widely) released the movies, with exception to LOTR and the recent Lost Tales, as a DVD boxset, so if you find a place with one of them, they probably have the otherstoo (well, there was an early In the Beginning/The Gathering dual-disc, but that's less common nowadays).

    The Gathering is the pilot movie for B5, In the Beginning is the story of the Earth-Minbari War, Thirdspace is a standalone adventure set mid-Season 4 with a lovecraftian-esque element to it, River of Souls is "eh" and A Call to Arms sets up the Crusade spin-off.
  22. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    JMS Interview talks about Silver Surfer, World War Z, Lensmen, One More Day & Ninja Assassin.

    About a month and a half ago I got a call from the Wachowski Brothers. I met with them and they had a draft for this movie called Ninja Assassin, which wasn't at all where they wanted it to be. And they said, "We need a whole new script, and we go to camera in six weeks." So I went home and put on a pot of coffee, and I wrote essentially a whole new script in 53 hours. When a friend calls you and says they're in trouble, you do what you have to.

    The man is a machine.


    On another note- the B5 Scripts Volume 15 offer expires in 11 days (I just scrambled to grab 13 & 14 to make it- had forgotten to check-in on that, what with JMS's absence online the past few months not reminding me of the new releases).

    Also seems they started an "Other Voices" B5 Scripts volume collecting scripts from other writers too. Very cool. My wallet's not out of the years-long fire yet.
  23. Sniper_Wolf Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 26, 2002
    star 4
    So yeah "War Without End" is totally made of win.
  24. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    Yep- all the more impressive considering JMS had to rewrite that story to accomodate the Sinclair/Sheridan change, and managed to do so in a way that you could never tell otherwise. Beyond a slight flaw regarding Zathras's capture (a concession only made for run time), it integrates flawlessly with B-Squared.
  25. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    Well, finally got finished reading Vol 15 of the B5 Script Books (well, not everything, there's so much material to cover, but the prefaces and notations of note as well as some of the more tantalizing core content).

    It's been quite a journey through this publication program to finally have it completed. It also has revealed some interesting cosmic coincidences- my birthday is March 26th. As we learned back in Vol 1, the first completed draft of The Gathering was dated March 26th. The final note from JMS in Vol 15 is dated March 24th. The close-to-exact proximity strikes me as probably meaning something, but I'm not a Vorlon.

    The highlight of the volume, of course, is the outline of the show if Sinclair had stayed.


    (some by-comparison spoiler warnings for people like Sniper who are still going through the series!)








    It's quite similar overall, except towards the end where a lot of events as we know them don't happen until much later. The Centauri don't overthrow the Narn until the 4th or 5th season (Londo still becomes puppet-Emperor, though slaved to the Shadows instead of the Drahk). G'Kar becomes a freedom fighter on Narn for a period of time. Garibaldi becomes a mercenary. Sinclair and Delenn fall in love.

    There is no Earth civil war, B5 doesn't break away, the Vorlons, Shadows and First Ones are not defeated/exiled. The warrior caste overthrows the Grey Council and exiles them. They reignite hostilities with Earth. Londo provides info to the Shadows that unknowingly leads to them destroying a massive Vorlon ship carrying hundreds of thousands of Vorlons, which is blamed on Sinclair.

    The series ends with the Minbari destroying B5, Sinclair, Delenn and their infant child escaping and on the run from the Vorlons for the attack accusation, from the Earth Alliance for being thought a traitor, from the warrior Minbari for his role in a potential prophecy and from the Centauri since Londo fears he can expose the true Vorlon killers.


    ...then we'd get the spin-off series called Babylon Prime.

    Babylon Prime would deal with the exiled Grey Council uniting with Sinclair, Delenn and Narns to try and unite the galaxy again. They would be the ones to pull B4 through time to use as a mobile base of operations and a beacon of hope to rally with. So we get the core of War Without End here, essentially. The time distortions age both Sinclair and Delenn.

    Always on the run from hunters & military assault teamsm eventually they come across Londo, who helps them escape at great cost to himself (so, again, essentially the flashforwards of WWE).

    The time distortion has the sideeffect of rapidly aging Sinclair and Delenn's son into a full grown man in a matter of days- though they can give him the education of an adult, he lacks the emotional development and thus still posses the naivite of a child but eventually learns to be more. He becomes a religious icon by those thinking he has fulfilled prophecy.

    It ends with new alliances formed, the Shadows defeated, Earth beating the Minbari and clearing Sinclair's name. Delenn leaves Sinclair to rejoin the Grey Council. Their son becomes the head of the alliance. Sinclair retires to a quiet, uninhabited world by himself, fishing.





    It's interesting- you can see how the two shows were mostly condensed into one, though obviously you have much different elements at play here at times that were eliminated or permanently altered. It also explains why B5 as it is has that 16-year gap between Season 5 and WWE Londo that I think many people believed the show would one day get to somehow. But without the 2nd show to accomodate a jump in time, or even the child at the time of the time distortion trip to age-accelerate, the regular lifespan was required.