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Full Series Grade the Episode: 103: Shadow of Malevolence

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV- Completed Shows' started by Garth Maul, Apr 20, 2011.

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Grade the Episode: 103: Shadow of Malevolence

Poll closed Jul 19, 2011.
  1. 10

    21.4%
  2. 9

    21.4%
  3. 8

    32.1%
  4. 7

    14.3%
  5. 6

    3.6%
  6. 5

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  7. 4

    3.6%
  8. 3

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  9. 2

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. 1

    3.6%
  1. NYCitygurl

    NYCitygurl Manager Emeritus star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jul 20, 2002
    I give this a 7.

    My unobservant self didn't notice the quotes [face_blush] just the end. Grievous and Anakin were both good (I especially liked Anakin's pain over losing the clones). The trip through the Nebula was kinda cool, though my favoite image was Malevolence in hyperspace. Awesome colors.

    Good episode.
     
  2. Executor_of_Order66

    Executor_of_Order66 Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Jul 14, 2009
    9/10

    First time I watch this episode I was bored. After rewatching it I realized it was better. I like how Anakin was willing to risk everything to achieve his mission and Ahsoka had to pull him back. I will agree though that the speed did seem slow. By the way how does a star fighter fall down in space after being hit? Overall this is still the time they were trying to recreate the movies' feel of star wars and although some people don't like that, I think it worked well in this episode.
     
  3. Darth_Tarkus

    Darth_Tarkus Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2011
    After not being able to decide between 7 and 8 for awhile, I ultimately gave it an 8 for the unfair reason that, as Gry pointed out, it's basically the only episode we have devoted almost entirely to space battles. There may be one more at the beginning of the Ryloth arc but that's pretty much it. You'd think out of three seasons a Star Wars show entirely devoted to war would have more than - two - space battle episodes. Although, to be fair, season three had very few actual war episodes, I'd say less than 5.

    But, back on-topic, this is a highly enjoyable episode. The whole sequence with the nebula was a great idea that was executed fabulously in my opinion. It is one of the most unique and fantastical scenes of all TCW.

    And did anyone notice that the composer rips off Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan quite blatantly? Listen to the music playing from the very beginning of the scene where Admiral Yularen is watching all the Y-Wings plus Plo depart from inside the ship. Then skip to 1:14 on this youtube video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7w18yZdeRl4 They both use an ABAC pattern and while B and C are different that doesn't diminish the fact that A (which is the main part of the theme) is exactly the same in both - almost identical rhythm with almost identical melody with almost identical background. Please, people, check this out.

    They state before and after the mission that the goal is to take out General Grievous, and presumably if they take out the bridge they take out both Grievous and the ship's capability to use the ion cannon.
     
  4. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    I know, but they could have went for the ion cannon in the first place instead of going to destroy the bridge.
     
  5. Darth_Tarkus

    Darth_Tarkus Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2011
    ...in which case they would not have destroyed General Grievous, which was their goal.
     
  6. Darth_Zandalor

    Darth_Zandalor Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 2, 2009
    Their "Goal" was to defend the Medical Station. It was Anakin's personal vendetta against Grievous that botched the plan.
     
  7. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    You know Grievous cannot be killed before ROTS, right? :p

    Initially the plan to kill Grievous was basically pointless, since many know Grievous cannot die and something will happen to prevent Anakin's plan from working. The way I see it is that attacking the ion cannon in the first place, which was their new plan, would make better sense since that is the main threat toward Republic fleets and facilities in space. Trying to take out the bridge to hopefully kill Grievous (I don't think Anakin knows Grievous is on the bridge at the same time they are trying to take out of the bridge) and knock out the cannon's controls first can set up a very predicable outcome for the many viewers.
     
  8. Darth_Tarkus

    Darth_Tarkus Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2011
    The specific goal of that squadron of Y-Wings - as stated multiple times in the episode - was to kill General Grievous by destroying the bridge. It's made pretty clear through both Clone Wars series and especially Ep. III that taking out Grievous is a pivotal goal in the war, so whether or not General Skywalker is making his decision based on his feelings doesn't really effect whether the goal is justified - it clearly is. This isn't my opinion, you can find it in the scripts. Even if by some impossible objective moral truth he was wrong because of his reasoning, it was still a goal that was completely endorsed by those on his side IU.
     
  9. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    Yeah, I know. I stated their goal had a very predicable outcome since its conception in the episode.

    Yeah, and the thing is Anakin probably doesn't know Grievous is on the bridge. He could be somewhere on the Malevolence, and the controls to the ion cannon could have backups outside of the bridge. I did see Anakin setting himself up for failure, because of the known outcome and then what I have said above. I think taking out the ion cannon first as their primary goal would have made much better sense. It's stupid of Anakin to take his clone fighters down the ship's top deck (like the Death Star's trench), evading blaster fire from turret towers, en route to the bridge.
     
  10. Darth_Tarkus

    Darth_Tarkus Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2011
    I didn't say I thought they had an infallible plan, I was just reiterating things from the script you seemed to be asking about. Why not just go for the ion cannon? Because they thought it was more important to go for Grievous.
     
  11. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    I should have separated me agreeing with your point with what I said that isn't about your points. Sorry for the confusion.

    Obviously Anakin was locked up somewhere because taking out Grievous is more important than taking out the main problem Republic fleets are facing. Taking out the one person that is controlling the ion cannon can be replaced by another commander. Anakin has seen what the ion cannon is capable of doing, but why take out Grievous when you can take out the source of the problem the Republic is facing.
     
  12. Darth_Tarkus

    Darth_Tarkus Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2011
    Ah, okay. :)

    I could spend a lot of words explaining the opposing view on that, but since I don't entirely agree with it, I'll save us both the time and energy. Ultimately I think the story works convincingly because although it is arguably a near-impossible task, General Skywalker is unarguably capable of many near-impossible tasks, and thus it pans out realistically: he is one of the only survivors, and must be willing to take the advice of others and change his mind in order to salvage a worthwhile accomplishment for the mission rather than losing all the clones and dropping a single bomb on the cockpit that accomplishes nothing. To me it says something about the human condition.
     
  13. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    Anakin's "All right new plan, take out the starboard ion cannon," still could have been his first goal.

    "Our bombers will attack at high speed to avoid the enemy's ion weapon. We'll concentrate our firepower on the bridge superstructure, here. We destroy Grievous, we can bring the war to a quicker end."
    I still see many issues/questions with his overall goal here.
     
  14. Darth_Tarkus

    Darth_Tarkus Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2011
    Like I said, it's not an infallible plan, but it does have consistent internal logic. Personally, I don't pay attention to military strategy too much since it's not exactly an area of expertise for me. I like to focus on other things, like what I was getting at with my previous post.
     
  15. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    It's not a real strong area for the Jedi during the CW either. :p
     
  16. Darth_Tarkus

    Darth_Tarkus Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2011
    They are "peace-keepers" after all. Just ask Captain Tarkin. [face_skull]
     
  17. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    It's debatable, I guess. :p
     
  18. Swashbucklingjedi

    Swashbucklingjedi Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 3, 2010
    do you mean those above the Malevolence- well i guess ship as massive as Malevolence has enough gravity of it's own to affect flightpaths of the fighters- then it can be malfunction in steering controls whatever what causes ship to go some direction.....

    they shouldn't do open spacebattles but battles above planets like Coruscant or even Death Star (kind of) was- so they wouldn't do falling mistakes- there is no up or down in space so nothing can be "shot down" really just shot- if there is nothing that would pull them "down"- above Malevolence there was Malevolence at least- well SW has pretty much nothing to do with physics anyway with fiery explosions and sound in vacuum, travelling faster than lightspeed and using plasmasabers and blasterbolts...... but Gravity is thing that should make some kind of sense in-universe since it sometimes realistic sometimes not- would be nice to see spacebattle that wouldn't be on straight level but completely in a mess with no up or down but ships "upside down" and all- would be cool....
     
  19. Robimus

    Robimus Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 6, 2007
    So I love how the Malevolence is like a big shark and how R2 is once again included in a meaningful way in the story.

    Grievous is coughing a bit early here isn't he?

    Shadow Squadron........I'd prefer the see a Soulless Squadron launch from fromn Malevolence, but enough with my fanfic.

    Battle Droid humor was awesome.

    Grievous once again equals a complete fail. He doesn't have an original thought. ANd why is he crying about the ship not being fast enough? Yeah, brilliant leader that one.

    Loved the Whales in the Balmorra Run, though why Plo thinks they are chasing the squad is a little beyond me. More like they are trying to get out of the way.

    Too much OT dialog.

    Cool medical base, though I like my Fishmeal a bit less compassionate.

    7/10
     
  20. Gry Sarth

    Gry Sarth Ex 2x Banhammer Wielding Besalisk Mod star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 24, 1999
    The thing is, if they just destroyed the Ion Cannon, Grievous could simply escape into hyperspace, put his ship in dry-dock for a while, and come back to prey on Republic ships in no time. If they destroyed the bridge, they'd kill the CIS' main general and behead the Malevolence (and in SW, there are apparently no backup bridges or anything like that), which would essentially render the ship useless and helpless.

    Of course, in the episode, by destroying the Ion Cannon, they somehow automatically destroy the opposite cannon, disable the ship's defenses and engines. However, they couldn't have expected all that to happen, that was just a very convenient strike of luck. So I think the original plan makes sense, the only thing is that it would require a squad of Anakins to accomplish...
     
  21. jonas_jade

    jonas_jade Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2005
    8/10 from me.

    Very Star Wars to me, encountering the Neebray mantas on the Balmorra Run is very much in the style of encountering random monsters en route from the movies, the battle scene was great as was Anakin's little struggle with completing the mission/ losing men.

    I know I sway a lot with the droid humour, between it working and not working, but I thought it worked well in this episode with how Count Dooku mentions that the droids are expensive and Jedi would never treat their clones in the same way.

    I remember when first watching this was when I knew that they were able to pull the series off and that the 'Star Wars' format could be very workable within a 30 min series, and still satisfying - at this point they'd managed to make three great episodes back to back.

    Having just finished watching the episode, while I was watching it, when that bit came up I thought of Star Trek, but I didn't know why. I was trying to work it out since the scene didn't really resemble any notable Star Trek scenes I could think of visually.... but now I know! The music is very very similar!

    It would be more inertia rather than objects "falling" anywhere.

    Don't confuse inertia for gravity - in space you basically have no forces to stop motion, so once an object is set moving in one direction it will continue indefinitely until acted upon by another force.
     
  22. ImNotAStarWarsFanboy

    ImNotAStarWarsFanboy Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 25, 2011
    Another 7, though it's really only for the clone chatter on their day out to destroy a Separatist warship. The rest...meh.
     
  23. Swashbucklingjedi

    Swashbucklingjedi Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Sometimes it's not pointless to see HOW something happened even if you know it did happen- you may still be insterested how it happened.... that's the whole point of this show- you know outcome of the war but not how it went.....
     
  24. ImNotAStarWarsFanboy

    ImNotAStarWarsFanboy Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 25, 2011
    I really don't think 'go after a character we know survives to ROTS or beyond' episodes are pointless. At least IU, it would make no sense to NOT go after the leader of the droid armies in an attempt to end the war quickly. And, Mace kinda implied in ROTS that Grievous has a history of escaping clashes with the Jedi ie. "General Grievous will run and hide as he always does. He's a coward." I'd like to see a few instances of this happening, though I feel that by now, they've done enough of the running and hiding, and from now on Grievous really needs to step up his game and actually finish some fights. Mr Besalisk can be the first volunteer ;)
     
  25. CT-867-5309

    CT-867-5309 Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2011
    I've always wondered why the hell so many ships have their bridge sticking out into space like a target shouting "shoot me!".

    Why would you do that, ever?

    I would always bury the bridge below several decks, closer to the center of the ship, protected as much as possible.