Gray Davis and California Recall results thread

Almost election day...wow, I really can't believe this is going to happen. And it is such a mess in the state that neither national political party has thrown their weight into the campaign, or are posed to win or lose nationally.

Unappatising?

...Mr Davis?s staying power should not be discounted. Far from giving up the fight, the governor has tramped around the state promising (rather vaguely) to become more effective if given a second chance. He has also signed a flurry of bills recently that will remind the faithful of the benefits of having a Democrat in office. Last month he approved legislation allowing illegal immigrants to get driving licences (Mr Schwarzenegger has vowed to repeal it if elected). On Sunday he signed a bill that will require more employers to provide health-insurance for employees starting in 2006.

Mr Bustamante could also foil Mr Schwarzenegger. Admittedly it seems increasingly unlikely: the lieutenant-governor is an unexciting politician who has faded from the headlines?and the polls?in the crucial final week. His best hope is to be seen as the ?Not Gray, Not Arnold? alternative. Though Mr Bustamante might be expected to gather most of the votes of his fellow Latinos, relatively few of these are expected to vote. If Mr Davis survives, relations between himself and his lieutenant-governor will be testy at the least.

Barring another Bush v Gore vote-counting row, the results of California?s poll (the unofficial ones, at least) may be known relatively soon. But the victor may soon be disappointed by the spoils. Running California can be a wretched job. It is harder than most governorships in America, not only because of California?s size and diversity, but also because the state government is often hamstrung by Californians? insistence on direct democracy. Ballot initiatives?things to be decided by the people rather than politicians?are commonplace. On Tuesday, for example, Californians will also be voting on Proposition 54 (whether to bar the state from gathering race-related data) and Proposition 53 (which would force the state to dedicate a certain proportion of its budget to an infrastructure-modernisation fund). Empowering the people sounds nice in theory; in practice, it makes it very hard for Sacramento politicians to balance the budget and take care of other state business. After a rollercoaster campaign, California?s next governor will have an even rockier ride ahead.

 

Why do politicians have to throw people's personal lives into these debates. Why didn't those women come forward sooner? The state of California is all that matters to me. I live in California and I'd rather see Arnold focus on improving the state rather than dodging accusations. I actually met Arnold twice; well, the first time he almost even hit me with his car (almost two years ago) in Beverly Hills. But I still voted for him because I liked his ideals and his visions for the state of California.

 

I think it's hilarious really. I mean, look at it! The same people who attacked Clinton for his sexual misbehaviors are defending Schwarzenegger's sexual misbehaviors.

It's really kind of funny. I guess you can only grope if you're a Republican.

 

Isn't that an overgeneralization there Chev?

You could have just as easily have said:

"It is funny how the same people who claimed that Clinton's sexual misdeeds should have remained private, are now engaging in the exact opposite behavior with Arnold."

But we wouldn't want to label any one group now, would we....

 

"It is funny how the same people who claimed that Clinton's sexual misdeeds should have remained private, are now engaging in the exact opposite behavior with Arnold."

Well, sure, they're taking their lead from previous Rep antics. They made such a big stink about it with Clinton that they've latched onto the idea that these things must be "bad", so they attack Arnold. Problem is, he's a Republican and thus, by what I hear from other Republicans, he's apparently exempt.

Just like Dubya was exempt from being a cocaine user and a convidted drunk driver, but Clinton was lambasted for "not inhaling". Another laughable double-standard.

 

Today is the day.

The Schwarzenator

 

ARE WE PAYING ATTENTION?
Myth: Gov. Gray Davis caused the California energy crisis.
Reality: Republican Gov. Wilson promoted and signed energy deregulation. Davis complained that Enron was manipulating the markets and asked the Bush administration to impose price caps. Bush's administration did nothing. Today, Bush's friend Ken Lay, former Enron CEO, hasn't even been indicted for ripping off billions of dollars and destroying lives of his own employees and investors. As reported in the L.A. Times, in the midst of our energy crisis, Arnold Schwarzenegger, among other select GOP leaders, attended a private meeting called by Ken Lay in hopes of stopping investigations of market manipulations.
Myth: Davis created California's budget deficit.
Reality: Davis did not cause the bust in the stock market. Davis didn't cook these companies' books. When the stock market collapsed, California lost approximately 25 percent of its total revenues, due to a loss of taxes on capital gains and stock options. California is one of 48 states with significant deficits. Bush's policies have created a $698 billion deficit in our nation's budget; turned Clinton's $5.6 trillion 10-year budget surplus into a $6.7 trillion debt, increasing $1.6 billion per day - over $12 trillion lost in 31 months.
Myth: Davis wasted California's surpluses.
Reality: Most was spent on eduction (30 percent), mandated by the voters in Proposition 98; health and human services (40 percent);11 percent of the surplus went to higher education; and 8 percent went to the California correctional system. Bush's budget report, shelved prior to the tax cut vote, now shows: Page 1 - $455 billion deficit, but buried on page 57 is the factual amount of $698 billion. Nobel Laureate economist George Akerlof calls Bush's tax cuts for the wealthy and no-bid Iraqi contracts nothing short of looting our national treasury. Presidential candidate Howard Dean defines Bush's tax cuts as "part of a radical agenda" to dismantle Social Security, Medicare and our public schools through financial starvation. Extremist Republicans succeeded in diverting our attention from Washington by creating a three-ring circus here in California. If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention.

 

EDIT: Cool. Did the newspaper print that?

 

sorry you should be


I sent that into my local newspaper a few weeks back (Appeal Democrat)

 

yeah in the editorial page.

Which LOL was very surprising to me. LOL The name Appeal Democrat is misleading. LOL Its a very Republic paper.

 

Very succinctly put, Lord_D_V! I obviously couldn't have put it better.

Simple reasoning? Perhaps. But I'm a man of principal... and one with a worthless voice at the moment.

Would a man of principal not be more concerned with the reality of the actual perpetrators, rather than the political scapegoat?

 

ANY idiot who approves legislation so ILLEGAL immigrants can get drivers licenses, should not only be recalled, but locked up for threatening National Security!

 

Well, according to the Drudgereport, Davis loses the recall 41-59, Shwartzy wins 51% of the vote, meaning he has a clear and effective mandate.

I feel bad for Davis, but can't wait for the fun of the Governator. But you know what, there is always a sequel, and TOTAL RECALL II is already being initiated in California.

 

ANY idiot who approves legislation so ILLEGAL immigrants can get drivers licenses, should not only be recalled, but locked up for threatening National Security!

I agree completely with this statement, Qui-Rune.

 

Looks like Davis is indeed going to be recalled as the results are coming in now...

And Arnold will be elected GOVERNATOR of CA.

 

This will be a day long remembered............

 

As a the beginning of brightness or the beginning of the end?

CNN has cast the election as Yes on Recall, Yes on Schwarzenegger based on exit polls.

 

I can't believe Arnold is the new governor. I have never been so ashamed to be a Californian before.

 

Hey, I live in CA, and I'm happy!

Arnold couldn't possibly do a worse job than Davis.

 

Joe said

I can't believe Arnold is the new governor. I have never been so ashamed to be a Californian before.

Even more ashamed then the OJ Trial? That was the worst period for me to be a Californian, nothing was a bigger farce and a bigger disgrace on this state then that.

As a side note...my original Endorsee...Gary Coleman...came in 10th PLACE everyone!! So for Princess Tina and the others who bashed the Little Guy....HA!!!

 

Even more ashamed then the OJ Trial? That was the worst period for me to be a Californian, nothing was a bigger farce and a bigger disgrace on this state then that.

Comparing a murder trial to an election is like comparing apples to oranges. The outcome of that case had no affect on the state's political leadership and was a personal matter of two families seeking justice that was blown completely out of proportion by the media, not California. The outcome of this recent recall election DOES reflect the general consensus of the people and will affect the state's poltical leadership. There does appear to be a similarity with the two examples, in both scenarios those who had the ultimate decision making power, the jury in the O.J. case and the voting public in the recall election, were swayed by one major factor: fame.

 

Comparing a murder trial to an election is like comparing apples to oranges. The outcome of that case had no affect on the state's political leadership and was a personal matter of two families seeking justice that was blown completely out of proportion by the media, not California.

You must not have left the state during the OJ Trial. Before that trial, I was always at the forefront in defending California as the greatest state in the Union, even though I was rapidly seeing, as I was in the military in Georgia at the time, that states like Florida and Georgia and others had things that were more appealing to me. The OJ Trial made total jackasses out of the state of California and that was the most embarrassing time I ever had in being a californian.


The outcome of this recent recall election DOES reflect the general consensus of the people and will affect the state's poltical leadership. There does appear to be a similarity with the two examples, in both scenarios those who had the ultimate decision making power, the jury in the O.J. case and the voting public in the recall election, were swayed by one major factor: fame.

Good point.

 

The OJ Trial made total jackasses out of the state of California and that was the most embarrassing time I ever had in being a californian.

How so? I don't recall the state itself setting up a 24-hour national television network or a newspaper organization devoted solely to broadcasting and delivering up to the minute information on the so called Trial of the Century. And if you're referring to the eventual outcome, injustices happen in our nation's court rooms all the time, it is not a phenomenom associated solely with California.

 

This is a sad day for California

It is a time of darkness in the immediate future of the world's 5th largest economy. No one knows the extent of Arnold's tax initiatives. He has never come clean with what his actions as the head of this state will be. All he keeps stating is, his philosophy of 'openning the books and auditing.' Then what is the rest of his plans?

Arnold will be very surprised to find that most 'book cooking' done in Sacramento was done by Republican members other than Democrats, which spring from days long ago under the regime of the Wilson administration.

But, as a player with a chip in the 'big game,' Arnold will sweep the Republican's piliging of our state's revenues and surplus's under the carpet, knowing full well, when he is charged with sexual assault in the future, he will pull out his chip and wave it in front of his fellow Republican constituents who will then fix his trial.

[side note: If Maria thinks he's been faithful to her these last many years, then I have some 'ocean front property' in Nevada I would like to sell her.]

But lets face it. Californians have always been star struck. Californians go giddy over a famous face. And like Clinton, Arnold has carisma, but unlike Clinton, Arnold hasn't a clue in running an elected office. Sure he has signed pay checks as he states; Schatzi's in L.A. and lets not forget the comical franchise of musical share holders: Planet Hollywood. A fledgling franchise that from the start, couldn't come to grips with its own identity crisis. So, yes Arnold has business experience, just not that impressive. Which will make California civilians very nervous in the weeks to come.

[Totall Recall II, in 6 months]

As for the comment about illegal aliens receiveing drivers licenses:

For someone being in Law Enforcement, it will be easier for me to track them and identify the criminal elements. Also, everyone seems to be missing the 'big picture' here. That is instant revenue for the state. At $10 a license, and relizing that 3-5% of the California population are illegal aliens, that is alot of revenue for the state, which in turn, Davis would have been able to repeal the 300% car tax hike that got him in this mess. Trust me, the Republicans knew this far too well. The drivers license initiative has been coming for quite some time now.

[side note II: It would have served the Republicans right if Larry Flint won the election. He may be the biggest porn king in the world, but lets face it, he is a very savvy business man, and has challenged the laws of our nation, and won.]


This has also set a very dangerous precedent in democracy that our founding fathers faught for. The notion that one can be recalled for making hard decisions in the governing of a state might make our leaders weak in their appointed duties. Look at the great leaders of this nation's history.

- George Washington - having the guts to stand up to the mighty Brittish Empire while half the American Colonies supported the Brittish rule.
- Abraham Lincoln - going to war with his fellow countryman to keep the country together which in turn, abolished slavery
- Frankin Roosevelt - riding the storm of depression out, and for starting a program that has guaranteed the retirement of every US resident, and for declaring war on an evil oriental empire
- Harry Truman - for dropping the bomb and bringing the war, (which if the war would have raged on, would have caused the death of an estimated 500,000 more US soldiers) to a swift end.

What if some of these leaders didn't do what they needed to do for fear of being recalled by the people? Where would this country be then?

Bush sure didn't worry about public opinion when he sent hundreds of soldiers, men and women both, to their deaths in Iraq over a lie to the American people and the world.

I am sure when Hyrem Johnson included this clause in California's constitution, he did not mean for it to be used in such a way, and with such a minimum amount of signatures gathered.


People have said, 'California coul