Discussion in 'Attack of the Clones' started by DarthWolfie, Jul 7, 2002.
"GL fired Gary because he didn't do his job and ESB went over budget"
post proof or retract.
if it werent for people who didnt like the film, you would probably have had at least 20 more minutes of jar jar in AOTC... george is listening... well sorta.
He's got a point there
"One of my chief complaints with the PT is how completely self-aware the two films are. Aside from the third act of ROTJ, I never really had the feeling that the OT was shouting "look how cool I am, I'm a Star Wars movie".
Amen! I couldn't have said it better myself. Now, bear in mind that I do quite like AOTC, but it still definitely has some of that campy self-awareness that bogged TPM down so badly.
This seems to be a problem with a lot of sequels, however. Look at Raiders of the Lost Ark, for example. Then look at Last Crusade. I like both movies, but it can't be denied that much of Lost Crusade ends up being a camped-up, "Hey kids, we're back!" version of Raiders, particularly when most of the defining characteristics of Indiana Jones (particularly the physical ones) are ossified in one afternoon romp in the Utah desert in the opening flashback.
I didn't think AOTC had as much of a problem with this, but there were moments. "Anakin, why do I think that someday you'll be the death of me?" >rimshot!<
>>>Perfect films (People who believe they are not are neither film fans nor in posession of a brain)
Remember that shot with Jimmy Stewart falling out the window and breaking his other leg? God, what a cheesy shot! It's the climax...the absolute, most tense moment of the movie...and it's completely ruined by a cheesy FX shot! If Rear Window were directed by a competent director, the movie MIGHT have a chance at being halfway decent. As it stands, with its cliche characters, corny dialogue, and hammy acting from Jimmy "JJ" Stewart, Rear Window is just plain bad.
Hitchcock should be fired--I'm going to start a petition to have Peter Jackson direct Vertigo!
>>>I dont go to spider man boards and start bashing the movie. I dont go to a scream forum and bash that movie. What is wrong with you guys, you guys just like to make people feel bad.<<<
To be fair, Star Wars is a long-standing movie franchise. Spider-man only has one movie--you see it, and if you hate it, so what.
A lot of people grew up watching the Star Wars movies, so when a sequel disappoints, they get more upset than if it were just some other stand-alone movie.
So to you bashers, I completely understand if you come onto these boards to vent for a little while. Note that I said a LITTLE WHILE. I just can't understand some of the bashers who have been here since TPM, and have hated every movie since ESB. How many years of your life are you going to waste here? Just let it go!
[Sean Connery impression] Indiana...Indiana, let it go.
The reason this forum is hilarious is because most of us saw SW when we were so young that we can't help get it out of our minds. Whether we liked it or not, it has influenced much that we did or thought.
Now, GL is mind-f&^$#ing us because he brings back a new series under the same title - so like salivating Pavlovian Dogs we run to the theatre...
....and then we try to use the "rationality" we picked up over the interceding 25 years to figure out if we can even criticize the films ! It's like going to therapy to criticize your parents! LOL
In fact, this board IS Star Wars Therapy!
"Waaaaah...Daddy didn't turn out to be a god like I thinked he would..." [translation: GL disappointed me]
"Stop your bashing and grin and bear it...every other kid had a rotten childhood too..." [translation: all the other movies out there suck]
"Oh come on...listen to my arguments...dig deeper" [translation: let's play childhood regression therapy]
Perfect? No such thing exists. All of those movies that are regarded as perfect by the people are classified so based on people's own preconceived notions on how films should be, or what influenced their outlook on movies. Citizen Kane, for example, I thought was a very well made movie. I can see how it was amazing that one man (orson wells) created such a revolutionary film (for the time). Yet to declare it "perfect" makes absolutely no sense.
There have been over 60 years of evolution in filmmaking, and the new ideas and techniques of the past have becoming commonplace now. A film which might have seemed perfect during one period of time, now could be see as having flaws because we are exposed to various other options and possibilities that were previously inconceivable. And while a lot of what is regarded as "perfect" is based on personal opinion, there are a lot of factors which could be weighed into the film.
Directing (a little complex to evaluate, but mainly does the "look and feel" of the film suit the story, i.e. saving private ryan); acting (can be measured on how well the actor portrays the role, or expands it); and finally the storyline itself (what is it geared to? If it's purpose is to solely entertain, such as American Pie, it should not be compared with movies like the Godfather. On the other hand, if the storyline is complex, deep, and shows great thinking on the filmmaker's, it should be appreciated, regardless if it is personally entertaining or not.)
Now, enter the Star Wars prequels. What is their purpose? To entertain? Yes, somewhat. But that's not their only purpose. They serve as chapters to an overall complex mythical storyline with struggles, conflicts, and deeper themes. Should this be appreciated? I think so. The acting? Does Hayden Christensen convey the feeling that Anakin is a distressed young man who is going to make choices that lead to a dark future? Watch the confession scene. Natalie, on the other hand... i'm not too sure about (she's still a cool person though). Finally, the directing. What are peoples' specific complaints about AOTC's directing? What specifically would you have changed? For me, visually and emotionally, the directing captures the chaotic, unsure, fast paced feeling of AOTC's storyline.
A perfect film? No such thing exists. Flaws are always present (and are usually opinion-basd). But in AOTC, i didn't see any major substantial flaws that would effect the flow of the storyline (except the WAY threepio's humor was intercut in the arena, it periodically broke the dramatic build up of the Jedi being slaughtered).
Anyway, those are my thoughts. I really shouldn't spend this much time doing this stuff. Anyway, please comment. I'd appreciate it after spending this much time.
I can name one person who hated Kane...
William Randolph Hearst
im not looking for a perfect film... a good one would suffice.
and that stuff about rear window reinforces my point in that the rest of the movie was so well-made that it didnt matter if something looked cheesy... the rest of the films quality overruled that shot (which doesnt bother me anyway).
and again you fail to see the difference between "corny" and "hackneyed". if you cant see it i cant explain it to you.
You can't explain it to us because it's nonsense Dr. Evazan. Complete nonsense!
its nonsense is it?
so you think carrot top and george carlin are on the same comedic level?
you think pizza is just as appropriate for dessert as ice cream? i mean theyre both food so whats the difference, right?
i cant explain it because some people either cant discern between quality and crap, or they just dont want to because they would have to judge things fairly and objectively, god forbid.
What a pretentious viewpoint you have discovered. Get over yourself.
re: pretentious... who are you adressing?
You, my friend.
"I can name one person who hated Kane...
William Randolph Hearst"
haha yeah no kidding... must have been a pretty effective film.
stay tuned for Citizen Lucas.
Dr. evazan, i enjoyed your list(especially Seven Samurai, The Godfather, and Citizen Kane). But if you think anybody here who's watched some of these movies( and understood them) will stop sweatin GL and AOTC, well your just in for dissapointment. Cats nowadays can't relate to the quality of the classical movies;... for them ANH is the Lawerence of Arabia of our time(and there are a lot of people in these forums who don't even feel A New Hope is better than AOTC!!) You look like you're here for some serious discussion; but alas, this isn't really a discussion forum; it's a Lucas love-in.
By the way, you a little peeved at SWfan2002; are you really Gary Kurtz??
so i am also pretentious in saying the remake of rollerball is just as good as the original?
Did you see that HBO film? I think it was called RKO 281(?). It really covered the events surrounding the making of Kane fairly well. I agree that it is a darn good film, but not perfect.
Lol, no you would not be pretentious for that keen observation.
No, Rollerball is not one of the greatest films of all time.
EDIT: I don't think you are pretentious, but some of your views sound like it.
nothing is perfect... im not saying anything is... but there are degrees of quality.
That was my list, and not Evazan's: just to put things straight I suppose.
why you gotta go and declare some things perfect you pretentious ass?!!!!
nothing is perfect... im not saying anything is... but there are degrees of quality.
But those degrees are not absolute. They stem completely from personal preference. Perhaps your philosophies on film are simply different than others'. I'm not saying you're wrong and everyone else is right, but certain people like certain things for certain reasons.
For instance, I LOVE Monty Python. Living in the US, most people think its utter garbage. But I enjoy it. I don't pretend to think that its above anyone's head or that those people cannot discern comedy from stupidity. For some reason , it just makes me laugh.
I don't think AOTC will ever be on any kind of list as a great film. But it will remain to be one of my favorites. I tend not to think or criticize a movie while I view it. I just stop to enjoy. And enjoy it, I did.
EDIT: I didn't mean to be that harsh with you Evazen. I can see you are already starting to have fun with it.
Oh ........My bad AL. Great list man;...same thing applies..
P.S. Is Dr.Evazan really Gary Kurtz??
monty python is GREAT!!!
and yes i am gary kurtz... pretty cool huh?
yes! you in the home made biker scout outfit.
"do you think lucas has lost it?"
well, that is a tough question to answer. i think the problem is he has forgotten to take a step back and let close friends and advisors help him when there are elements he has trouble executing well, but overall, no i dont think hes lost it... i just think hes a little lost.
any more questions?
yes! the guy wearing a monitor over his face depicting the digital version of yoda...