Lit FOTJ Apocalypse: So who really is the Chosen One?

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Corran Horn's Beard, May 19, 2013.

  1. Corran Horn's Beard Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2013
    So if you've read Apocalypse, you know that Anakin never really brought balance to the force, despite his Chose One label. He refused to take the Father's place, and since then the Force has been trending toward darkness. Since there really isn't an answer (unless it's in the comics, none of which I have read), I guess we can only speculate. The easy answer seems to be Allana, since she is the supposed Jedi Queen who is to sit on the throne of balance. There's also Ben Skywalker. I don't think it could be Like because he is an old fart now and I don't know how believable it would be to elevate his power any higher than it already is. But then Krayt is supposed to come to power...and I know enough about the comics to know that it was Cade Skywalker that killed him, so where did Ben and Alanna go?

    I guess what I'm trying to say is: wtf star wars? Was the idea of the Chosen One abandoned after Apocalypse? I guess I can understand not having a Chosen One though, since if there was one, there would be nothing to write more books about. What do you guys think? Oh and hi.
    Last edited by Corran Horn's Beard, May 19, 2013
  2. Reveen Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 4, 2012
    star 3
    I like to think that Chance Calrissian is going to end up force sensitive and become the new hero to restore whatzit to the galaxy after Ben and Allana screw everything up.

    The whole Abeloth-Mortis connection was pretty hilarious in how the authors busted the thematic focal point of the franchise (as much as it annoys me) just by inserting a half-hearted multimedia tie in. That's not dropping the ball so much as chucking it down a mine shaft.
    Last edited by Reveen, May 19, 2013
    Havac and Gorefiend like this.
  3. Sable_Hart Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2009
    star 4
    Anakin is the Chosen One per Lucas; anything in the EU that says otherwise is full of crap. I love the petty war between the film&TV camp and the rest of the EU, each diminishing and retconning the other's works.
    Son of a Bith and darklordoftech like this.
  4. Adam_Bosman Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 30, 2007
    star 2
    This is more based on the Mortis Trilogy over FOTJ (the balance of the Force prophecy explanation). GL was involved in that.

    Not saying Anakin isn't the chosen one, but I understand the confusion. Mortis tells us that Father was killed and Anakin needed to take up that mantle to balance the Forse...which he doesn't. I'd even say he left it unbalanced by killing the Emperor and leaving Luke alive, tipping everything to the Light Side (Daughter).
  5. The_Phantom_Calamari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 10, 2011
    star 4
    The Father told Anakin he had to take his place in order to keep balance between his Daughter and his Son, because the Son was growing too powerful. As it happened, the Father, Son, and Daughter all died, so there was no one left on Mortis to create imbalance. Hence Anakin was no longer needed there (if he even ever was). Nothing in the Mortis Trilogy itself questioned Anakin's status as the Chosen One.

    And the old canard that destroying the Sith while leaving the Jedi alive somehow leaves the Force out of balance in favor of the light was discredited a long time ago.
  6. Esg Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    He was the chosen One and he did restore balance to the force
    Zeta1127 and Sable_Hart like this.
  7. Sable_Hart Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2009
    star 4
    Exactly.
  8. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    That said, there's plenty of room for people "in-universe" to be skeptical- as in The Essential Guide to the Force, well before FoTJ: Apocalypse.
  9. Sable_Hart Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2009
    star 4
    I'm fine with skepticism, but both the essential guide and Apocalypse treats it as the prevailing idea.
  10. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Possibly because, if the Force really had been "balanced" per Lucas's "getting rid of evil in the universe" phrase, the sheer amount of disaster, Sith wreaking havoc, etc, post-RoTJ, doesn't make sense.
  11. darklordoftech Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2012
    star 5
    Lucasverse - Anakin fulfilled the prophecy by tossing Palps into the reactor
    EU - Anakin failed to fulfill the prophecy because he didn't take Father's place
    darth fluffy likes this.
  12. DarthJenari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2011
    star 4
    The way I see it, the Force was unbalanced once, so there's absolutely no reason it can't happen again, which could account for the Sith still causing chaos as far after ROTJ as Krayt's era.
  13. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    It's the "getting rid of evil in the universe" bit (plus other Sith being alive at the moment Anakin "destroyed the Sith") that's problematic.
    Last edited by Iron_lord, May 19, 2013
  14. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Clearly that part ( getting rid of evil in the universe ) can't be taken entirely literally. The sapient capacity for evil is something that doesn't just go away after ROTJ, if the SW universe is anything like what it seems to be. So what does it mean? I think it can easily be taken as Lucas shorthand for the prevailing evil of the Sith and the Empire.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, May 19, 2013
    Zeta1127 and Esg like this.
  15. DarthJenari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2011
    star 4
    Exactly. Are we supposed to believe that every evil act in the universe would end just because balance was restored to the Force? I mean, if there was some random thug about to murder a couple for their credits would he just change his mind once balance was restored and decide to go home and bake cookies forever? I think that logically it really isn't possible for their to be no evil anywhere in the universe.
    Zeta1127 and Esg like this.
  16. The_Phantom_Calamari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 10, 2011
    star 4
    I always just interpreted it as the Sith being wiped out once and for all. Once the EU brought the Sith back in a major way, I had to revise that to Palpaine just being a huge singular evil unrivaled in the history of the universe. You kind of have to fall back on the Dark Empire version of his ultimate plan to justify that view, though.
    Zeta1127 and Esg like this.
  17. Esg Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    Even the events of ROTJ was enough of a massive setback that it gave more time for elements of his defeat EG Leia getting preggers as exhibit A
  18. Slash78 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2004
    star 3
    Kyp Durron was the Chosen One because he was like the mostest powerful force sensitive ever! (Thanks KJA, not).
  19. Mechalich Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 2, 2010
    star 4
    Getting rid of evil in the universe is what the Jedi, living in a time of triumph and multiple generations of peace, thought bringing balance to the Force would mean. Turns out, there perceptions were skewed. The Force actually was pretty balanced circa Phantom Menace (though the dark side was gaining strength). Anakin Skywalker brought balance to the Force in 4 ABY, a point in time at which the dark side was supremely ascendant and on the march to total, absolute victory.

    Anakin's actions rebalanced things to the point that the dark side would not make a major play for control of the bulk of the galaxy for the better part of a century (I'm going with Darth Krayt and the One Sith as the next big push, I refuse to dignify Jacen Solo as have ever really in serious command of the galaxy rather having conducted a longform version of a failed coup). Following Anakin's sacrifice Palpatine's followers, including the resurrected Emperor himself, suffered tremendous setbacks and almost continuous reversals for decades, despite massive material advantages, many of these are such improbable coincidences: like the Eclipse II hitting the Galaxy Gun and causing Byss to blow up, the only guy who knows the location of the Valley of the Jedi turning out to be a righteous Jedi bad-ass, etc., they can only be attributed to the Force aligning with the side of good once again.

    The EU does not, in any significant way, diminish Anakin's actions in killing Palpatine, it just makes the reverberations more detailed. The only real exception here is the arrival of the Yuuzhan Vong. However, because they stand outside the Force it can be argued that is was their actions, not any Mortis philosophical BS, that cut short a lengthy era of peace and prosperity that should have come to pass, without violating the prophecy of the Chosen One.
  20. FatSmel Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 23, 2012
    star 3
    This sums it up very well.

    Anakin is the chosen one.
  21. Gorefiend Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 2004
    star 5
    The whole Chosen One thing is pretty much pointless, Qui-Gon is outright guessing when he brings it up and the other Jedi don’t take it all that seriously anyway, especially just like any “good” prophecy it will be self fulfilling just by adjusting your interpretation of it.
  22. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    The Chosen One prophecy is a very prominent example of some of Lucas' inherent shortcomings as a writer. Obviously, those kind of prophecies are very common among myths, legends and fantasies, which is what Star Wars takes influence from in many ways more than science fiction, and they can be done very well in modern storytelling. As it's done in the Star Wars movies, however, it never becomes anything more than a cliche. The concept of "bringing balance to the Force" is never defined, never explored, in the same way that Anakin's responsibilities are never explored. It's a shallow justification for Anakin's status as the special child without having to bother to show it. It ultimately adds nothing to the tapestry of the story, especially over the course of the movies we learn next to nothing about the prophecy itself, other than it exists.

    Even with all of that said... Apocalypse's assertion that Anakin is not the Chosen One is stupid beyond comprehension.
    TOSCHESTATION and JStepp like this.
  23. Sinrebirth SWC and EUC Forum Moderator

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Nov 15, 2004
    star 7
    Apocalypse made no such assertion. The Force is out of balance by 40 ABY but that imbalance was caused by the original imbalance that Darth Sidious caused and Anakin Skywalker undid that by killing him the first time. At no point in the Star Wars story has the galaxy been in such a bad spot as the Battle of Endor. Nothing, not the Dark Empire, not the Yuuzhan Vong, not even Abeloth, and definitely not Darth Krayt, compares.

    In my mind Anakin took down the original and most terrifying imbalance. But he never guaranteed the the Force would be balanced forever. In point of fact, had Darth Sidious prevailed, none of those other factions would have ever had a look-in and been incinerated, leaving the Galactic Empire ruling the stars for all time.

    In my mind.
  24. FatSmel Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 23, 2012
    star 3
    really?
    Lazy Storm Trooper likes this.
  25. Ulicus Lit'ari

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2005
    star 6
    Yes, really. It was the point of no return. Had Palpatine won at Endor, that would have been it for the galaxy. Palpatine would have never been ousted and gone on to reign eternally.