Force Powers. I feel they are lacking

Hello guys.

Through out the clone wars I have felt that the Jedi have been a bit lacking with the use of force powers. Specifically Force Telekinesis. On Ep14 we finally saw Obi Wan dispatching that assassin with the force, something he should have done in the first place. I find it irritating that they quickly find themselves with the lightsaber when they can dispatch people more easily with TK. Maybe I am biased with the Heroes series and Sylar with his TK which he uses very VERY effectively.

Maybe they could find themselves in the position of making the Jedi too powerful and removing any sort or type of drama or tension as you would know the outcome and that is the spot which they simply do NOT want to be in.

I found it a bit disturbing that a Jedi as POWERFUL as obi-wan had so much difficulty disarming and/or neutralizing a non jedi using a lightsaber like the mandalor governor. A precog guy with Telekinesis, that can surgically control his sword through the force fighting a regular (albeit trained jedi fighter) soldier. Obi-wan should have been able to disable him just like the old jedi disarmed that kid when Asoka lost her sword.

Your thoughts on the matter?

 

I think they should stay the wasy they are with their stance on the Force. They make it obvious that the Jedi are powerful, but not superheroes like in the micro-series. I liked the "superhero" scenes in a stylized and animated series Clone Wars, but they would look off in this more realistic series. I think that they have found a realistic balance in this series.

For example, in the fight against Obi-Wan and the assassin, they were equally matched. It has been said that a lone Mandalorian shouldn't be able to take on a Jedi, but think of this: the assassin was probably trained for a very long time to deal with any threat. While Obi-Wan has a great knowledge of the Force, the warrior probably has the same amount of knowledge on fighting. Secondly, Obi-Wan had just been thrown several feet through the air by the blast of a thermal detonator. He was also not expecting to have to fight anyone. so the odds were evened with the element of surprise, skills, and Obi's injury in my opinion.

While I like the balance they have created, I do hope they give a little nod to the micro-series. Like Mace punching a droid on the middle of a battle.

 

I would also like to see more force powers at work than what has been shown so far. At least show some of the powerful Jedi do some awesome force stuff, every so often but not to the extent like in the microseries.

 

I honestly think that they are handling the force powers near-perfectly. I say "near" because there are occasional moments in jedi vs non-jedi fights where I think "why doesn't he just force-push him away?" Also I think the "free-falling long distances only to stop themselves in mid-air with the force" trick is a bit much.

Still, I they mostly get it right. The jedi can use TK but only when they have a few moments to concentrate. If there is a surprise attack and they are grappling hand-to-hand, I don't think they should be able to levitate them into the air like it's nothing. Using the force requires concentration.

Mandos are trained to fight jedi. And Obi-Wan has still won both of his battles against mandalorians in the past three episodes. I don't think the jedi are underpowered or overpowered at all.

 

Everything in life requires concentration. With practice you need less time to focus for a given task, you already know or your body knows what it has to do in order to achieve something. Do you imagine if a basketball player needed that much concentration to make a lay up? Regarding the fight with obi wan and the mandalor, he easily used force push. They just don't use it too often.. I mean.. If I was chasing a person on foot.. dammit i wouldn't run a marathon to catch him.. hello I would stand still... look at my watch and then.. Voila.. force pull him with ease to myself. That is one of the main things I don't like. You do loose the thrill of the chase, but I am sure they can come up with the situation where they can't do that.

Think of it as NEO in the matrix.. He had to focus to do the jump or whatever, but ultimately it was second nature to him. So... Same thing with the jedi.

What I really believe is that they should focus in the restraint portion like they tried to do with Nadar and Kit Fisto. But ultimately they should show, either Dooku or even Sidious doing something all mighty powerful without restraint to show what Jedi and/or force sensitive users are really capable of.

 

Since it's a show set for 100 episodes, they have a lot of challenges to come up with, and it would probably make things too convenient if the Jedi could just use the Force to solve problems and get out of danger. Too predictable, not fun to watch.. A bit like the Coyote ordering gadgets to catch the Roadrunner instead of just ordering a meal for himself.

Still.. I liked the 'overpowered' Jedi in the micro-series more. I liked how they gave unique skills to different Jedi, like boxer Mace, underwater Kit, staff-fighting Shaak Ti. I'd like to see Jedi meditating more, and the Force shown in a more spiritual way, because so far it just seems like an invisible tool in TCW.

 

I like their Force powers the way they are. I didn't really enjoy the microseries because of the excessive Force powers, and I thought that the TCW episode "Destroy Malevolence" over-did in one scene. And as another note on my personal opinion, I'd rather not see Jedi meditating more, and the Force shown in a more spiritual way, as I like the current portrayal.

 

I'd rather not think of the Jedi as super heroes. I think the current series has really struck a solid balance between the film's uses of the Force and some of the more over-the-top stuff showcased in the EU. That said, I would also like to see a more spiritual take on the Force, but I doubt they'll go that far. Remember that the main audience is children.

 

What's so out-of-bounds about spirituality for an audience of children? Something like Obi-Wan talking to Luke in ANH, or Yoda talking to Luke in ESB, I don't think that would be inappropriate. Just mentioning how it's an energy, and balace, inner peace, etc. Maybe mention the will of the Force, and the living Force.

I know it's war time, but I don't want the Force to just be a tool/weapon all the time.

 

I don't think its out of bounds at all for kids. It wasn't for the audience of the movies, was it? Plus, Yoda dabbled in spiritualism in Ambush with the three clones.

It may be problematic in terms of judicious use of screen time, though.

 

I like how TCW is using force powers so far. As it was said before, they could have gone with the "superhero" Jedi like in the micro-series, which was cool but not right for this series. I would however like to see how force repulse would look like in TCW.

 

Sigh.

Didn't I start a whole thread on this?

Is it because it's on Cartoon Network? They show Adult Swim too.

Is it because it's a cartoon? So is Aqua Teen Hunger Force, but I don't think it's for children.

Is it because of the generic commercials that run in prime time Cartoon Network? I saw an ad for Life Alert this week while watching The Dutchess of Mandalore.

Is it the animation style? Because I'm pretty sure the pre-teen set is not familiar with the show Thunderbirds from which it was inspired.

The storylines are more compressed and resolution driven because they're 22 minute shows, but really, what exactly about the show is more aimed at children than all six of the movies were? It's an all-ages show is what it is, it's not aimed at anyone but "people who like Star Wars". If it was meant to be aimed purely at children, there'd be a lot more explosions and slapstick and a lot less dialogue and character development.

Suicide bomber, executions for failure, political intrigue...yeah, I'm sure Pokemon or Ed, Edd, and Eddy have all those too.

 

Don't be so naive to think that the commercial are generic, of that its a fluke that all of the ratings reported for the show are from the 8-13 age group. The marketing of the show (not necessarily the production) is for kids. It is statistically exactly the same as a show like Justice League Unlimited.

 

No, I'm aware that they do market to kids. Heck, the toys are marketed to kids too, so that's not a surprise.

My beef has been, and continues to be, when people try to downplay the series as "just a kids show" or "it's aimed at kids so X doesn't matter." I mean, yes kids like it. They like the movies too. There are parts of the movies I can clearly identify as kid friendly. If I walked into a discussion here and handwaved something from the movies away with "they were just movies aimed at kids" folks would rip that statement apart.

My point is and will remain that so long as the show maintains a similar level of maturity to the movies (and so far it has), to call it a "kids show" is to say that the six movies we all love (and are the reason we're even talking about all this) are "kids movies" too. (And again, I know they ARE from a certain point of view, but they're not JUST for kids, nor were they aimed JUST for kids)

 

There's a difference in saying 'it's just for kids' and saying 'the main audience is children'. Because, well, that's probably true. And in the movies, good guys could say the average 'bad word' without being censored.

Back on topic (sort of), speaking of the Force and spirituality, I wonder when/if the subject of Anakin being the 'chosen one' will come up? You'd think it would have already.

 

This, although the use of movie profanity ("see you in hell") is matched with CW profanity ("what the hell was that?!")

 

Overall, I like how Force use is being handled in the series. Sometimes it goes too far astray towards both extremes, but on the whole it manages to make the Jedi powerful without making it impossible to create challenges for them.

- The one exageration of the Force that really bugs me is with Jedi landing safely from absurd drops. We saw this mainly in Duel of the Droid and Landing at Point Rain and for me it is too over the top, and incongruent with the movies. If any Jedi can land safely from a terminal velocity drop, then there wasn't really anything reckless about Anakin jumping after Zam in Ep2. That just doesn't work.

- On the other hand, I'd like it if the show portrayed more some different uses of the Force beyond jumps and TK actions. It was cool to see Mace shattering the wiescreen in Liberty on Ryloth, it would be nice to see more of that kind of thing. I'd also appreciate more mind powers, like telepathy, mind-reading and mind tricks.

- I also miss a little more depth to the Force. I'd like to see Anakin actually teaching Ahsoka more about the Force itself and how to use it. More Jedi training, less terapy sessions.

 

But that line was edited, at least here in the US. I don't think I ever got to hear the original line.

 

I'd always taken the reckless aspect of Anakin's leap to be the fact that he was aiming for a moving target which even average Jedi reflexes would have a hard time nailing. That and that if he missed, his drop to the "surface" would be way further than the ones in "Duel of the Droids" or "Point Rain", and he stood a chance of getting creamed by traffic at any time.

I'm totally okay with the Force power levels in TCW: they are inconsistent, but inconsistent in exactly they same ways and for the same reasons (basically, plot, plot and plot) as in the films.

But I did wonder about Obi-Wan Force-summoning an office chair in Voyage of Temptation. If he's notoriously grumpy about using the Force for casual things like levitating pears, what's he doing lazing out about taking a few extra steps to sit down?

 

It played a few times at least. Also, I wouldn't call Han saying "hell" once a consistent standard of SW heroes being profane. They're PG movies, for the most part.

 

I beleive you are referring to Rookies. I saw the episode when it first aired, and they did not censor it. Apparently, however, parents didn't like it and, from what I have heard, the episode has been censored from there on. The same word was also said in the Director's Cut of Liberty on Ryloth, which aired after Rookies. This leads me to beleive that parents may be the reason the show can seem a little more geared towards kids. Not sure how this fits into the conversation, but I thought I would throw it out there for you guys to use!

 

The Rookies "profanity"-- the quotes just belong there, seriously-- lives on in both the DVD and iTunes cuts of the episode, which are the only forms in which I've seen it for a long, long time. I can't imagine any reason other than misguided parent complaints for them to have been cut. From an episode where dudes get electrified, shot to death, eaten by giant eels, and commit suicide in the line of duty. Feh.

Off-topic, I know. Sorry!

 

That is PRECISELY my point in all this. They are juts inconsistent with the way they use the powers. Dammit Obi-Wan in this episode 2x14 actually force manipulated someone with such ease (tapping the darkside maybe?) and then throwing him down the ledge (Did he actually think that he was going to jetpack away? if not he would have been killed). Why not force pull the saber like in the movies?

Still I think they need to be a bit more consistent. They MAY be superheroes, but that doesn't mean that they ALONE can take down a whole army, which was the point of Order 66.

 

It would have been further than Point Rain, but not further that Duel of the Droids. In that episode they were freefalling from the upper atmosphere, clearly kilometers above the station.

I certainly wouldn't expect Obi-Wan to go around force pusing folks around like he did last episode. That was an extreme situation that showcased him losing his usual cool.