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SWRPF Archive Forum reforms: Seeking input!

Discussion in 'Star Wars Role Playing Archive' started by NaboosPrincess, Dec 1, 2005.

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  1. darth_nemisis Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 15, 2004
    star 6
    That's the user colors given to VIPs. Staff emeritus receives red colors with the option of doing a full border, an underline, and overline, both, or a strikethrough, I believe. It is nothing to do with coding.

    Someone, correct me if I am wrong. :)
  2. Darth_Vaders_cousin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2004
    star 5
    But, if they can strike-through, the code is there. We just need to know it.
  3. Tyi-Maet_Nefer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 17, 2005
    star 6
    True, but that may just be for usernames, not actual text in a post. Also, DVC, check this out if you want to have a look at what Mods/VIPs can do with their name (under text decoration). ;) :D



    As far as the 'tasks' suggestion goes for adopters and adoptees, I am split over it. If it was implemented, the tasks would need to be just the basics (which is what I assume you mean, just reiterating). Personally, I think everyone has a different opinion on how you 'train' adoptees and we need to let them handle it in their own way.

    But for the basics like IC and TAG and the RPF as a whole, it would probably be good as those are things every adopter should already be informing their adoptee about. :)
  4. NaboosPrincess Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 14, 2001
    star 6
    Just wanted to note that the RPF Council thread has been posted. Tomorrow, this thread will lock, and we'll move discussion over there. But if you have comments...feel free to post them here for today.
  5. DARTH-bojangles Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 1, 2005
    star 3
    I feel much the same as Tyi-Maet_Nefer on the subject of Tasks for adoptees. But what about an adoptions training thread devoted to the growth of the newbies?

    Perhaps the thread could switch GMs who would offer up some creative scenarios and ask a group of adoptees to collectively work through problems in search of a solution with a little less emphasis on story but more of a scenario-type of game. (i.e. a group of adoptees is tasked with escaping from an Imperial Detention Center using only their wits and bare fists)

    The Adopter/GM-for-the-day would dress the scene and provide NPCs as the players attempt a daring escape or starship trenchrun or what-have-you. And a process of rotation could ease up the work load on Adopters so they wouldnt get so stressed. (As per SITH-I-5's RP breakdown in the CarbonEye RPG. I think I made him cry a little[face_laugh] )

    But I feel this would really help my fellow Newbies get into the overall ebb and flow of the game and aid in developing some much needed problemsolving skills in the process.

    ...but that's just me talking:-B
  6. Kalio_Dynkos Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 17, 2004
    star 4
    This sounds interesting to me. I'd like to see, in this manner of rotating GMs, that the adoptees get the opportunity to handle some GMships as well. Just to give them a basic idea of what it is like to be the Gamemaster before they go about starting something and having it fail in a matter of days.

    This idea would have to fleshed out and explained so that the training thread would not get confusing. You know, day three "hey I thought we were doing this and that other GM said that" - kinda thing. Perhaps for the point of training, a week-long GMship. The adopter creates the world, the adoptee/adopters present their characters on day one. Day two the week-long game starts. Anybody else can join in, but the game is started at least. Then, throughout the week the game is overseen by the GM, but he/she may pass off on to other adopters every two days from the beginning of the game. Sort of like this:

    Day 1 - Adopter creates the world, opens the day for character sheets.
    Day 2 - Adopter, acting as GM, starts the day by posting the placement of characters. Introductory posts are also welcome.
    Day 3 - Game continues with Adopter still acting as GM
    Day 4 - GM rotates to another Adopter
    Day 5 - Adopter handles day of training in the world
    Day 6 - A chosen Adoptee gets the opportunity to GM today. They would have been contacted via PM and already given hints by their Adopter, preferably the adopter of Day 1
    Day 7 - Wrap up of exercises and preparation for next day. Next Adopter/GM announced. Progress of RPFers noted. Commendation given where possible. Adopters make special notice of PMing their adoptees in critique and commendation.

    This is of course, just off the cuff. But, a possibility.
  7. DARTH-bojangles Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 1, 2005
    star 3
    My thoughts exactly Kalio, the schedule would work the same way as you described... also, the GM-for-the-day (for lack of a better term) would be responsible or intergrating his adoptee in that particular project and maybe perhaps tasking the adoptee to develope the scenario on his/her own...

    I really believe this kind of system would improve the quality of me and my fellow newbies as well as making the oldbies flex their "RPing muscles" so to speak...

    Time constraints seem to be the only problem with this though... perhaps just switch upon completion of set goals/scenarios?

    Any thoughts... anyone?
  8. Imperial_Hammer Manager Emeritus: RPFs

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2004
    star 5
    *Pokes head out of the lab*

    My thoughts are... that all these ideas have been very interesting for the adoption program, and I will be very happy to help in the creation of the new training thread as best I can.

    As to what we are talking about currently, I like it, but (unless I'm mistaken) it seems like you are starting a new game every week? Perhaps it might be more judicious to kick it up to a month, or to not shuffle environments at all (or maybe make one environment with many places)....

    I dunno.... a week seems pretty short to me. Just when players have gotten comfortable with their new environment, then you switch it up again. In my experience, players need more help with character development than they do with "external-forces" RPing. That seems to be the real linchpin between a novice and good role player. It may be advantageous to actually keep the environments stable so that they have somewhere else to focus their RPing...

    I dunno. Something to think about...

    -I_H
  9. Tyi-Maet_Nefer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 17, 2005
    star 6
    What you suggest, Bo, sounds like something that could build upon the already tried Adoptions Game. Although, your more scenario game style is something more of a training thread, rather than just a game to play. If I remember correctly, DVC mentioned a training thread back at the beginning, so it's a thought that has been around.

    Something struck me about your suggestion. I think I'll just add my own take on it. ;)

    The concept of rotating 'GMs' is definitely a good one, it would stop one person's shoulders from getting too heavy. A way that it could be done, is that, as you said, you have a completely new scenario in which the adopters & adoptees can participate in each week. One week is a reasonable and good amount of time, I think. This would enable the SC (Scenario Creator) to set the scene, and then any adopters & adoptees can jump right it, whether it be a trenchrun, cantina brawl, you name it.

    My idea, unlike what I've just read Kalio suggest, is a more free-flowing one. Something that changes every week, but is open at any stage for the adopters & adoptees to jump right in. Basically, as an example, I'll use the trenchrun.

    SC starts it off by describing the trench and enemies/turbolasers and the goal (perhaps... blow up Death Star. Ingenious goal, eh?) Adopters & adoptees then fly right in with their desired craft and flex their skills at RPing as a team to achieve the same thing. Now, there could be the option that, if an adopter & adoptee want it, they not be involved with the other players. They do the scenario on a more one-on-one direct training and skills approach.

    But, for everyone who wants too, the teams (or they could be seperate?even the enemy) are all in it together. So multiple interactions could occur between all players. Heck, an adopter & adoptee pair could even both be enemy fighters and go against everyone else.

    At the end of the week, the original SC, who may or may not be involved in it anyway, could, as an idea, give out 'awards'. Now, this would be in a friendly type of way. The SC for each go could come up with their own 'awards' so people don't know what they're playing for! That would keep it to a less to-the-death-I-want-to-win competition and more of a friendly competition?but still competition. ;)

    And then, to complete this scenario, after the week is up the next scheduled SC gives everyone a new scenario, and row row row your boat gentle into the RPF! Everyone's merry like a berry and don't forget the lamingtons. Pity that doesn't rhyme.

    And so it goes, continually being run by volunteers who could alternate however they see fit, and always open for an adopter & adoptee pair to jump right in. They could keep playing the scenarios for as long as they like, it is basically available for them all to hone their skills and interaction with other players?but with a purpose. :)


    Was that coherent?



    Okay, to avoid an edit I just read Hammer's. A week is pretty short, I know, but in the environment I suggested, it doesn't affect it all that much. It's an opportunity to handle all sorts of situations, whether it be the flying or fighting or if someone came up with something intellectual. ;) More training then straight RPG, you see.

    Just my thoughts....


    Edit: Well, looks like I'm doing it anyway. I notice teh bold now, I_H. ;) And yes, character development really defines an RPer. I'd just like to add that if such a thing like my above words was done, people playing in it would use the same characters for as long as they want. Which would make their character handle each scenario in the way that he/she has been built and would react. I wasn't ignoring character sheets, it would still be apart of it each time you join.

    And as I said we could have some non-action scenarios that are all about talking and thoughts. Which relies on character development to do anything. But, using the same character through changing scenarios is just like a character you have in a normal gam
  10. DARTH-bojangles Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 1, 2005
    star 3
    Wow! at the great discussion Fellas... ok, 'HAMMER does bring up a VERY valid point and his suggestion does have incredible merit to this one especially since the intracacies of Character Developement are merely months old to this one...

    Ok, try this idea on for size fellow RPers...

    After reading both 'HAMMER's and TYI's posts, I think there's one absolutely wonderful idea in the mix of both of them...

    Follow my line of thinking for a moment and conjure up thoughts of the X-men's Danger Room from the cartoon/comic book series...

    Now, put a Star Wars RPF Adoptions program spin to it and... VOILA!

    You get the RPF's own DANGER ROOM!!!

    Just think of the possibilities for a moment...

    ~Adoptors AND Adoptees can create their own characters for developement in scenarios created and GM'ed by fellow RPers of the boards.

    ~A rotating line of Scenario GM's so that every experience is different and equally engaging.

    ~Of course, it will be left up the current GM to enforce their own rules and modes of play for their respective turns.

    ~And it would be a 'pick up and play' type of gaming style allowing for the ease of joining coupled with the ability to take a break to ease stress levels so that no other RPing endeavors suffer.

    ~It could be autotomically regulated by a MOD or a Council member for final say on issues as well.

    ~And the Room itself would be stylized as a type of training sim itself for the ability to fit any possible scenario imaginable.

    EDIT:As per the character developement, the character created by the Adoptor/Adoptee (it would also be open to anyone else as well) would grow inside of the training enviroment. The personality aspects of character dev. would grow by exponential measures in their interactions with others. And such skills learn could be carried over into the actual 'Storytelling' RPGs out there like CarbonEye and PodRacing: Life in the Fast Lane [/shamelesspromotion].

    EDIT2:Also, one could bring any already existing character from any RPG strolling on in to the training room for a scenario or two... just a thought. If you've read any of the 007 series of RPGs then just imagine Joss Vendu and Markus Carfax fighting alongside one another against giant mechanized robots... good times, good times.

    So... what do y'all think?:cool:
  11. Kartanym Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2002
    star 6
    Just about everything you guys have mentioned so far was exactly what I originally wanted to do with the RPF Adoptions Game that was started a few months back. Most of it was very hard to introduce mainly because I was the lone GM and had other things on my plate at the time. But the main aim was a game that allowed new players to build their skills while Oldbies posted tips, PM'd them suggestions on how to improve their writing style, etc. etc.

    I'm going ot raise my hand again and say I want to help develop the adoptions game when the time comes.
  12. goblin_fire Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2005
    star 3
    I will have to agree. I really like the idea of switching GM's and doing weekly practice RP games. If you mixed that with the "task" idea that would create a really great adoption program indeed. And it would definately give you the quality RPers you guys are wishing for.
  13. Darth_Vaders_cousin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2004
    star 5
    *Bows*

    Bo, I lay my humble self before thee so that I may learn.

    *Stands*

    THAT WAS FRELLING BRILLIANT! The RPF Danger Room sounds better than my idea of a beginners thread (Mainly because as people get better, they lose interest in the begginers thread and leave. This leaves open ends and screws up story lines.)

    Plus, I want to see a Alderaan Team vs. TBT battle. (007 Style inside joke...)
  14. DARTH-bojangles Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 1, 2005
    star 3
    Why thank you DVC and yes, that 007 scenario you just described would be something that would keep everyone reguardless of Forum Age coming back for more... And if anyone at all has any other ideas to contribute, please feel free to post 'em!

    I realize this idea is still far into it's infancy, but c'mon, how can you not be excited about a RPF DANGER ROOM?!?!?!

    Well, soon this thread will be locked, so look for more on this subject on the RPF Council Thread...
  15. SkyeLightrider Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 12, 2003
    star 6
    and what happens when relative newbies start demanding rotating GMs on other RPGs?

    rotation of GMs is a terrible idea. Any scenarios are instantly nullified on the change; scenarios are run by GMs and having a changing GM ruins continuing storylines, unless you want to spend the entire week telling next week's GM what's going on.

    We have already had new players come into the game I help run and essentially demand high ranking positions, often at the expense of the player already in that position. For example, a rookie came into the Outcasts and demanded the role of Chief Medical Officer, a position held by a long standing player. Essentially this player came in and claimed "oh I could do that job better" with no experience shown.

    So what do we GMs do when rookies come to our more experienced games and claim "I wanna be GM, and this initial thread sponsored by your Council did it this way..."? What do we do?

    I know this will happen. Anything designed as a training tool but endorsed by some governing body quickly becomes policy enforced upon other GMs.

    And the day that happens, I know a few RPGS that will instantly close or move off the RPF.
  16. Kartanym Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2002
    star 6
    I seriously doubt, Skye, that newbies would 'demand' rotating GM's on any other games.

    The idea would only work if there's a set selection of GM's in the game already, but I don't find it working either way. Having two or three GM's at any one time in an RP is all you need.

    However, in saying this, it also depends on how the game is created. A game that lasts a set amount of time with a complex storyline to follow wouldn't cut it. A game where the story is null and void, and strictly has the action played out as if in a video game, well that might work.

    Giving any game only a week to progress wouldn't be fruitful. At the very least, you'd give the game a month before any changes came into effect.

    In terms of newbies requesting particular roles in a game, I tend to see this as a lack of experience in how the games are run. Teaching newer players how to run a game should also be a part of the program. Some have the gift and pick it up straight away, others require patience and practise. There will be those new people who just don't understand and soon leave, that happens everywhere. But I don't think we should scare everyone away just because they make a mistake, etc.
  17. Imperial_Hammer Manager Emeritus: RPFs

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2004
    star 5
    *Kicks back w/ a pipe*

    While I am still in favor of a more unified RPG, I do not believe such a dire scenario as you presented here will occur.

    Namely cause theres a pretty simple solution to your scenario of new users wanting GM positions in existing RPGs. Just say no. ;)

    First of all, positions of GMs in the training RPG or any other for that matter should be able to be solely at the Original GM's position, or for the training RPG, that of the council or who the council deems experienced. Shoot, you can set up time barriers or whatever to check newer users.

    Second, for what I read, something like that would certainly not be a forum-wide overhaul. I think not only will the single-GM style RPG stick around, but will do better cause its simply a better mechanism. Rotating GMs have an inherent instability to them that will cause an RPG to be less successful, that I am pretty sure of. And thats for the exact same reasons you gave. Will there be Copycats on the RPF? Sure. But like anything in the RPF, natural selection will see to their fate...

    And believe you me Skye, if anyone inforced any outside rule other than what is out there on my GM style, I'd be right out there with you. That would be preposterous, and frankly because its so wild, I have serious doubts it will be done.

    -I_H

    EDIT: Agreed Kartanym... and yeah, you're right, long storylines wouldn't hold up in that sort of system. Although here is an interesting idea, what of more than one training RPG for different tasks in the RPF? I know such a system makes it more than cluttered, but we could have one for character development, one for environment interaction, and perhaps a game creation workshop for the third step.
  18. Kartanym Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2002
    star 6
    Seperate RP's concentrating on particular areas? That's an interesting idea. But the clutter aspect does come into play. Perhaps in terms of changing the training game each 'month', the subject or key aspects of learning can change in much the same way.

    For example. January's RPF Learner's Game could be a simple Jedi vs Sith campaign teaching players the key elements of character interaction and how to write a fight scene RP style.

    February could be a game that has a slightly less action based game, concentrating on character development and general writing skills.

    March can be a game where players can learn the ins and outs of being a GM, etc.

    I perfer that setup then having seperate games, although that too would work well if done right.
  19. SkyeLightrider Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 12, 2003
    star 6
    Well, I'm just listing worse case scenario. Some of the things rookies demand from GMs gets pretty scary.

    I am apprehensive of this Council and their control over the RPF. Say someone goes to the GM of some particular and the GM overrules their idea. What prevents them going to the Council claiming injustices then the Council coming in and taking command? It seems that all this is to appease the newcomers, but when does appeasing the newcomers infringe on the more experienced?

    I will be flat out honest. In my experience, I have learned to not trust newcomers. Speaking from experience it's always the complete rookies who come in, then immediately leave, usually because of conflicts with the GMs. I understand the need to always bring new players in, and definitely the adoptions system is a good idea. I just think it needs to be absolutely mandatory. Like a graduation ceremony; rookies have to pass the "class" before venturing out.

    There should be a class for just entering the RPF, and a class for GMs, and like other classes, prerequisites would be necessary, such as only experienced and qualified people being able to even try the GM "class".

    I know is sounds harsh and cruel and mean, but we are going for a better RPF right? Well, it depends on your definition of "better". For some it means more accessibility. For others, like me, it means cleaning out the bad and only keeping the good.

  20. Kartanym Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2002
    star 6
    So basically you want us to ignore all the new people who come in here from now on then.

    Everyone deserves a chance. If they leave, they leave. It's their loss, not the forum. Having an RP or area dedicated to teaching the rules of the forum and gaining experience should be the first port of call. But we can't enforce that rule here. We're not teaching them to drive a car.

    The Council is here to decide upon the future of the forums and listen to general ideas. What happens within seperate games should go straight to the Mod of the forum, not the Council itself. That's something else entirely.
  21. SkyeLightrider Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 12, 2003
    star 6
    no, don't ignore new people. That's not what I said.

    What I said was before they join any RPG, they should undergo the training. When playing any other type of game with other people, before just jumping in what do you do? First you read the rules, then you get someone to teach you how to play.

    People are skipping these steps and jumping right into play. What I'm saying is for newcomers, they have to learn before they play.
  22. Kartanym Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2002
    star 6
    Training accounts for probably less then half of the people that currently start fresh in the forums so far. I've seen a few who write in their own time jump straight in. I don't see that as a problem as long as they fit in without any problems.

    As I said, pushing the training on people who clearly don't need it doesn't help anyone. Only those who really do need it should use the opportunities we'll provide them.
  23. DARTH-bojangles Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 1, 2005
    star 3
    'I'm out of it for a little while, everyone gets delusions of granduer...'

    1)No one said that the idea of rotating GMs would ever spill over into the rest of the RPF... SKYE, I think you're really crying wolf on this one... I know that idea scares you, but keep the idea in perspective... that idea is specifically just in the RPF DANGER ROOM concept... and everyone knows that GMs hold the power over thier own RPGs as long as it's within the TOS and even then it's only the MODs that can intervene upon the utterance of those words that we do not speak of...

    2)And lets all think for a moment beyond the scope of just Newbie-aid... what ever happened to just making a fun training room sim for Old and New alike???... It is so hard to believe that an established Oldbie can have some fun in a loose-type of training sim and possibly polish their RPing skills along side a developing Newbie??? Lets not allow a sense of elitism (although it is well deserved by the Oldbies i know;) ) to spoil the fun on RPF.

    3)Dont forget that this is an ADOPTIONS PROGRAM... i.e. the newbies in this particular thread would be guided alongside the wise and allknowing Oldbies to prevent the things SKYE mentioned... with great guidence by the elder players of this forum, the newbies can grow into the same mold as thier teachers... the fate of the newbie ultimately lies in the hands of all you Oldbies out there...(no pressure or anything)

    4)And there seems to be an impression that this council has some kind of ultimate governing power... and that's really not the case... if anything were just a platform for everyone to get the RPF reformed in the best manner possible... "and I promise to relenquish all emergency powers after the Seperatists are defea---"... Oops!, nevermind...[face_worried]

    EDIT: Also for SKYE's argument... one could suggest any Newbie must have thier adoptor with them in the DANGER ROOM to prevent the squabbles SKYE mentioned...
  24. darth_nemisis Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 15, 2004
    star 6
    Skye, it always seems you have nothing but bad things to say, or think.... [face_shame_on_you] I don't mean to be rude when I say this, but that's just how I see it.

    I do not agree with the newcomers having to pass a class. There are many new users who have the experience, and know what they are doing. I am not saying all of them do, but that's what the point of the Adoptions program is, to help out the new users. If a new user doesn't see the thread, point them to it. That's all there is to it.

    Alternate GMs: The idea for alternate GMs is interesting, and would give new users a feel for the different styles many users have in the RPF. Though, I have to say that a week is too short. Many people have time constraints, especially in times of the holidays, and are unable to post. What happens when the GM is unable to post? Does that post-pone the whole thing? Do we move on? Some users may become iritated with that, being use to a short time limit. Though, as I said, I think it is a relitively good idea.

    Multiple Threads:I agree with Imp on the idea for a bunch of different threads for the different training areas. Yes, it might get cluttered, but it would surely help everyone out. I am in support of making this it's own forum, such as RPing Community Forum or something. Perhaps we could have our own Category, with the different forums, if it was allowed of coarse. It would certainly limit the clutter in this one forum.

    New Suggestion: If that is not an option, there is always the idea of making a thread index. I am all for helping out with that, if not doing it myself. In the index, we could include many games in it, the past awards, the winners, everything. It could be quite interesting.
  25. NaboosPrincess Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 14, 2001
    star 6
    There is also the question of how we define a newcomer. Some "newbies" come to us with vast experience on other RPG sites, and they just have a newer registration date because they've just found this site. Forcing everyone with a new registation date to undergo training is a horrible policy.

    If it's not too much trouble, I'd like to move this over to the Council thread now...
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