Lit From Endor to Exegol - The State of the Galaxy Discussion Thread (Tagged Victory's Price Spoilers)

Even so, I'm hoping it'll be like, "The New Republic has surrendered but WE fight on!"

 

I agree...not easy to bounce back from. But I'm thinking of the possibility of, say, DC being destroyed--there would be a governmental structure in place. Someone would be sworn in as President right away, as laid out in the Constitution. Interim officials could and probably would be appointed right away until election could get going...they wouldn't have the luxury to wait. And the US would have to declare war...ad hoc Congress or no. I imagine the NR will start off in state of War...The General leading the way... possibly a legit branch of the NR now. (Would a Resistance even be necessary any more?)

On the other hand, I also think about how an incompetent administration has drastically changed the US...and it's position relative to other countries in such a short time. So, yeah, I see how it would be hard to bounce back from it as well.

I'm sure Jello has an excellent treatise on the topic. Must've missed it. I'd be interested in reading it. I'm not a student of this stuff like him. But I'd like to think I'm relatively informed.

Anyway, the US fleet isn't in DC at all...though a main naval station is about 3 hours away. Still puzzled why a majority of the fleet world be in one place, the capital, no less. It's a little dumb, imo. But...plot conveniences often explain a lot. And I can roll with that if that turns out to be the case (has that been confirmed, btw?).

What would seem to make more sense if if this had fractured the republic, showing its fragility and weakness and giving the Centrists an excuse to say, "see, told you so." Perhaps this was Snokes plan, in cahoots with the Centrist/Imperial loyal world's.

The biggest problem with that scenerio is most movie goers will not have read Bloodlines and know of this political schism. And, dear god...please keep the political exposition as minimal as possible. But a skilled story teller can convey this both concisely and well.

There is a whole lot we of course don't know. It looks like Mothma had wanted to decrease military forces. But did that happen? To what degree? If there was a cold war, did they have to increase again?

Sent from my Moto X-Wing

 

To take on the subject seriously:

I think there's a statement that every general fights the last war. In the case of the New Republic, the Starkiller attack didn't just destroy Hosnian Prime but apparently all the other inhabited planets and moons in the system. My idea is the New Republic after downgrading the Alliance military 90% (or however Mon Mothma wanted to) had the idea of ultimate transparency as well as making sure that it did not show any of the Imperialism which terrified so many other subjects.

So they have the Fleet reserve sitting in plain view near the capital, ready to be dispatched for peacekeeping and protecting the galaxy.

They also have all of their government centered in one rotating place.

 

I find it interesting how everybody compares the NR to the United States, when much closer comparison in my opinion is the European Union.

Its not a perfect comparison of course, as the EU doesn't have a standing military, instead all the member states keep their own armed forces, which wary in size, equipment and capabilities, however this is actually much more similar to the NR, where many planets and systems keep their own planetary defence forces.

The Presidency of the European Council also rotates every six months and the European Parliament moves every few weeks between Brussels and Strasbourg, similarly to the NR Senate rotating between planets. You also still have all the national governments, laws, courts, taxes, etc., which again is similar to the NR (and the Old Republic), where each member world keeps its own local culture and customs.

The United States are way too centralised to make any realistic comparison to the New (or Old) Republic IMO.

Destruction of the Hosnian Prime is more comparable to the destruction of Brussels (and Belgium) with massive nuclear attack, while there is a summit of the heads of governments of the EU going on. This way you would not only completely obliterate almost all the EU institutions and their personnel, but also pretty much the entire leadership of all the EU member states. And as a bonus, the HQ of NATO (the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation) would also be destroyed, which coordinates cooperation and exchange of information between European militaries. Much more similar to what happened to the NR in TFA I think

 

Nah, the European Union is way too decentralized and lacks any cohesive foreign policy and lacks a standing military. But you are correct, the United States isn't the closest analogy for the New Republic either. The reality is there isn't a good real world comparison, as one doesn't exist. The New Republic is part United States circa early 19th century, part European Union, part NATO, and part United Nations. All mixed together in varied degrees.

RE: Home Fleet, I think we're all broadly in agreement that it was the main force of the New Republic, plus the fact that it was peacetime meant it wasn't exactly on a war footing. Again, if we assume that the home fleet is composed of the majority of the New Republic's "heavy hitters" (Mon Cala cruisers, Starhawks, etc) and it protects the Senate, it makes sense. A bunch of legacy MC80's and other larger ships aren't that useful for patrolling space lanes, opposing pirates, and stuff like that. I see the New Republic's navy being largely composed of smaller designs by TFA, with frigates & corvettes being the most commonly deployed. Plus a see a heavy reliance on hyperspace equipped starfighters.

--Adm. Nick

 

Mostly cruisers of the Dreadnought and Vindicator type? I don't mean those designs specifically...but comparable in size and loadout.

 

600-odd m heavy cruisers as "policing ship" bases for anti-piracy campaigns? If they're looking to Legends's Old Republic for inspiration, it makes sense that the New Republic's main fleet would be this.

 

I agree there are problems with the US comparison. And an EU comparison can be helpful as well. But Nick brought up some good points. But it's a Republic, like the US. Influenced by US politics and ancient Rome politics, among other influences of course.

Now my last comparison didn't really have to do with either of those things. It was just an analogy to help me think through my thoughts.

But I'd have to say a US comparison fits by design. But other comparison do work and are helpful tools for a discussion board about what exactly their government is...and why they would be so strategically incompetent enough to leave most of their fleet in one place as SOP.

Edit: added content: Particularly in a post-Death Star time period. Yes, the Empire is gone, but the possibility of a planet destroyer would always need to be considered militarily and politically.

Sent from my Moto X-Wing

 

The entire Sequel Trilogy takes places within 5 weeks.

 

I’m saying that jokingly

 

Well then.

 

Double post.

 

double post

 

sigh

 

Leave it to me to notice the little odd things as I'm reading through a thread....

Generally speaking,on a global scale, being anti-city is not necessarily right wing or left wing; both sides have anti-city adherents on the fringe. Certainly the right, has looked down on cities and city dwellers, praising a romantic view of the past in which a man lived by the sweat of his brow on the fields.

However, left wing movements also look down on urbanized centers and their dwellers, as they tend to be dishonest capitalists living off the hard work of others. If this were not the case, you would not have Communist regimes praising the honest life style of field workers and sending middle class workers to live with in order to be reeducated concerning values.

Now, if we are talking specifically about the American right wing, then yes it is particularly anti city because it tends to extol anti urban lifestyles while the left is concentrated in urban centers. However, I expect even that to change. As a bio major sitting in college lectures in which humans are seriously talked about as being parasites and and at least one in which we had a slide entitled "Why humans suck", while also listening to my peers (and I admit I join in everyone once in a while) talk about how humans destroy everything they touch and how we need more sustainable living, I sincerely doubt the left of center amongst us believe in the continued viability and value of cities, at least how they currently are. Cities are crude and ugly blots of concrete and metal and destroy natural beauty.

As for what Lucas thinks about cities...well, in general his saga is a quasi spiritual one in which the forces that represent the natural world tend to destroy those that represent the destructive, ever consuming Machine. Those representing the "virtues" of high technology do not win in the end. That should speak for itself.


(I do not tend to think of Lucas as left or right, but his works have a populist air and appeal to both sides)

 

I wouldn't really compare the NR to the European Union or United Nations. The NR (and OR, and Empire) is an actual government, it handles taxation, it has mutual defense for their territory (debatable for the Nu-Canon version of it). Closest thing to the EU or UN would've been the GA if it remained a loose confederation of the NR, Remnant, Hapes and others as it was when it started. I guess the GF Triumvirate in Legacy works as a UN analogue especially, at least one interpretation of it.

 

That's why is most accurate to say that the New Republic is a government that was inspired in part by various real world governments, international bodies, and alliances.

The New Republic was established to "form a more perfect union" than the Old Republic at it's twilight, "establish justice" in a galaxy bereft of it under the Empire, "ensure domestic tranquility" among it's member worlds, "provide for the common defense" of all members by maintaining a navy and helping members build their own, "promote the general welfare" of all it's citizen, and "secure the blessings of liberty" for succeeding generations.

But hey, it's probably because I am American that I see the New Republic in this light...

--Adm. Nick

 

To me the Republic more reminds me of EU then USA, even if neither is a that good comparacy

 

The mutual defense isn't debatable. It is canon that the New Republic Defense Fleet is the primary defense of the New Republic. It is just far smaller and in theory supplemented by a larger number of member world's defense forces in times of crisis.

--Adm. Nick

 

so i've been confused about one thing: was the New Republic formed before or after Leia's trip to Naboo in "Shattered Empire"?

 

After. Leia's trip to Naboo was within a month after the Battle of Endor. Aftermath implies 3-4 months (headcanon c. 6 months).

 

SE 2 and SE 3 takes place 17 days after the Battle of Endor, SE 4 takes place three months later. that's the issue where Shara and Luke team up and steal a force-sensitive tree.