George Lucas wusses out, cuts Jar Jar's lines

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith' started by BothofUs, May 4, 2005.

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  1. Violetsaber Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 3
    Jar Jar is my favorite PT character. He symbolizes what the PT is really about

    Truer words were never spoken, unfortunitely.

    Well, until I see Episode III, anyway. :D

    Violetsaber
  2. BothofUs Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2003
    star 4
    "Jar Jar has outlived his usefulness."

    In my opinion, that is irrelevant. "Usefulness" shouldn't be included in this conversation. Was Jabba useful in the Pod Race? Haha, no. Is Chewey useful in RotS? Haha, no.

    Let's talk about respect for a character that many fans love and care to see his reflections on the goings-on in RotS. Why don't we get to see a sad Jar Jar?

    Bottom line, if GL would have wrote something good for Jar Jar, nothing would have to be cut and we'd have a happy medium just like in AotC.

  3. Bobo_Maul Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 14, 2001
    star 1
    Just becuase he brought us Star Wars doesn't automatically grant him respect. He's made mistakes and bad decisions and it's 100% ok to call him on that. Stop trying to coddle him like he's a child. Let his work speak for itself, both good and bad.
  4. peter0302 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 25, 2004
    star 1
    "He symbolizes what the PT is really about"

    Well, that much is certain. And I don't mean that in a good way.
  5. Eternal_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 12, 2001
    star 1
    Lucas did not come up with a story/character and then think about how best to do it. Instead he wanted to have a fully digital character in a main role.


    I can't agree with that. Jar Jar wasn't intended to be a fully digital character at the time of writing TPM. Many of Jar Jar's scenes were shot with takes of Ahmed Best in the expensive Jar Jar suit, as they were still considering just doing a head replacement animation for the character. It simply worked out as being no more costly and time-consuming to fully animate the character than to just animate the head and get in synched up with how the body was moving.

    This was the end of the old Lucas (the visionary, the storyteller, the mythmaker) and the beginning of the new Lucas (CGI above all else)


    The main difference I see between the "old" Lucas and the "new" Lucas is that the new one has a much more flexible and robust set of tools to build what he has imagined. I don't really know where this "CGI above all else" idea keeps coming from. For a lot of things, it's simply the best tool for the job. There are still plently of models and costumes used in making the films. If what you're saying is true, why doesn't he just film the actors wearing blue suits in a blue room, and build all of the sets and costumes in CGI? Why does ILM still have a miniatures department? Heck, why doesn't Lucas just forget about using human actors, and get ILM to work on animated human characters that surpass those of Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within?

    Star Wars stopped being about the story and became a testing ground and showcase for computer animation.[/quote]

    Seriously, if that were the case, it would be simpler just to create a totally animated film, like what Pixar does. I find the prequel films to have a more well-thought out and well-crafted story than does the original trilogy.

    This is evident in the fact that Jar Jar has twice as much screentime as Obi Wan Kenobi. One film done and still no relationship between Anakin and Obi Wan or Anakin and Palpatine and no hint of Dark Side in Anakin.


    I honestly don't think that Jar Jar has twice as much screen time as Obi-Wan in TPM. Maybe and equal amount, but certainly not twice as much. TPM shows the beginning of the relationship between Anakin and Obi-Wan. TPM develops the relationships between Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan, and Qui-Gon and Anakin, which in itself is important in setting up the relationship between Anakin and Obi-Wan.

    And again, the relationship between Anakin and Palpatine is hinted at in one of TPM's final scenes. TPM doesn't need to show this relationship; the main story arc occuring behind-the-scenes in TPM is the story of how Senator Palpatine comes into power, and puts the pieces in place for him to declare himself Emperor. Anakin doesn't come into the picture, for Palpatine, until after the board is set up, and he's ready to start making his moves.

    It is intentional that we don't see a hint of the Dark Side of Anakin in TPM. That was the whole point of his character being the way he was. He was supposed to be an innocent, good-natured kid. The point of the story of the prequels is how a child such as this, totally untouched by evil, can become the monster that we know as Darth Vader. If the hints were already there in TPM, it takes away from this whole theme. That's one reason why the "Anakin's Scuffle With Greedo" scene was cut from TPM, as it was intended to be a hint of the Dark Side in Anakin. It is through the next two films that Anakin's leanings toward the Dark Side are revealed and explored.

    This has a ripple effect in the prequels, Lucas is now rushing the story. IMO, much of this can be traced back to the creation of Jar Jar.


    I don't see the story as being rushed. TPM also served the purpose of showing us a last glimpse of the Old Republic, before things start to fall apart in AOTC. The film needed to be light-hearted, to provide contrast with what
  6. Hatter Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 16, 2001
    star 4
    I'm very dissapointed in this. Jar Jar was one of my favorite PT characters, the hatred directed towards him is largely undeserved, and it's a shame that he doesn't get a shining moment in this last film, or even A SINGLE LINE. That's just shameful.
  7. Import_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 20, 2001
    star 6
    "He symbolizes what the PT is really about"

    Well, that much is certain. And I don't mean that in a good way.


    I was gonna say the same thing earlier. [face_laugh]
  8. Jedi_Master_Grover Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 21, 2005
    star 3
    Qui-Gon's lines have been cut too. Or maybe Lucas decided to switch their lines.

    Qui-Gon: "Hello Annie, Gooden to see yousa."

    Jar-Jar: "With my training you will be able to merge with the force at will. Your physical self will fade away, but you will still retain your consciousness. You will become more powerful than any Sith."
  9. SneakyMonkey Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Nov 10, 2004
    With all the jar jar bashing that goes on, is it any wonder he cut him? He should have made it so jar jar went out in a blaze of glory or perhaps peanut butter and jelly is for lunch.
  10. Eternal_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 12, 2001
    star 1
    Coming to his senses <> wussing out. Jar Jar was always a creative mistake. Seeing Lucas bow to public outrage like this should prove to some of you that he's only in this for the money. Yes, people with more money than you can still want to make even more money.


    Yes, of course, he's only in it for the money. That's why he waited sixteen years to make another Star Wars movie. That's why he made Episode II "a love story" that "probably won't be that popular" (to paraphrase Lucas in interviews around the time of TPM), and ROTS is "the darkest film, which will probably make the least amount of money."

    That's why, instead of making Episodes VII through IX, which would probably be better-received than the prequels, and would be a license to print money, he's going to make smaller-scale films that are of personal interest to him that "probably nobody wants to see."

    That's why he's spent the last ten years of his life writing, directing, and overseeing every minute detail of the prequel films, rather than just hiring someone else to take care of it, and sitting back and letting the cash roll in.

    That's why he's spending his own money to make the films, which carries pretty hefty risk, rather than letting a studio finance it.

    The only thing he's ever been good as was marketing. If it weren't for the marketing and merchandising there never would have been ESB.


    The only personal involvement Lucas ever had in marketing and merchandising was in making the deal to retain those rights instead of letting Fox have them, way back when nobody, Lucas included, thought that merchandising would ever be worth anything. It wasn't skill on his part, just good luck. He doesn't come up with ideas for new products, and doesn't create any of the marketing for the films or related merchandise. At the most, he would approve some of the ideas that come through Licensing.

    And you are right that without the merchandising, ESB never would have been made. Considering that it was made entirely on his own money, there isn't any other way it could have been made.

    Of course the money made from the films and the merchandising means something. Filmmaking is a business, and businesses have to make money or they fold. The money that comes in from the films, and from the merchandising, is mostly re-invested in the company. It goes to pay for state-of-the art facilities and equipment that allow for ILM to keep pushing the boundaries of effects work, and ultimately into the creation of more movies.

    I think Lucas has shown on a great number of occasions that if he were in it just for the money, he would have taken a different path, of guaranteed successes and churning out one Star Wars film after another, rather than constantly taking risks, pushing for innovation, and doing things his own way.
  11. George15 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2002
    star 4
    You guys do realize that he's in the film, he just doesn't have a speaking role.
  12. Count_DoodooKuku Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 4, 2002
    star 4
    ...and yet he was tricked into becoming a monster.

    But that's only partially true. He also decided.
  13. Import_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 20, 2001
    star 6
    You guys do realize that he's in the film, he just doesn't have a speaking role.

    Did you NOT even read the first post of this thread? Yes, we DO know that he has no dialogue...but he DID have a few in the script, and Ahmed Best even showed up in Sydney during production to reprise his old role.

    The point of this thread is why Lucas cut Jar Jar's dialogue. ;) [face_plain]
  14. Billeedeewilliams Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2000
    star 3
    ha

    If his actions in RTOS are irrelevant Id rather Lucas cut him rather than cut something else. Its good film making and I support Lucas' actions.

    Happy Empire Day!
  15. PloKoons_Apprentice Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2005
    star 1
    They should keep him in because he sheds light on dark matters.
  16. Import_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 20, 2001
    star 6
    Its good film making and I support Lucas' actions.

    Except when it comes to Qui-Gon. :p
  17. YARN Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 9, 2005
    star 2
    I was trying to read Eternal Jedi's post, but it was taking an eternity to read it.


  18. I_Worship_Sidious Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2004
    star 2
    Come on, allow the man to repent. This character is probably GL's biggest mistake in the Star Wars saga. Some people might like Jar, but I think more find him idiotic and annoying.
  19. George15 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2002
    star 4
    "The point of this thread is why Lucas cut Jar Jar's dialogue."

    Well, some people were acting as though he was cut out entirely.
  20. Star_Wars_Freak_2006 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2004
    star 4
    Remember guys, just because Jar Jar's lines were/may have been cut, doesn't mean he's not in ROTS. He is still there, at Padme's Funeral, in the Senate, and several other scenes.
  21. BothofUs Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 5, 2003
    star 4
    ^^^haha. read the thread..

    heck, read this page man.
  22. YARN Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 9, 2005
    star 2
    Well, we can always hope for more editing...
  23. DARTHJADO Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 25, 2001
    star 4
    Strong words Import_Jedi!

    "But... he (Lucas) raped people's childhoods

    Not mine, I'll always consider the OT a separate entity from the PT, he can come out with as many different versions as he wants, I still have the original with Boba's old voice, no Jabba in ANH, Sebastian Shaw's face at the end of ROTJ.
  24. agcjedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2003
    star 1
    Christ people.....
    Jar Jar has already served his role in the saga. In Episode I he brought the Gungans and the Naboo together. Only together were they able to bring down the Trade Federation.
    In AOTC, while he served little purpose, he was given a small cameo role for continuity purposes. On top of the cameo, GL needed a fall guy to set up the beginnings of Palpatines tight grip on the Republic.
    He has served his purpose as far as I am concerned. It will be nice to see him one last time before the end, but he is no longer needed in the grand scheme of things.
    14 days!!!
    May the force be with you
  25. MajorNerd Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2004
    star 4
    Well, we can always hope for more editing...

    [face_laugh] exactly!
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