Speculation Force powers with the newly balanced Force

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode VII and Beyond (Archive)' started by Count Yubnub, Nov 24, 2012.

  1. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    Presumably, we've never seen the Jedi operate at their full "Force potential." Right? I'm assuming that, now that the Force has been balanced, the Jedi will have more power (assuming, of course, that the Force has indeed been balanced and that this will not be retconned).

    How do you think this will translate onto the screen?
  2. Lord Tyrannus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2012
    star 4
    First of all, how are you able to quote from other threads???

    Second of all, the Force before was pretty much in balance, they just needed to get rid of a few pesky evil people..............
  3. GlueParkEnigma Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 10, 2012
    star 1
    Yoda lifting an x wing seemed to tire him out so their must be limits to what a person can do with the force. if you are saying there is now more force to use by Jedi I can't imagine them being able to lift more than 2 x wings for instance.


    Live, Love, Learn & Laugh
  4. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    I wasn't quoting from another thread, I copied a line from the script. But to answer your question, you just type the word "quote" in square brackets before, and "/quote" in square brackets after.


    :confused: No, the Force was not in balance.
  5. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    But that was before Anakin restored balance. The Force being out of balance diminishes the Jedi's ability to use it, or so Mace's quote suggests.
  6. Darth Horn Rollo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 2, 2012
    star 1
    Here's where I think that notions of the Force are all over the map in the movies and the EU. Vader famously says in ANH: "The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force." And in the EU novels I've read (I can't cite specific examples from memory) there are tales of great feats of force power. I also remember watching Mace Windu go over the top in this clip:





    ().


    Yet, as GluePark said, it seemingly takes a lot out of Yoda to lift an X-Wing. We don't know the extent of Force powers because there is no consistency in who can do what. Again, as Yoda says "size matters not". What I'm interested in is not necessarily specific demonstrations of force powers but the possibility of exploring the difference between the "living force" and the "unifying force" or some such. If Luke has gone it alone since ROTJ, where have his meditations and conversations with force ghosts led him? Has he spoken with Qui Gon? If he has students, how is he training them in the force?
    Last edited by Darth Horn Rollo, Nov 24, 2012
  7. EviL_eLF Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2003
    star 4
    It takes a lot out of Yoda because he's become so old and is nearing his death.
  8. stellarmagic01 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    star 3
    Vision of the Future had a rather interesting posit on this... The idea being that there are two different schools of thought on force use. You can use the force for power to extreme extents, but doing so robs you of the ability to do more subtle actions, you effectively drown out the flow, feel, and 'sound' of the force with your own ruckus. Some jedi specialize in one application over another. (Starkiller and Windu = Power, Yoda = foresight and wisdom).
    Heero_Yuy and Iefan like this.
  9. Jobertus Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2012
    star 3
    The Jedi Council was also blinded by their own arrogance. They couldn't detect the presence(s) of Darth Sidious or Darth's Plagueis and Tenebrous before him, all of whom spent plenty of time on Coruscant and elsewhere Jedi were present. Hard to see the dark side is. It is possible, in some kind of twisted manner, that the Jedi Order needed to be destroyed so it could be rebuilt again. I'm guessing that in the ST, Luke, and whatever state the Order is in during this time, will not have the same difficulties with the force as did the Jedi of the Old Order in the PT.
  10. LazyJC22 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 10, 2002
    And is presumably out of practice. I mean, how much stuff did he have to force lift on Dagobah the previous 20 years?
  11. EviL_eLF Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2003
    star 4
    I agree with this! The arrogance of the order as shown in the PT was their biggest weakness to begin with. Qui-Gon who saw through a lot of the problems caused by that arrogance was scoffed at by the council... thus the reason he wasn't on the council itself.
  12. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4


    I'm not exactly fond of the Tartakovsky Clone Wars, and let's be frank (*) this particular scene is so wildly stylized and over-the-top that the only way I can rationalize its existence is by assuming that what we're seeing isn't so much Mace' exploits but the interpretation of the little kid at the bookends; perhaps it's the story that that kid later tells.

    Anyway, you're right that Force abilities are a bit over the map—I'm not really counting the EU here because I want to speculate where the movies go with this notion. I mean, if the Force is now balanced, it has to be shown in some way, otherwise the whole notion of the Force not being in balance diminishing the Jedi's powers has very little meaning.


    (*) geddit? GEDDIT?



    Again, that's in a period when the Force was "left in darkness." BTW I think I remember also in the Tartakovsky Clone Wars Yoda having no problem lifting some Separatist ship.


    That's an interesting notion as well.
  13. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    Are you saying that the Jedi's ability to use the Force had diminish because of their hubris? I mean, yeah they were haughty and arrogant, but that wasn't my interpretation at all.
  14. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    That's also at a point when the Force is "in darkness", occurring chronologically between AOTC ( when they said their ability to use the Force had diminshed ) and ROTS.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Nov 24, 2012
  15. Jobertus Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2012
    star 3
    No, not completely. I think the Sith had a great deal to do with it as well, it's just on top of that the Jedi were so confident in themselves that they missed some things (especially with Anakin). I don't know if you've read 'Darth Plagueis' or not but it helps to explain just how powerful the Sith were, enough to tip the balance of the force in the direction of the dark side.
  16. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    I realize that. :)
  17. Lord Tyrannus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2012
    star 4
    So, I guess that you're are implying that the Jedi had to hunt down and kill any DarkSide of the Force user just to bring balance to the force, even if they lived a peaceful life as a hermit, just so that they could fullfill their own religious obligations and duties and beleifs, the Jedi knights order persecute the Sith dark lord (darths), just because they practice a different religions..........
  18. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    Yes, Darth Plagueis was a great read. If anyone here hasn't read that by now, I recommended it highly, as well.
  19. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    What? :confused:

    My understanding is that "dark side users" don't necessarily unbalance the Force; the Sith do. Anakin fulfilled the prophesy when he destroyed the Sith, which balanced the Force.
  20. Lord Tyrannus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2012
    star 4
    OK, but I still don't understand your whole position/POV on this whole situation.............

    Lightside of the Force=the force in its natural state
    Darkside of the force=a corrupt, a perversion, of its natural state
    Didn't you notice that the movies never mentioned nor said the word/title "lightside of the force", only the darkside of the force??? Because there is no light side or good side, just the Force, and a perverted corrupted version of the force/it.........
    Anakin Skywalker's destiny was to destroy the DarkSide of the Force........
    Last edited by Lord Tyrannus, Nov 24, 2012
  21. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    I apologize for not understanding yours!

    The Force was out of balance before the movies began, correct? The movies suggest that it gets further out of balance as time goes on, and that this diminishes the Jedi's ability to use the Force further. As it turns out, the reason why the Force was out of balance was because the Sith still exist, as they discover in TPM. The destruction of the Sith then restores the balance, right?

    So post-ROTJ, Luke and/or other Jedi now have a balanced Force at their disposal, and their ability to use the Force is not diminished by any unbalance. So, if I'm right with all of that, we should see that with the now-balanced Force, the new Jedi's Force abilities should outweigh the Force abilities of the Jedi that we've seen in the movies thus far. Am I right in that line of thinking?
  22. Lord Tyrannus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2012
    star 4
    Well, how come if any other generic darksider uses the DarkSide darkside of the Force, the lightside of the force, it's is still in balance and it doesn't get outta balance, but if a specific order/group of darksiders use it, then that's is a totally different story??? I dont geddit.........
  23. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    I don't know. [face_dunno] I'm just going by what's in the movies. This isn't explained in the movies, there aren't any non-Sith darksiders in the movies.
    gregvader123 likes this.
  24. Lord Tyrannus Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2012
    star 4
    And the difference, it's is what???
  25. Count Yubnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2012
    star 4
    I don't know. [face_dunno] I don't know a whole lot about the EU. "Darth Plagueis" seems to suggest that Sith consciously unbalance the Force towards the dark side, by some form of meditation IIRC, but I don't know whether that's canon or not, or whether it'll be explored in the ST.
    Last edited by Count Yubnub, Nov 24, 2012