Lit From Endor to Exegol - The State of the Galaxy Discussion Thread (Tagged Victory's Price Spoilers)

It's true, when set against the plot in Bloodline, the plot in Secrets of the Past/Vision of the Future just looks cliched, childish and amateurish. But that's one more area in which a do-over has actually helped the franchise; they've already had a dry run of most of the possible plot points you could have in a Star Wars story, and have thus made all the mistakes one could make with said plot points once already.

 

Especially if you add in the likely level of death and destruction that the Galactic Civil War wrought. Combined with the Clone Wars you have two massive conflicts within living memory and everything that they entailed.

So, with those twin shadows of the past, who could be blamed for not desiring another war?

 

To be fair, the Imperial Remnant was only 8 sectors for a brief period - a number of planets decided to stay with them after the Vong invasion, which would indicate that there were sympathizers, or at least worlds that thought the IR more capable of defending them. Of course, the IR wasn't really a 'threat' per se (and I think an opportunity was missed by not having the GFFA essentially being split into similar 'regions' - like the Corellian sphere of influence shown in the EGTW).

Considering how fast the Empire fell apart, the FO really shouldn't have that much support... but I suspect they will be an overwhelming force by the time Ep8 rolls out, with the NR utterly crippled (or even completely destroyed), no matter how implausible the scenario may be.

 

It's not like those 8 sectors were particularly weak. Bastion - strongest fortress world in the Galaxy, Muunilinst - Banking world where resources literally regrow when needed, Yaga Minor - one of the Galaxy's major shipyards. And then you have Dantooine, which is an okay agriworld that could sustain Imperial food needs as they import more from Agamar. Sure, they're no Coruscant, Kuat, Anaxes and Corellia but they certainly are no Tatooine. I guess it just goes with the Coreward mindset where if something isn't the Core it isn't really strong. Some things never change. The Rebels that fought against the Core and now became apart of that establishment dismiss the Rim worlds just as easily.

 

But what about the economical weakness of the remnant and the suffering it caused in Union, that made those imperials fanatical terrorists?

 

Considering how much havoc the last Imperial Leader wrought, who returned from the dead, I'm not surprised that a large chunk of people are "spooked". Actually the heroes might be even more scared, because Thrawn almost won against them once, without being a superbeing with mystical powers. Aside from being a military genius, he is just as ordinary as any other ordinary being in the galaxy. He acts in a totally different arena compared to the fields of expertise of Luke or Han. The only one of the "big three", who is somewhat close to the field Thrawn is playing in is Leia when it comes to politics.

The FO-assets the NR knows about are probably really laughable. We have to keep in mind, that the NR probably has no idea, of what vanished and was established in the last thirty years within the UR and with what the known elements of the FO (that ones which left the NR) joined up.

 

True, but he would never have come as far as he did without Joruus C'baoth. And things was falling down around him by the end of TTT - even if the noghir had not found out about his deception - he underestimated C'baoth who would be in control over Mount Tantiss if Mara and her gang had stopped him and was unprepared for the future Smuggler Alliance to turn against him instead of just stay at the side line.

 

Obviously there's going to be suffering when you get a huge load of refugees, combined with a surrender treaty and having to downscale the military to a more reasonable level. Economic troubles isn't always due to a lack of resources, it's often because of mismanagement. Weimar Germany actually didn't lose that much territorially and had plenty of resources, it's just that it couldn't get a stable government going to have proper trade or a stable currency. Remember that with those 8 sectors as their core, the Fel Empire expanded and managed to conquer the Galaxy, before having its leadership decapitated. Are they backwater compared to the Core? Sure, but they're no pushovers that much was made clear.

 

I wonder if Empire's End will be The Rogue One of the Aftermath trilogy.

 

Huh?

 

like how Rogue One is supposed to be a "War film', I'm saying cause Empire's End deals with the battle of Jakku if it will be consider a "War book".

 

Probably not if it's the same style as its predecessors, which is likely.

Nick and I discussed the prospect of getting such works here:

http://eleven-thirtyeight.com/2016/07/life-debt-redrawing-the-map/

 

Depends. Sixteenthousand new clones every two weaks shouldn't matter mach, when you have half a galaxy to pick from (the quarter of the galaxy Thrawn started with plus the quarter he had conquered to wards the end of TTT). Also C'Baoth might have contributed until the early stages of the Mount Tantiss-campaign, but his impact on military operations became more and more margilized thoughout "The Last Command". Actually it started even earlier. He didn't participate during the battle of Sluis Van and the entire time of "DarkForceRising" C'Baoth spent on Yomark. Also C#Baoth would be easily taken care of. Send a strike-team with Ysalamiri into the MountTantiss. Every soldier under C'Baoths mind-control would either get free of it or die like General Covell and C'Baoth would be nothing, but a demented elderly human male.

In the end Thrawn didn't fall, because of one great heroic act against him succeeding, but because a lot of small things piling up:
-The Noghri willing to talk with Leia, because she is Darth Vader's daughter (which lead to them learning how the Empire betrayed them).
-Thrawn trying to trick the forming smugglers-alliance against Talon Karrde to make something good out of Nils Ferrier's actions. Pity he didn't foresaw Ferrier to screw up again otherwise he might have executed him on the spot. He also should have gone after the smugglers immediately.
- Not sending an extra-team into the Imperial Palace to take out Mara Jade, resulting in the first team being eliminated and Mara being able to talk to Leia and ultimately lead the NR to the Mount Tantiss.
- And finally not exchanging his bodyguard as soon as he noticed, that something was wrong with the Noghri. I would think, that Thrawn thought whatever it was, it hadn't reached Rukh (and Pellaeon had offered a plausible explenation - embarassment about the escape of Khabarak).

 

I do wonder what the territory of the pre Imperial-Alliance War Fel Empire was. I'm guessing Northern Outer Rim, including the Trans-Hydian Borderlands, Tingel Arm and 'digging into' the Northern Inner and Mid Rims? First Order on the other hand is probably the 8 Sectors plus a huge amount of territory in the Unknown Regions, going by Legends terms... early Pellaeon Remnant plus Empire of the Hand.

 

Yeah it had to have been larger than that. The Empire in Exile, I'm guessing, is the most loyal to Fel core space, but it'd need to be a bit bigger than that to take on the Alliance. That and we know it's been growing by absorbing Outer Rim ex-Alliance worlds.

 

In the movie, they were orbiting Ceti Alpha V when they beamed Kirk and McCoy and the others back. They then break orbit and head for the Mutara Nebula, and are there in a few minutes. And not at warp, IIRC.

 

That was Regula, not Ceti Alpha V. Ceti Alpha V is where the crew of the Reliant were stranded.

The joys of being a Star Trek fan (though Star Wars is and always will be Number One).

 

Ah, whoops. You're correct.

Although, same principle, different planet. They were very close to a planet when the Genesis Device went off. So the wave probably just terraformed that planet.

(Same here on Trek/Wars. Love them both, but Star Wars will always edge it out).

 

No Genesis Planet was created from the pieces of the Reliant and the Mutara Nebula itself. Ceti Alpha V was no where near the Nebula and nor was Regula.

It was quite clear on screen how the Genesis Planet was made, and even various novels state the planet was created from nothing (which wasn't what was supposed to happen according to Picard).