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Amph Gotham - the TV series

Discussion in 'Community' started by Violent Violet Menace, Feb 25, 2014.

  1. Sith_Sensei__Prime

    Sith_Sensei__Prime Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 22, 2000
    Yeah, but I would think he would have learned how to run things when he was under Fish Mooney's wing. I guess he didn't learn that part then. It's probably too early for Penguin to be the crime boss we know so well.

    I like the progression of Bruce Wayne though, like in last night episode when he was sparing with Pennyworth's old chum (who's name a cannot recall).

    I also really thought that Selina would
    Put on the dress offered by Barbara as Catwoman does us her sexuality as a weapon.
     
  2. heels1785

    heels1785 Skywalker Saga + JCC Manager / Finally Won A Draft star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    The interesting thing about Gotham is that, even with the internet's bashing and anti-DC tilt, it still beats Agents of Shield and Agent Carter every week.
     
  3. Sith_Sensei__Prime

    Sith_Sensei__Prime Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 22, 2000
    Because the mainstream audience loves themselves some Batman. It's name recognition. The General Public recognizes names like Bruce Wayne, Alfred, Penguin, etc. A-List (B-Iist at the lowest) characters in a show that they can easily follow.

    Agents of SHIELD and Agent Carter, the core characters are pretty much D-list characters. Meaning, they don't have any cache or years of fandom. Neither of these shows have well developed antagonists or villains. However, I expect Marvel's other shows like Daredevil and Jessica Jones will be more popular because they will follow the standard super hero archetype.
     
  4. heels1785

    heels1785 Skywalker Saga + JCC Manager / Finally Won A Draft star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    They are also inferior shows.

    I am excited to see Daredevil, though. An underrated early Marvel film.
     
  5. GenAntilles

    GenAntilles Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2007
    Eh, depends how you judge it.

    In terms of storytelling and immersion into the universe AoS and Carter blow Gotham out of the water. I have to constantly explain and rationalize stuff away in Gotham by going 'it's just how it works in this world' which I don't have to do with AoS or Carter
     
  6. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    I'd put Gotham in the middle of the current comic book shows. Constantine is the clear king in terms of quality, followed by Agent Carter and then AOS (Carter is just more consistent- probably because of its limited series format).

    Gotham follows that, IMO. When it works (usually Gordon's occasional good man goes to war moments), it really is an emotional high, while at other times it leaves you scratching your head a bit.

    The Flash ranks a distant last- it's not a good show by any measure, but it's competently executed. Haven't watched Arrow yet so can't comment much other than I get the impression it's considered to be notably better than The Flash (and the crossover episode with Arrow that I saw would suggest he's a more compelling character/actor).

    Re: Penguin's club management skills, I get the impression he knows how to run the club in terms of the normal day to day (ordering, etc)- he's just terrible at finding or selecting talent to attract clientele with and is just unfamiliar with the extra-business factors like Maroney's control over the liquor shipments in that part of town.
     
  7. Only-One Cannoli

    Only-One Cannoli Ex-Mod star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Aug 20, 2003
    At least we both agree that Flash is in the back. But I prefer Gotham to all the others, and I hate everything DC. Dunno why, they're pretty clever with their casting and know how to hook the audience even if it's not with top quality.
     
  8. dp4m

    dp4m Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2001

    Yes, that's true, but Gotham may not have hit bottom yet. Agents of SHIELD crushed Gotham's debut -- and steadily went down and now has a basically steady viewership (with Agent Carter being below that). I'd expect to see Gotham there by the end of the year / next year since it's... not as good as Agents of SHIELD now that it found it's narrative coherence after The Winter Soldier last year.

    Interestingly, and totally unsurprising, Gotham and Agents of SHIELD are -- by far -- their network's number 1 time shifted show for additional ratings. This brings AoS closer in line with Gotham, though Gotham is still on top.

    Also, I still can't believe that Revenge is ABC's #2 show for time shifting...

    You're a funny guy. Maybe you're The Joker? The series can't decide so that makes sense...

    EDIT: And The Flash is awesome! You people are cray-cray!
     
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  9. Ezio Skywalker

    Ezio Skywalker Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2013
    Perhaps only slightly pertinent, but Guardians of the Galaxy was a film that revolved around D-list characters, yet it was a very well received film. The problem with AoS isn't the public recognition of characters, but in the overall portrayal of those characters and the execution of plots. AoS needed Captain 2 and was still feeding on that film's momentum because, imo, it can't generate its own.




    Regarding Flash: I can watch it but I don't care about it. There's nothing that's particularly gripping about the show. AoS did the villain of the week format for a while, too, and it didn't do them any favors. It's essentially Power Rangers, but with the Flash instead.


    The thing Gotham occasionally does better is when it focuses on longer story arcs instead of the occasional villain of the week (which are mere filler episodes instead of the basic format of the entire series, like Flash).

    My two cents, anyway.
     
  10. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    Ah, thanks- that better sums up what I've been trying to articulate. It feels like a show meant for a younger audience than it is supposedly aimed at. I had been thinking "this almost feels like a Disney Channel show" as far as tone goes but that would have been a tad too harsh. But, format-wise, your description is pretty solid.
     
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  11. Sith_Sensei__Prime

    Sith_Sensei__Prime Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 22, 2000
    I think the comparison between Power Rangers and the Flash is a bit of a stretch.

    I think Flash is more like most of the shows on CW, which is having the lead characters wanting but unable to romantically involved with the objects of the affections while the world around them falls apart and they keep secrets from each other. Ya know, the same formula for Smallville, Charmed, Buffy, Vampire Diaries, etc.

    I'm not going to disparage any of the comic book based TV shows because I like them all.

    Now, I'm going to do a bit of stretching and say that Gotham is like Game of Throne as the characters fight for the control of Gotham. Don Falcone is the Kingpin and the rest are plotting to still his throne. Of course there knights, jesters, assassins, maidens, wizards, healers, a would be prince, (corporate) raiders and conspirators, etc. in the kingdom.
     
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  12. dp4m

    dp4m Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2001
    No one saw last night? That was one of the best episodes they did -- and possibly one of the most interesting character developments in young Bruce Wayne's life.

    The Fish part with Dollmaker is still nonsense, but literally everything else in the episode was awesome.

    1) Gordon, Bullock, Dent, and Penguin all basically on the same side -- though IIRC Gordon and Bullock are wise enough not to put Dent and Penguin in the same room.

    2) Everything Penguin.

    3) Everything Bullock.

    4) Alfred teaching Bruce not to go to the police.

    5) Cat showing up relatively organically for once...
     
  13. darth-calvin

    darth-calvin Jedi Grand Master star 2

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2002
    Saw it. I've been enjoying this series, but last night was probably my least favorite episode.

    While I worry the Fish story is now basically doing gruesome just to do gruesome and further establish the darkness of series, there is something about the character that I really just like. She has a presence and I want to see more of her. I have hope that this story line and its ugliness is leading her to becoming a super twisted badass when she returns home.

    I really like the developments for Gordon and Bullock - after going on his pious crusade, Gordon ends up trading away some of his idealism and getting something for Bullock in return. I also really liked how Bullock seems genuinely concerned about Jim losing himself to Gotham's corruption.

    So far, I have not been able to get behind Bruce's character. Not that I hate it, just somewhat disinterested. But, the whole thing with him now challenging the board of Wayne Enterprises is really stretching the limits of plausibility for me. Maybe I just haven't been paying enough attention to his development. Maybe they have established him as a super brilliant intellect capable of taking on a group of powerful adult business leaders who obviously know the ins and outs of the business world. Personally, I'm not buying it.
     
  14. Ezio Skywalker

    Ezio Skywalker Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2013
    I think that they forgot to introduce Bruce as a super intellect and expect the audience to forgive that slip and pretend that they covered that base. Regardless, the young actor portraying Bruce is fantastic and very believable in his role.

    Still can't stand Fish. Get rid of her already.
     
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  15. Sith_Sensei__Prime

    Sith_Sensei__Prime Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 22, 2000
    Yeah, I thought they would drop the Fish character when she exiled herself from Gotham on got on that boat. I'm thinking since she's still around she's going to make a big come to Gotham, the same way Penguin did. The Fish character did get some Bat-villain-cred with me when she pulled out one of her own eye balls. I also like the Dr. Dulmacher character as we've haven't seen that character in a live action version before and adds the creepy characters of the show. I mean, it was pretty wacked out crazy when they revealed the fate of the office manager. Definitely a What the Frak moments. The Kingdom of Gotham expands its borders.

    Yes, the actor that plays the young prince of the Gotham is pretty awesome. Very good stuff when he ordered Pennyworth back to bed.

    It was interesting all the deal makings of Ned Stark ERRRRRRR Jim Gordon, (Ned Stark too honorable, while Jim will get his hands dirty). I mean Gordo got the Commissioner to

    Hand over Bullock's file and appoint him for candidate for the President of the Police Union rather than that crooked cop.
    .
     
  16. GenAntilles

    GenAntilles Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2007
    I'm wondering how long it'll be before Leslie gets put in the cross-hairs considering she's the EASIEST way now to control Gordon.
     
  17. Todd the Jedi

    Todd the Jedi Mod and Loving Tyrant of SWTV, Lit, & Collecting star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 16, 2008
    Or until Leslie and Barbara meet and Babs is all like "I'm his fiancé, who the hell do you think you are?" because Jim's love life is the most important aspect of this show.
     
  18. Yodaminch

    Yodaminch Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 6, 2002
    The CGI for the office manager was cartoonishly bad. So bad it shouldn't have been shown.
     
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  19. Ezio Skywalker

    Ezio Skywalker Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2013
    Barbara is going to need some serious character development and rewriting if they expect us to believe that Jim will eventually marry this twit.
     
  20. Sith_Sensei__Prime

    Sith_Sensei__Prime Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 22, 2000
    Yeah, I get the feeling she has ulterior motives. She could be another person working for Falcone.

    Perhaps, but it's a TV show budget so I can forgive the poor CGI effect there. I still that it was creepy though. I mean, that ain't right.


    Word! However, I think they took a small step in that direction with Barbara returning to her apartment and not kicking out Ivy and Selina and realizing how much she love Gordon.
     
  21. dp4m

    dp4m Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2001
    It was Jeffrey Combs. Of course the CGI was bad with him. :p

    Also, it wasn't any worse than things on, say, Constantine this season...
     
  22. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    Given the tie Combs has to mad scientists and reanimated bodyparts, it was at least amusing. ;)

    I would disagree there- the FX have generally been pretty good on Constantine.
     
  23. dp4m

    dp4m Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2001

    The "original serpent" demon was terrrrrrrible and most things on Gotham are also okay so it's not like they're normally bad.
     
  24. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    I've still got 2 episodes of Constantine to go, so I guess I didn't see what you're referring to yet. But the other stuff I've seen has generally been pretty good- even the full-CG characters.
     
  25. dp4m

    dp4m Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2001
    *** WARNING ***

    PSA: There are spoilers around on the interwebs basically EVERYWHERE about people who may or may not be returning in season 2, so please be careful out there is you are avoiding spoilers.