General NZ chit chat

lol

 

Coral Burrows body was found this morning, and her step-father has been charged with her murder.

 

Yeas what sad news to start the day off with. Poor family.

 

i read an article saying he wasn't a suspect, althoguh he was done for about 90 other offenses

 

It's quite sad, that guy looks like a red-ceck hillbilly, all the photographs I see of him he's doing the fingers. Punk arse loser.

He must feel real cool killing a kid, oooh! Such a big man! He took on a kid! And killed HER too! *** damn human waste.

 

Yes, a crying shame about young Coral.

On the 2nd night she was missing....I made a $20 bet that her kidnapper would be a "dole-bludging-repeat-offender" with a criminal record as long as an Airport Runway. So now I'm $20 better off.

I think some of the blame should be placed on the shoulders of Coral's "skanky" mum. What was she thinking getting involved with that "bottom-of-the-barrel-scum-bag"....ya only have to look at him for a second to see that he's "umemployable" (gotta love that neck tatoo.)

If Coral's "skanky" mum had never hooked up with that "scum-bag"....then that lovely little pumpkin would still be alive today.

The step dad should spend his jail-bird years breaking big rocks into small rocks. But because there's NO justice in good ol' NZ....he'll sit around havin' a great time in the "metal-bar-hotel"....eating better than I do (3 cooked meals per day)....watchin' Sky TV....smokin' his head off etc, etc.

Say he gets 15 years @ $70,000 per year...
15 x $70,000 = $1,050,000
So, a cool million at least will be spent on the WINZ customer.
Then there's inflation & court costs etc, etc.
I know a few people who have quit the NZ Police because there's nothing to detour crime in NZ.
Those scum-bags in the Beehive just don't care about crime / repeat offending.
NZ is a wonderful wonderful place to live....if you're a criminal.

 

hmmm ... possibly the first and only time I'll ever agree with 2DARK.

You've got to wonder about the sort of woman who brings a man into her home and in contact with her childen when that man has 90 convictions for assault, attempted sexual assault, etc. etc. I mean, that house can't have been a very safe place can it? I think sometimes women can be their own worst enemies. There was a really god article in "North & South" last month challanging the whole idea of the "maternal instinct" as being the overriding factor in mothers. The truth is, a lot of women, for one reason or other, will put their children in terribly dangerous situations for some very weird reasons.

Another thing that annoys me is the government's desire to puch through anti-smacking legislation on the back of this case. I wonder if, if Coral's stepfather hadn't been smacked a few more times when he was a kid, he may not have turned out as such a pathetic, undisciplined ******** who feels he has to take his aggression out on children.

I'd better stop before I start ranting ...

 

The family seemed like a bunch of hillbillies. And no woman in her right mind would hook up with scum like him.

Pity public floggings are a thing of the past.

 

Oh, so now racism has been exhausted let's move on to misogyny ...

For a start, where are people getting this 90 assault convictions and attempted sexual assault from? The tabloids? The sky? I believe 2 assault convictions involving his brother-in-law, and possible involvement with the P trade has been mentioned in the newspapers.

And a women in an abusive relationship is not her own worst enemy. The man who abuses her is her worst enemy. It is not in any way 'her fault', and I can't believe anyone would be so cold-hearted to suggest that.

Yes, women get trapped in these relationships, going from one abusive guy to another, (usually starting with their father) but that doesn't mean it's their fault ... the psychological conditioning caused by childhood abuse is so overpowering, that it takes years of therapy to reverse that. Maybe if there weren't so many abusive people lining up to take advantage of them, and a society who insists its mostly their fault, they would be more likely to seek the help they need.

It is all too easy for those on the outside to say 'she should have left him'. But do you know anything about the circumstances or are you just making quick judgements based on a couple of sentences in the newspaper? And she had a child to this man ... walking away from the man you love, your husband and father of your child is the hardest thing for any women to do, and unless you've had to do that, you have no right to judge her.

 

Kitt ...

Actually, my comments were more misanthropic and mysoginistic ...

My "etc. etc" was supposed to imply that the guy had 90 convictions, including assault, attempted sexual assault. I think, however, that it's pretty plain that the guy is scum. Sorry if my point wasn't clear.

Whilst I'm not blaming Coral's mother for anything, but I stand by my comments. I think its interesting that men have to be accountable for their actions in these situations, whereas for a woman, there is always some excuse ... abusive father, child abuse etc.

And anyway, where's the evidence that any of these factors were at work in the case of Coral's mother? Maybe she just has really bad taste in men? I know a lot of otherwise perfectly normal people who hook up with awful partners ... heaven only knows why, but some people just make poor choices.

A male rapist can't use being sexually molested as an excuse for his behaviour, and yet a woman can use her past for hooking up with any kind of drifter and putting her kids in danger. At one point or other the buck has to stop, and people have to be accountable for their own actions. This guy was bad news, and anyone with young kids who lets a guy like this into their home and life is acting irresponsibly.

 

Like all the people here, I know nothing about the circumstances of Coral's mother's relationship with Stephen Williams, so I was speaking generally, about the act of villifying women for living with abusive partners, instead of the real villian, the abusive partner. I know you weren't blaming Coral's mother for her murder, however 2DARK was "I think some of the blame should be placed on the shoulders of Coral's mum."

A male rapist can't use being sexually molested as an excuse for his behaviour, and yet a woman can use her past for hooking up with any kind of drifter and putting her kids in danger.

If hooking up with a drifter was a violent crime, then I doubt an abusive childhood would stand up as a defense in court either.

 

Kitt,

"I think some of the blame should be placed on the shoulders of Coral's mum."

 

Make love, not war.

 

Kitt, have the things you believe on a day to day basis are from the news or newspapers. It was clearly stated on several occasions there was 90 other convictions this guy had accumulated since '91.

Anyway... how about the weather eh?

 

Kitt, have the things you believe on a day to day basis are from the news or newspapers.

Does that sentence make sense to anyone else?

Maybe I should clarify. STH stated that Stephen Williams had 90 'assault' convictions and one for attempted sexual assault.

That is not true and an exaggeration of the facts.

 

The one "fact" everyone seems to be overlooking is that an innocent little girl died because of a limp wristed justice system that should have incarcerated a known offender a long time ago, maybe its time for us to introduce a "three strikes" approach to repeat offenders.

Corals mother has to live with the consequences of her decisions for the rest of her life, whereas the step dad will be out in 8 years with good behaviour and free to re-offend!

 

> STH stated that Stephen Williams had 90 'assault' convictions and one for attempted sexual assault

No, that's not what I said. Without wanting to spend valuable minutes of my life justifying my comments on an online forum, Kitt, here's what I said ...

> that man has 90 convictions for assault, attempted sexual assault, etc. etc.

There's nothing in that statement that says he had "90 "assault" convictions and one for attempted sexual assault so please don't accuse me of "exaggerating the facts". My statment may have been slightly vague, but this was due to me being rushed off my feet at work, and not because I wanted to put any "spin" in my post. If I said "I went to KFC and bought 15 pieces of chicken for my mum, my dad, etc. etc." I'm wouldn't be explictly stating I bought 14 pieces of chicken for my mum and one for my dad. I'd just be saying I bought 15 pieces or chicken, including some for my mum and some for my dad.

Sorry to be pernickety, but you can't have a go at me for misrepresenting the facts, and then misrepresent my words in the process ...

But as Graal pointed out, we're probably missing the point here.

Oh well ... back to a rainy Sunday afternoon in front of the TV with my new Simpsons Season 3 DVD boxed set ...

Lawrence

 

Williams is SCUM, he has commited MANY crimes, 90 convictions is NOT exaggerated, it's a FACT.

Coral would NOT be DEAD if Williams was NOT allowed to get away with all of his CRIMES.

Coral's mother SHOULD have been more RESPONSIBLE. We shouldn't judge people at face value but does Williams to you look like a charmer? A man who would love you tender and take your kids to the park and push the swings as your daughter giggles in glee on them? NO.

Coral's mother MAY have been SCARED of what COULD happen if she went to the POLICE, but she SHOULD have thought of what could happen if she did NOT. What HAPPENED? Coral DIED.

 

You did clarify what you meant in your second post, STH. SFL was responding to what I said in my post before that, so I was explaining why I said what I said back then. Yea. Sorry if I've been testy. It's not because of this whole line of discussion, but because of 2DARK's use of the misogynist and extremely offensive 's' word, and the silence in the face of it.

Anyway, no one here knows the details of what those 90 convictions are. They could be traffic related, drug possession, whatever. But no one knows if Coral's mother ever had any inkling that her husband was a threat to his and her children, or whether it ever occured to her that her husband and father of her child could commit murder. Rushing to criticize a person who's husband murdered her child is in bad taste.

I can understand criticizing the legal system, or being angry at the murderer ... but harping on about someone who is as much as victim in all this as Coral is just avoiding the real issue.

 

Sorry if my above post sounded harsh.

 

Firstly, perhaps take the one word out of my above post and it might make sense, if that's hard to do without my guidance.

who is as much as victim in all this as Coral is just avoiding the real issue.

Crap. I'm not sexist but females who are in abusive relationships can get out of them... through various means. Corals mum is not a victim, the dead girl is. Sure the step-father is top blame for the death of the shild, but the mother staying with him didn't help the matter.

 

Of course people can get out of abusive relationships. Is it easy? No. In many cases, especially when there's children involved, its the hardest thing they'll ever have to do. Anyone who thinks its something you can do overnight obviously hasn't been involved with a situation like that.

Having your child murdered or is the worst abuse of all. It's worse than being bashed, worse than being murdered yourself. If you would consider it misogynist to say Coral's mother was partially to blame in the latter two cases, then maybe you should consider that its even worse to say it in the first.

edit: I found this fact sheet about domestic violence at The NZ Domestic Violence Center website. I suggest everyone go check it out:
http://www.dvc.org.nz/myths.htm

Especially the part about 'why doesn't she leave?'

 

That site is quite interesting although it really should be called "The Women's Domestic Violence Centre" because it begins with the assumption that all domestic violence is perpetrated by men, against women.

Sure ... that's the "usual" scenario, but it's not the only one. Whilst I heartily agree with the sentiment of the site, and support the work of the DVC, I think the information on the site comes from the standpoint that all men are inheriently violent, and all women are victims.

And ... speaking of assumptions, surely you're assuming that Coral's mother was an abused woman. I haven't actually ready anything in the media to suggest that. Certainly none of the convicitons that have come to light about Williams have implied any violence toward his partner.

Anyway, I suspect we're gettin seriously off the point. My heart goes out to everyone in Coral's family, and we can only pray that justice will prevail in this case.

 

I agree with STH. There has been nothing to say that the mother was in an abusive relationship - yet she *was* in a relationship with a man with EXCESSIVE offenses (abuse included).

Now, I don't want to argue with anyone, but after reading a few of the latest posts. You are completely in the state of mind that no one here has witnessed an abusive relationship and you state it is very difficult to get out of. How do you know this FOR SURE. All I'm saying is different relationships and different people creat different situations. Perhaps if *could* have been easy for her to leave, but she chose not to.

None of us here have been in a relationship with an abisive partner with kids (unless you are keeping quite which is, of course, fine). So no one knows if it is true hard or in fact easy.

All i'm saying is it MIGHT have been possibly easy for her to leave, ya have to look at both sides.

//shrugs shoulders//

 

Well, from my point of view, violence towards one's children is an abusive relationship. Therefore I don't think its an asumption ... although Williams hasn't actually been proven guilty yet, I guess.

BTW, is it just me, or have our banners gone the way of Kamino in the Jedi Archives?