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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Census Greatest Empire in history

Discussion in 'Community' started by Ender Sai, Oct 1, 2015.

?

Imperialism is good, Darth Guy, stop it.

  1. The Roman/Holy Roman Empire

    16 vote(s)
    36.4%

  2. Persian

    1 vote(s)
    2.3%

  3. Ottoman

    1 vote(s)
    2.3%

  4. Mongol

    4 vote(s)
    9.1%

  5. Han Dynasty

    1 vote(s)
    2.3%

  6. The Russian Empire (no, not the USSR...)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%

  7. THE BRITISH EMPIRE

    20 vote(s)
    45.5%

  8. French Empire

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%

  9. Austro-Hungarian (I'm kidding guys, relax)

    1 vote(s)
    2.3%
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  1. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    I don't know. The post-1492 European maritime empires especially had a different approach. From Britannia to Syria, people (especially urban populations) assimilated into (Greco-)Roman culture and thought of themselves as "Roman." The white supremacist character of the British Empire ended up making even those in the colonies who thought of themselves as "British" want to get the hell out. I doubt that if, say, Great Britain had fallen to Napoleon or Imperial Germany or the Third Reich, that the Empire would have continued as a Hindu-speaking realm based in Delhi. :p And neo-colonialism wasn't a thing when the Roman/Byzantine Empire collapsed.
     
    Darth Guy, Oct 3, 2015
    #76
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  2. ShaneP

    ShaneP Ex-Mod Officio star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Mar 26, 2001
    I vote for the Dutch!

    Contributions in ship building and navigation. Helped establish Manhattan as a viable commercial port(Nieuw Amsterdam).

    Also had one of the most successful corporations ever with the Dutch West India Co. 10% profit annually for two centuries.

    Okay, my dutch bias is showing. I will shut up now. [face_blush]
     
    ShaneP, Oct 3, 2015
    #77
    SuperWatto likes this.
  3. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    I don't know that surviving as a second rate power for 50 years after one's imperial heyday is better than 2000 years on top, but hey. I also don't know that finding a bunch of people who speak English in a tiny colonial enclave versus dominating the language and culture of three continents for millennia is a great comparison either. :p

    When most empires fell, their subjects were happy. When the Roman Empire fell -- well, it had no subjects because everyone was a citizen, and all of the provincial citizens were sad.
     
    GrandAdmiralJello , Oct 3, 2015
    #78
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  4. DarthPhilosopher

    DarthPhilosopher Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 23, 2011
    Have we established that the Holy Roman Empire is completely different from the Roman Empire?
     
    DarthPhilosopher, Oct 3, 2015
    #79
  5. Lord Vivec

    Lord Vivec Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Apr 17, 2006
    No darth fill officer it's only you so far
     
    Lord Vivec, Oct 3, 2015
    #80
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  6. DarthPhilosopher

    DarthPhilosopher Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 23, 2011
    [​IMG]
     
    DarthPhilosopher, Oct 3, 2015
    #81
  7. Ender Sai

    Ender Sai Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2001
    No. Not even on page one.
     
    Ender Sai, Oct 3, 2015
    #82
  8. DarthPhilosopher

    DarthPhilosopher Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 23, 2011
    Must have missed that then Ender. Man you and Lord Vivec are grumpy old men. Cheer up.
     
    DarthPhilosopher, Oct 3, 2015
    #83
  9. Lord Vivec

    Lord Vivec Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Apr 17, 2006
    Word of advice. If you find everyone dealing with you being grumpy old men, they all have one thing in common.
     
    Lord Vivec, Oct 4, 2015
    #84
    Ender Sai likes this.
  10. Darth Punk

    Darth Punk JCC Manager star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2013
    penile erectile dysfunction
     
    Darth Punk , Oct 4, 2015
    #85
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  11. DarthPhilosopher

    DarthPhilosopher Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 23, 2011
    No, it's just you two. Everyone else moves on from previous disgreements.
     
    DarthPhilosopher, Oct 4, 2015
    #86
  12. Darth Punk

    Darth Punk JCC Manager star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Lawrence Wilkerson: The Travails of Empire

    Former US army colonel and Chief of Staff for Colin Powell, describes the path of empires in decline and shows how the US is following the classic trajectory
    tldr: murica is in deep trouble
     
    Darth Punk , Oct 5, 2015
    #87
  13. Master_Rebado

    Master_Rebado Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 31, 2004
    [​IMG]
     
    Master_Rebado, Oct 5, 2015
    #88
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  14. Darth Punk

    Darth Punk JCC Manager star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2013
    thank you for the aqueducts, and also for the latin proficient muricans
     
    Darth Punk , Oct 5, 2015
    #89
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  15. Rogue_Ten

    Rogue_Ten Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2002
    Interesting thing I learned yesterday... there have only been 4 currency hegemons (world reserve currencies) since the outbreak of capitalism: venetian ducat, dutch gilder, british pound, and us dollar. Which I thought was kinda interesting...
     
    Rogue_Ten, Oct 5, 2015
    #90
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  16. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    You don't count Spanish dollars? They weren't reserve currencies but they were pretty much accepted everywhere, I think bc of the reliable silver content.


    Missa ab iPhona mea est.
     
    GrandAdmiralJello , Oct 5, 2015
    #91
  17. Rogue_Ten

    Rogue_Ten Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2002
    I was listening to a lecture by an Argentinian economist and this was his assessment. He specifically said the iberian empires never quite achieved currency hegemony, in his estimation
     
    Rogue_Ten, Oct 5, 2015
    #92
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  18. Lord Vivec

    Lord Vivec Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Apr 17, 2006
    lol
     
    Lord Vivec, Oct 5, 2015
    #93
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  19. Mortimer Snerd

    Mortimer Snerd Force Ghost star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2012
    Ottoman. I like putting my feet up.
     
    Mortimer Snerd, Oct 5, 2015
    #94
  20. Rogue_Ten

    Rogue_Ten Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2002
    Basically he's talking about currencies that in their heyday were what everything in the global commodities markets were priced in.

    (Another fun tidbit is that apparently tea is still priced in pounds today and not dollars, because tradition lol)
     
    Rogue_Ten, Oct 5, 2015
    #95
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  21. Rogue_Ten

    Rogue_Ten Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2002
    GrandAdmiralJello btw someone named "Augustus Sol Invictus" (aurelian wannabe lmao) is running for senate in florida. also he's trying to start a civil war so i guess he's more elagabalus than aurelian :p
     
    Rogue_Ten, Oct 5, 2015
    #96
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  22. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    I really think it's unfair to compare Elagabalus to a Floridian. I mean, sure he practiced a crazy orgiastic cult but he had the good sense not to live in Florida.


    Missa ab iPhona mea est.
     
    GrandAdmiralJello , Oct 5, 2015
    #97
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  23. I Are The Internets

    I Are The Internets Shelf of Shame Host star 9 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    The British Empire of course!
     
    I Are The Internets, Oct 5, 2015
    #98
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  24. Rogue_Ten

    Rogue_Ten Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2002
    lol stfu, internets. maybe in terms of the "most effective use and entrenchment of racist ideology" or "naval power, i guess, periodically" sub-categories

    "most successful" is obviously rome, "military achievement" is probably mongols, and "impressive" is a toss up between mongols and rome. british dont even win "horrific" because mongols, imperial japan, spain, belgium, etc...

    i still think the criterion should be "blotting out the sun, irresistably, pants-****tingly 'imperial'", which, the mongols might not have held it together as long as some but they definitely hit the all-time peak of that

    GrandAdmiralJello best and worst roman emperors, pre-split. go.

    EDIT #32: also, i love how the pro-british itt are so proud of their ability to hide on their island periodically when they would otherwise get the **** kicked out of them. real "imperial", guys
     
    Rogue_Ten, Oct 5, 2015
    #99
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  25. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    Best is kind of.... typical? Augustus, Claudius, Vespasian, Trajan, Hadrian (despite himself) -- actually this is dull, let's have some fun.

    I'll add Domitian to the list, who -- though an egomaniac and a tyrant -- was very effective as a ruler and presided over some excellent (but second-tier)literature to boot.

    I'll pointedly not include Aurelius because he's overrated and his use of the hereditary principle unforgivable. And I'll snatch Hadrian off the list because -- despite his architectural triumphs which I greatly admire -- he was a bit of a tyrant himself. Why do I let Domitian get away with it? Because Domitian had some method to his tyranny and did as best he could with the principate he inherited, while Hadrian jailed senators out of ineptitude despite being allegedly the best man for the job.

    The worst?

    Tiberius, Caligula, Nero: for demolishing the patriciate, destroying the Julian House, and generally messing up Augustus's quasi-republican system. Thankfully the Flavians and Antonines fixed things up.

    But those are obvious, as are the barracks emperors (some of whom were decent like Aurelian or the Gordians or Claudius Gothicus etc).

    So I'll fire shots across the bow of supposed "greats" and add Severus, Diocletian, and Constantine to my list of worsts. All for their military dictatorship, orientalism, and the degradation of the city-state system of government that was the lifeblood of the Empire.

    You can see my senatorial bias :p


    Missa ab iPhona mea est.
     
    GrandAdmiralJello , Oct 5, 2015
    #100
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